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  1. #61
    From my character´s view, he's been through so many instances where teamwork and burying the hatchet has been the way forward, and continued strife is not worth it at all, just causes more problems. Now that Sylvanus is being a massive twat about things, and predicting it, he grabbed the last ticket out and defected with the now void-elves (because prev. blood elf).

    Nvm that being the leader of a neutral faction tends to form connections regardless of original allegiance, and Farstriders being fairly chill...my dude is mainly neutral, but squarely against Sylvanas, sooo...Alliance it is for him.

    Sortof the same for my DH, but since demons are his schtick, he doesn´t really care that much and doesn´t want to get involved outside of whim and keeping in shape. Rogue...would play along to keep up appearences but would try to sabotage if possible. My druid would defect so fast it ain´t funny. She don´t take that shit.

    Can you tell that I was a horde player up until recent predicament?

    ...almost feel guilty for having personal headcanons now...thanks internet forum...

  2. #62
    Immortal Schattenlied's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fenderxx View Post
    Even though this was the story of Cata, I take it as cannon that these issues were not resolved and the Horde/Alliance still contest these areas to the present day.
    What you take as canon and what is actually canon are not the same thing... Your headcanon cannot be used to justify anything. The Alliance does not still contest those areas, because the port from which they did so no longer exists.
    2) Azerite: Sylvanas is correct in saying that this will change everything. Both factions will be able to strike terrible blows to the other once the secrets of this new material are unlocked. This suggests the best strategy would be to strike first and fast to secure trade routes to control the flow of Azerite.
    All this does is guarantee that the other faction will use that resource against you... This is how you create a self fulfilling prophecy.

    3) Sylvanas rallies the Horde to secure Kalimdor for the Horde and Horde alone.
    Actually she did it for herself under the guise of doing it for the Horde.

    and the alliance attempting to move into our land.
    You mean the non-canon thing that isn't actually happening?
    this is not a pleasant move.. but it is needed. If we wait, the Alliance will recover, they have a young inexperienced King, who is untested.. If you believe the Horde/Alliance cannot co-exist (or at least not in the same area) then War will happen, and this is the best and necessary time for the Horde to do so.
    No, no it's not needed... This is the necessary time to sue for peace... Right now the Alliance has the single most anti-war leader it has ever had in the history of Warcraft, there has never been a time where peace was more likely to be possible.

    4) The goal is to strike fast, and push the Night elves out. Sylvanas says to march on the tree and kill Malfurian. As a Horde Champion this again, is not pleasant, but would end this conflict quickly. The Horde can secure its borders, control Azerite trade routes, and turn a struggling people into a proper national power that will last generations. I am behind the Warchief 100% here. Malfurian is not evil or bad.. but this will take the fight out of the night elves and lead to a quick resolution in the horde’s favor.
    This really is not a justification for war.
    A gun is like a parachute. If you need one, and don’t have one, you’ll probably never need one again.

  3. #63
    I was mad when saurfang didn't follow orders. He needs to be linched

  4. #64
    Quote Originally Posted by Reyuna View Post
    Nice sum up. You're right to point out that Teldrassil may have actually been evacuated well before-hand (Sylvannas may have even known this fact). The Horde need to get an iron grip on Kalimdor and that means Teldrassil had to go.

    I am almost certain that the fight at the Undercity is just a false showing of force and it will be heavily booby trapped to maximise damage to the Alliance forces.

    The Alliance are inherently racist and do not want to co-exist with peoples that differ too much from them and their ideals.

    Off topic, but especially as a Blood Elf player myself, does Silvermoon just go into full on turtle mode now? It will be completely isolated and I don't see how it couldn't be taken at some point.
    The Sunwell being back in business is probably a massive source of protection.
    So long as we don't get another traitor elf sabotaging everything. (Drathir 2.0)

    They could probably bubble up in a way, similar to Suramar.

    The only way to access them is through a choke point by land, or you have to attack primarily by sea.

  5. #65
    Quote Originally Posted by Sixnalia View Post
    The Sunwell being back in business is probably a massive source of protection.
    So long as we don't get another traitor elf sabotaging everything. (Drathir 2.0)

    They could probably bubble up in a way, similar to Suramar.

