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  1. #21
    The Unstoppable Force Arrashi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheRagebear View Post
    Only because he was exiled. You really think he wouldn't be using those powers for the Horde if Silvermoon hadn't sent him away? At best I can say he's a little quick to turn.
    Being deranged and incapable of critical thinking doesn't excuse him.

  2. #22
    The Unstoppable Force Friendlyimmolation's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheRagebear View Post
    Only because he was exiled. You really think he wouldn't be using those powers for the Horde if Silvermoon hadn't sent him away? At best I can say he's a little quick to turn.
    no one can hurt Quel'thalas if no one is left alive in Quel'thalas to hurt.
    Quote Originally Posted by WoWKnight65 View Post
    That's same excuse from you and so many others on this website and your right some of threads do bully high elf fans to a point where they might end up losing their minds to a point of a mass shooting.
    Holy shit lol

  3. #23
    The Unstoppable Force Lorgar Aurelian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arrashi View Post
    He literally betrayed his country and actively works against it with its enemy. So yes, he is much worse than sylvanas.

    He is as morally grey as Ephialtes.
    Turning against people who exiled you is worse then torture murder and messing with people’s souls?

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by TheRagebear View Post
    Only because he was exiled. You really think he wouldn't be using those powers for the Horde if Silvermoon hadn't sent him away? At best I can say he's a little quick to turn.
    He's actually very pro-Alliance and believes it's the Elves destiny to be with them again. I think the Void told him that...
    BASIC CAMPFIRE for WARCHIEF UK Prime Minister!

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by TheRagebear View Post
    "Perfectly lawful good."

    As they're throwing people into the void, roasting goblin miners with lava elementals, and muh Stormheim.

    Are they really lawful good or does the Horde just whine every time they do something remotely veering away from that and assume it's out of character?
    Stormheim was only mentioned all of one time and hastily brushed over every other time and the time this happened and was actually treated as valid motive was in a product not written by Golden or Danuser. The intended portrayal of the Alliance is lawful good, it's just that the writing is tone deaf. One quest after you fling those diplomats into the void, Wyrmbane bemoans the senseless loss of life. But not that one, that of the actual combatants that attack him, which he spares the leader of.

    I would be glad if they weren't always lawful good, but that's pretty much the core trait. Even Jaina and Genn, who are the closest there are to having some aggressive posture ditch their warlike positions immediately. Jaina and Katherine realize Daelin was wrong, even though he isn't and they have no reason to believe he was with the Horde being what it is and Genn is more a kindly grandfather than the guy who attacked Sylvanas in Stormheim. Tyrande and the night elves, who have the most reason to be vengeful, don't even appear.

    @Daemos daemonium

    If he's intended to be a dumbass who doesn't get what he's doing then they've succeeded, but I'm not sure that's the aim.

    @Niaraa

    He goes on some spiel about wealth inequality and slaughters what are primarily golfers and serving staff. Which, in the sense that there's less poor people around once he's done, is successful.
    Dickmann's Law: As a discussion on the Lore forums becomes longer, the probability of the topic derailing to become about Sylvanas approaches 1.

    Tinkers will be the next Class confirmed.

  6. #26
    The Unstoppable Force Arrashi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daemos daemonium View Post
    Turning against people who exiled you is worse then torture murder and messing with people’s souls?
    People who exiled you for a very good reason. And yes, it is worse.

  7. #27
    The Unstoppable Force Lorgar Aurelian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Super Dickmann View Post
    If he's intended to be a dumbass who doesn't get what he's doing then they've succeeded, but I'm not sure that's the aim.
    I can’t think of any other way he’s ever portrayed if he’s not meant to be a bumbling moron then I have no idea what he’s meant to be as he fails at pretty much any other category.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by DeicideUH View Post
    I also liked the previous chapter, with the blood elves. I like Umbric. He uses things that I consider morally dubious at best (sending people into the Void seems to be a horrific thing, but we don't get to know what happens to those characters after being banished. Is the banishment permanent? Do they die? Do they stay suffering forever? We don't know.), and yet his motivations make he feel like a genuine good guy. Moral grayness, Alliance style.
    So very Alliance way to describe their hypocrisy. Not aiming to debate you or anything, it's just the opinion I have of the Alliance so I found phrasing here amusing.

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Super Dickmann View Post
    If he's intended to be a dumbass who doesn't get what he's doing then they've succeeded, but I'm not sure that's the aim..

    well so i don't feel that in the alliance quest. he look like a good person who really want to integrate in the alliance, forgive Sin'dorei but are happy to be part of the alliance because he dont want the void to fall in horde hand. but we need some dumbass and evil character in the alliance i am sick of all this "good" side. my hope is in dark iron hands!

  10. #30
    The Unstoppable Force Lorgar Aurelian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arrashi View Post
    People who exiled you for a very good reason. And yes, it is worse.
    The exile was for a good reason ya but turning on people who exile you is in no way worse then murdering/torturing your own people and inflicting what you your self see as torment on them.

