So Jaina is more powerful than Thalyssra - for real blizz?

[LazarusLong]

didn't we kill that elisande chick in the second tier of legion?

super mad powerful

thalyssra isn't shit. what's wrong, junkie? sylvannas hiding the magic pills from you?

ah yes, just a simple group of adventurers wielding the most powerful weapons in the universe including monstrosities like Scepter of Sargeras.

[Aeula]

Human potential. Not much can compare so long as Blizzard has their favorites.

[LazarusLong]

The most powerful Mage that ever lived in the Warcraft universe is probably the Titan Norgannon.

True, but Titans are not mortals. Demigods are on another level.

[Kwento]

We don't have orcs and elves playing this game :P

And that’s the stand that Blizzard seemed to take, but it’s ridiculous! Because we choose any race, not only humans and while in this RPG game we identify with that particular race. We want them to succeed, grow and show amazing results of their training\history\knowledge and everything else, but instead we are shown Varian-like assholes sucking every bit of air in this lore.

[steelballfc]

I think I finaly get it, Alliance has to compensate their tactical ineptitude with superheroes.

damn you superman

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I'm done with Thalyssra, give us Elisande, and nerf humans.

it's not possible

[Magical Mudcrab]

Their addiction to Nightwell is gone.
But once again, I’m noy saying that I refuse to accept lore as it is. I just refuse to stay silent on a stupod point that discards experience.

It's not the addiction that I'm referring to.

Imagine you have to move boxes from the first floor of a building onto the second. Initially, you have a pully system that you can use to lift said boxes to the second floor and them go up the stairs and unload them. One day you find your pully system broken, but still need to get those boxes up the stairs. You cannot use the pully system, so you carry them up manually. You sometimes do it as a group in order to lessen the work required, but it's still more work than you previously had to do.

That's what I'm saying. The Nightborne have, for over 10,000 years, have supplemented their own power with that of the mana from the Nightwell or from the latent mana in their environment. They likely find it incredibly difficult to sustain the same kind of magical ability as before, as they no longer have this external implement to augment their own abilities.

[Deleted]

Blizzard just seem to love humans and make them stronger than they have any right to be. Anduin is my favourite example in that I don't understand why the other alliance races would follow a child.

[BreathTaker]

Let's just assume Thalyssra understood that a battle of 2 powerfull mages could result in a crater the size of Stormwind and nobody of the crew would manage to escape, thus "RUN!"

Now let's moove along the story, shall we?

[Avengerx]

So wait, when night elves who are also supposed to be very old and experienced - experts in forest warfare etc - get totally owned in their very own zones is fine, but 1 horde side elf say "Let's run" and it's unfair? What?

[Kwento]

It's not the addiction that I'm referring to.

Imagine you have to move boxes from the first floor of a building onto the second. Initially, you have a pully system that you can use to lift said boxes to the second floor and them go up the stairs and unload them. One day you find your pully system broken, but still need to get those boxes up the stairs. You cannot use the pully system, so you carry them up manually. You sometimes do it as a group in order to lessen the work required, but it's still more work than you previously had to do.

That's what I'm saying. The Nightborne have, for over 10,000 years, have supplemented their own power with that of the mana from the Nightwell or from the latent mana in their environment. They likely find it incredibly difficult to sustain the same kind of magical ability as before, as they no longer have this external implement to augment their own abilities.

Wasn’t that also an issue with the Blood elves after they lost their Well? I thought that was connected specifically to their addiction to arcane.
If what you are saying is confirmed in official lore, I might change my mind.

[Strawberry]

Most powerful mages in WC Universe was and is Highborn and Eredar.

Actually Aegwynn.

[Airlick]

I think I finaly get it, Alliance has to compensate their tactical ineptitude with superheroes.

Well, it's not even about shit writing, it's just that the choice of dual faction system forces Blizzard to write down the Alliance, which should lorewise have massive advantages in every department, from numbers, tactics and technology all the way to its superheroes being far stronger than whatever the Horde has or had (with the exception of pre-WoD Thrall). But since they can't just have Alliance bitchslap the Horde every time it backstabs them, they have to write the Alliance as utterly incompetent. If we had Warcraft 4 and there was any faction conflict, Nelves alone (in the state they were in after Hyjal) would have roflstomped the Horde from that time. But then dual faction system happened.

[LazarusLong]

Actually Aegwynn.

Aegwynn with only her power wasn't all that special. And even as Guardian, she was weaker than her son. Or Archimonde.

[Gen4Glock21]

A few things we are forgetting.
1. The Alliance got stomped at the Darkshore and the Horde torched their tree.
2. Slyvanas set a trap for the Alliance and came very close to wiping their leadership out, if for not the OP Jania and to a lesser extent Aleria showing up at the right times. If you had played the scenario you would of seen the goblins setting explosives through out the Undercity before you even go topside. It was planned!
3. The Horde caught the Alliance again with their pants down and broke into the stockades and broke out two allies and in the process of escaping burnt down half of Stormwind.

The Alliance really needs Jania's god mode to even survive let alone beat the Horde atm.

[Blackmist]

Where is Thalyssra's magical flying boat with pink laser cannons?

Checkmate, motherfuckers.

Also, if Jaina has that boat, easily capable of breaching heavily defended fortifications like the Undercity, why aren't we using all the fucking time?

[Biomega]

It's the usual trap of fantasy storytelling. All the most powerful/most important characters tend to be human, because the authors somehow assume you can't identify with anything that isn't human. Humans are "our side" in those stories, and you always want to see your side win.

If they didn't deus-ex-machina humans at every turn, they'd have little realistic chance. They're physically at a disadvantage compared to most other races. Several other races live a lot longer. Without the power of "human potential" to pull out of a bag, they would never be able to go toe to toe with anyone. What could a human with 10, 20 years of experience fighting ever do against an elf who's been fighting for millennia? What can a human do against a 10'/600lb orc coming down on them like a freight train?

It gets real funny when you look at it from the other side, though. What does a 10,000-year old elven magister think when they see some human girl surpass them in magical prowess? "Wait... am I just retarded or something?" What does a tauren think if they charge at some tiny human full speed and get stopped in their tracks? "So, uh... what exactly is all my muscle for?"

It's utterly ridiculous when you really think about it, but that's where the suspension of disbelief comes in, I suppose. Personally, I think we could do with some more realism in that respect, and to be fair, SOME fantasy stories do address that. But even those that try often fall back into old tropes.

[Deleted]

10000 years that were spent living in a city, doing the same crap everyday. The strongest mages in Warcraft lore have always been humans, Aegwynn, Medivh, Antonidas, Rhonin, Jaina, Khadgar, Nielas Aran, the whole council of six. Deal with it.

Forgot Kel'thuzad.

We had Kael'thas though, and Azshara.

The whole "human potential" thing is so annoying.

[steelballfc]

no body mentioned kael'thas

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We had Kael'thas though, and Azshara.

The whole "human potential" thing is so annoying.

regardless, it's true.

[Alixie]

Maybe if she traveled the world, collecting power ups, and practicing her magic in real world combat like Jaina - instead of withering away in a stagnant biodome - Thalyssra might have been more than just another crackelf.

[Haven]

10000 years of experience of chilling under the magic barrier, safe from everyone ...

How about experiencing the freaking War of Ancients? You know, the first coming of the Legion?