    The only way to access them is through a choke point by land, or you have to attack primarily by sea.
    Or air. There are a looot of flying opportunities. Stealth is kinda shot there though.

  6. #66
    Quote Originally Posted by Windirmere View Post
    I was mad when saurfang didn't follow orders. He needs to be linched
    Taking out Malfurion would have been a huge victory for the horde, better than burning down the tree.

  7. #67
    Quote Originally Posted by Halyon View Post
    Or air. There are a looot of flying opportunities. Stealth is kinda shot there though.
    I'm just imagining some kind of Sunwell shock shield. Like a bug zapper maybe.

  8. #68
    Quote Originally Posted by Spiffums View Post
    There are no Civilians in Warcraft. Is not pretty much every vendor and person in a town besides the kids flagged on the old PVP servers?
    genius. that gnome baker was pvp flagged she's practically a warrior

  9. #69
    @Schattenlied

    I feel that no matter what you do, you have to use some head cannon, because of the way games work. For example, it's been 5-6 years in game since Cata... so what has happened? That conflict was not resolved in the game. Do I just assume that we worked it out over some beers and are buddy-buddy with the Alliance in the Barrens? So I believe we have to fill in some gaps in the story that are logical, and though you may disagree, I feel that conflict is not yet resolved to the affect that even if they are not at all-out-war, there are still most likely border skirmishes between the factions during this time. I feel this is a logical and safe assumption.

    Also just a reminder, that I am viewing this through a characters eyes. He has never meet Anduin, and does not know what a good leader he is, though I as a player like him.. my character is Horde. Same goes for Sylvanas, we the players know more about her motivations then say a general or commander would. So just keep that in mind.

    Also I would note that "Striking first to prevent a threat" has been used to justify war many times in history. Not everyone buys into it, and country/faction on the defending side will always point to the other as the aggressor, but this is not an unheard of occurrence in war.
    Last edited by Fenderxx; 2018-08-01 at 11:38 PM.

  10. #70
    Ok, ok I refuse to believe that Sylvanas is being set up as Garrosh 2.0. Surely Blizz can't be that boring right? However, I don't know how you could possibly redeem the burning of that tree without some serious punishment. Unless...

    What if Sylvanas is under duress??? What if she knows something that we don't know and she HAD to burn the tree in order for some other world saving event to occur. What if this is linked to the deal she struck with Helya that we, the players, are in the dark of.

    How does Azshara, the final warbringer, tie into this crap.

    What if M Night Shamylon is actually writing this instead of Golden and the twist of a life time is heading our way.

  11. #71
    Quote Originally Posted by Sixnalia View Post
    I'm just imagining some kind of Sunwell shock shield. Like a bug zapper maybe.
    That would be kindof hilarious to see tbh...for us I mean. Terrifying to the character. xD

  12. #72
    Quote Originally Posted by Reyuna View Post
    You're right to point out that Teldrassil may have actually been evacuated well before-hand (Sylvannas may have even known this fact). The Horde need to get an iron grip on Kalimdor and that means Teldrassil had to go.
    IE, mass genocide against innocent people is okay because Teldrissal was probably evacuated already.

    Quote Originally Posted by Reyuna View Post
    The Alliance are inherently racist and do not want to co-exist with peoples that differ too much from them and their ideals.
    The void elves wanted to let you know that they said "Hi."

    Void elves obviously embody all of the ideals of the Alliance and are in no way different from them. Meanwhile, the blood elves would never exile their own people for pursuing void magic while their very warchief is an undead elf who will use any means to succeed.

    I'll respond to the main post later, but this particular response caught my attention and I had to comment.

    - - - Updated - - -

    I'll add a general response though, that too many people are trying to "justify" Sylvanas and defend her actions. Her actions are not defendable. She regularly commits atrocities without regret (and should I add, without provocation). Accept her for what she is instead of trying to sugarcoat it and you'll feel a lot better.

  13. #73
    Pandaren Monk Melsiren's Avatar
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    If Kerrigan who killed millions if not billions, and infested countless can be redeemed (even if the writing was horrible) Slyvanas can be, the two already have enough pararells as it is and I often considered Slyvanas to he the Kerrigan of Warcraft.