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Viconia View Post
    So very Alliance way to describe their hypocrisy. Not aiming to debate you or anything, it's just the opinion I have of the Alliance so I found phrasing here amusing.
    Like I said in the other thread, it's not hypocrisy when the Horde has escalated the conflict to a point where civilian deaths are legitimate military tactics.

  12. #32
    The Unstoppable Force Arrashi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daemos daemonium View Post
    The exile was for a good reason ya but turning on people who exile you is in no way worse then murdering/torturing your own people and inflicting what you your self see as torment on them.
    Actually it is. Sylvanas may have low work ethic, but umbric is nothing but deranged traitor.

  13. #33
    So the whole BE population going horde because they met one asshole sergent is completely fine, but one exiled and pretty death sentenced going against the horde is fine?
    MMO-Champion, once the place to get WoW News, now the home of the haters and their clickbait and doomsaying threads

  14. #34
    Deleted
    Every represented race did their thing in their own way, while working towards the common goal. Which is something that Alliance fans wanted to see for a long time. IMO it was much better than the pointlessly edgy Horde version.

  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Super Dickmann View Post
    Stormheim was only mentioned all of one time and hastily brushed over every other time and the time this happened and was actually treated as valid motive was in a product not written by Golden or Danuser. The intended portrayal of the Alliance is lawful good, it's just that the writing is tone deaf. One quest after you fling those diplomats into the void, Wyrmbane bemoans the senseless loss of life. But not that one, that of the actual combatants that attack him, which he spares the leader of.

    I would be glad if they weren't always lawful good, but that's pretty much the core trait. Even Jaina and Genn, who are the closest there are to having some aggressive posture ditch their warlike positions immediately. Jaina and Katherine realize Daelin was wrong, even though he isn't and they have no reason to believe he was with the Horde being what it is and Genn is more a kindly grandfather than the guy who attacked Sylvanas in Stormheim. Tyrande and the night elves, who have the most reason to be vengeful, don't even appear.

    @Daemos daemonium

    If he's intended to be a dumbass who doesn't get what he's doing then they've succeeded, but I'm not sure that's the aim.

    @Niaraa

    He goes on some spiel about wealth inequality and slaughters what are primarily golfers and serving staff. Which, in the sense that there's less poor people around once he's done, is successful.
    Stormheim was a significant portion of the reason why Saurfant went along with Sylvanas' invasion of night elf lands. He knew that Genn instigated the attack during the legion invasion and was never punished for it, and admited that the implications were troubling. This was in A Good War when he was debating this with Sylvanas.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by johnyderp View Post
    Every represented race did their thing in their own way, while working towards the common goal. Which is something that Alliance fans wanted to see for a long time. IMO it was much better than the pointlessly edgy Horde version.
    Yeah, and even Keeshan who's an overt Rambo reference at least doesn't steal attention away from the other characters.

    I wonder which version of Burning Steppes is canon...did Chronicles 3 specify if it was him or Eitrigg that canonically undermined the dark horde army there in Cata?

  16. #36
    The Unstoppable Force Lorgar Aurelian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arrashi View Post
    Actually it is. Sylvanas may have low work ethic, but umbric is nothing but deranged traitor.
    Sad that a deranged traitor is still better then the warcheif.

  17. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Zequill View Post
    So the whole BE population going horde because they met one asshole sergent is completely fine, but one exiled and pretty death sentenced going against the horde is fine?
    no you see it's different because the blood elves didn't go against the government of their people, prince kael'thas. they continued to loyally serve their government and not attempt to overthrow or oppose...

    hold on a moment im being handed a piece of paper by the lore gnomes...

    oh...

    oh no...

  18. #38
    The Unstoppable Force Friendlyimmolation's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chief Bennett View Post
    ironic you call him deranged when he showed more compassion for those at Gallywix's pleasure palace than any Horde member has
    Because a lunatic void wielder screaming about the poor while sending people into the void is anything but sane.
    Quote Originally Posted by WoWKnight65 View Post
    That's same excuse from you and so many others on this website and your right some of threads do bully high elf fans to a point where they might end up losing their minds to a point of a mass shooting.
    Holy shit lol

  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by TheRagebear View Post
    Only because he was exiled. You really think he wouldn't be using those powers for the Horde if Silvermoon hadn't sent him away? At best I can say he's a little quick to turn.
    He proved his exilers right though, by picking up Dar'Khan's teachings right off the bat.
    Quote Originally Posted by Thunderaan View Post
    All it takes is an incel at the wrong place wrong time and we won't even know what hit us.

  20. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by Chief Bennett View Post
    ironic you call him deranged when he showed more compassion for those at Gallywix's pleasure palace than any Horde member has
    The people he had us kill because of his rage against income inequality?

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