    Or she could become raid boss my giving a crap kinda are spent on the warcraft story.
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  14. #74
    Quote Originally Posted by Ralqadar View Post
    If Kerrigan who killed millions if not billions, and infested countless can be redeemed (even if the writing was horrible) Slyvanas can be, the two already have enough pararells as it is and I often considered Slyvanas to he the Kerrigan of Warcraft.

    Or she could become raid boss my giving a crap kinda are spent on the warcraft story.
    Was she redeemed? I just sort of remember people not being as mad at her because she helped save them from the universe starting over or something?

  15. #75
    Immortal Schattenlied's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fenderxx View Post
    [MENTION=663526]
    For example, it's been 5-6 years in game since Cata... so what has happened? That conflict was not resolved in the game.
    It was resolved when SOO happened, that war is over.

    Do I just assume that we worked it out over some beers and are buddy-buddy with the Alliance in the Barrens?
    The port the Alliance were coming from got mana bombed, the Alliance are not there anymore.
    A gun is like a parachute. If you need one, and don’t have one, you’ll probably never need one again.

  16. #76
    Nice post.

    I don't get why so many people are acting up.
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  17. #77
    Immortal Schattenlied's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ralqadar View Post
    If Kerrigan who killed millions if not billions, and infested countless can be redeemed (even if the writing was horrible) Slyvanas can be, the two already have enough pararells as it is and I often considered Slyvanas to he the Kerrigan of Warcraft.

    Or she could become raid boss my giving a crap kinda are spent on the warcraft story.
    Kerrigan could be redeemed because she was, for all intents and purposes, being mind controlled, still being controlled by the directives the Overmind gave her before it was killed. Hence why as soon as she was "cured" in WoL her personality and attitude immediately changed back to that of a reasonable human being.

    Sylvanas is not being controlled... At most her affliction with undeath destroying her sense of empathy, hampering her ability to properly feel emotion is what is to blame, but that's not something that can be cured far as we know... For all intents and purposes her "condition"(undeath) has made her mentally unwell, a sociopath with severe narcissistic personality disorder.
    Last edited by Schattenlied; 2018-08-02 at 12:45 AM.
    A gun is like a parachute. If you need one, and don’t have one, you’ll probably never need one again.

  18. #78
    The Patient J012D4N's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by roahn the warlock View Post
    It would be in Anduin's best interest to take Silvermoon and hold it.
    It's doable, as the 1st Elf gate wasn't a problem for Arthas. BUT they could only conqure Silvermoon if Ban'dinoriel isn't restored by then.
    The Sunwell is now active again, wasn't until the end of TBC & they have one crystal. Could easily make the other two, again.
    At that point, you'd have to starve them out & try to block supplies.

    Quote Originally Posted by Halyon View Post
    Or air. There are a looot of flying opportunities. Stealth is kinda shot there though.
    Ban'dinoriel is a bubble, that covered Silvermoon & the immediate surrounding of Quel'Thalas. I BELIEVE it would now cover the Isle of Quel'Danas, make sense based on how big it use to be.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sixnalia View Post
    The Sunwell being back in business is probably a massive source of protection.
    So long as we don't get another traitor elf sabotaging everything. (Drathir 2.0)

    They could probably bubble up in a way, similar to Suramar.

    The only way to access them is through a choke point by land, or you have to attack primarily by sea.
    Exactly, they do have a "bubble" capability. Which could now be active (it's been years, so probably).
    Could see the Void Elves sabotage the well in some way.

  19. #79
    The Insane Syegfryed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Windirmere View Post
    I was mad when saurfang didn't follow orders. He needs to be linched
    tfw you don't know how sylvanas herself didn't follow orders as well when others were warchief

  20. #80
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    I disagree with burning the tree, but I'm willing to go along with the war despite not being a big fan. The Alliance wants blood way before Teldrassil, and saying "I disagree" won't sate their bloodlust.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Schattenlied View Post
    What you take as canon and what is actually canon are not the same thing... Your headcanon cannot be used to justify anything. The Alliance does not still contest those areas, because the port from which they did so no longer exists.
    Where was this attitude when you claimed that Genn knew what Sylvanas was up to in Stormheim?

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