[EU] Brexit negotiations at a standstill

[Fuiking]

Oh of course I bet you would like to do that. Anything to deflect from the reality of who and why the EU benefits Germany above and at the expense of all others.

How about doing the decent thing for once and admitting the EU fucked up royally. Can't bring yourself to do that?

Just as the Greeks forgave you war reparations when your country made a little historical "mistake", twice, how about a little benevolence for your fellow eurochums and being a little less harsh on them? It is not like they have slaughtered millions of innocent people, they just took what appeared to be almost free money from stupid EU banks unwisely offering loans when they shouldn't have. Now they are enslaved to German/EU banks liable for interest payments they can never make to the destruction of their country.

https://www.express.co.uk/finance/ci...t-IMF-eurozone

Have some empathy man, at another point in time you could and would of been them for much much worse than inadvertently maxxing the credit card. Or is it just a one way street? It seems that way doesn't it.

Are you that daft mr Dribbles? You claim that germany benefits from the EU above all others, that might be true? but you know why? You've seen the sacrifices they had to make to do that? German wages have not risen for longer then anyone, welfare neither, and they had to pump Billions into East-Germany, and seeing im not a sour asshole, like you appear to be, I allow them to have the benefits of the EU, on the other hand....

...Do you know why Greece, Italy and Spain are deep in the shit financial wise? High corruption, a rather lax attitude towards taxation of there populace, that we had to step in, and send them loans, but those loans dont come for cheap, we want something back: Tax reforms, the ''lazy'' attitude else we can keep dumping money into those shitholes.

On the interest payments of the EU: Better that then a complete economic collapse like Turkey is experiencing at the moment, Im not sure if you'd like having a bunch of Wall Street assholes being happy they can pillage your broke country, that was another reason for the bailout.

And being little harsh on them? Something they've done themselves? Never, otherwise we'd have to safe them in 10-15 years again.

And im tired of your stabs at Germany for there ''mistakes'', they've paid more then enough for that.

Then again, lecturing you about history and geopolitical processes is the same about teaching a mule to read.

[Noradin]

That's unfair, the UK at least has regulation and restrictions on corporate governance and they amped it up after the crisis while the US have been deregulating for decades.

I'm sure those are the first to go if there is no deal.

[Crispin]

Are you that daft mr Dribbles? You claim that germany benefits from the EU above all others, that might be true? but you know why? You've seen the sacrifices they had to make to do that? German wages have not risen for longer then anyone, welfare neither, and they had to pump Billions into East-Germany, and seeing im not a sour asshole, like you appear to be, I allow them to have the benefits of the EU, on the other hand....

...Do you know why Greece, Italy and Spain are deep in the shit financial wise? High corruption, a rather lax attitude towards taxation of there populace, that we had to step in, and send them loans, but those loans dont come for cheap, we want something back: Tax reforms, the ''lazy'' attitude else we can keep dumping money into those shitholes.

On the interest payments of the EU: Better that then a complete economic collapse like Turkey is experiencing at the moment, Im not sure if you'd like having a bunch of Wall Street assholes being happy they can pillage your broke country, that was another reason for the bailout.

And being little harsh on them? Something they've done themselves? Never, otherwise we'd have to safe them in 10-15 years again.

And im tired of your stabs at Germany for there ''mistakes'', they've paid more then enough for that.

Then again, lecturing you about history and geopolitical processes is the same about teaching a mule to read.

Ignore him, he's honestly the most ignorant poster you'll meet on this forum. For some reason he loves to blame the EU for the bad economies and somehow manages to make it anything but because of the EU that the strong economies are strong. The guy thinks that it's 1904 and the British Empire is still around.

[Slant]

Oh of course I bet you would like to do that. Anything to deflect from the reality of who and why the EU benefits Germany above and at the expense of all others.

How about doing the decent thing for once and admitting the EU fucked up royally. Can't bring yourself to do that?

Just as the Greeks forgave you war reparations when your country made a little historical "mistake", twice, how about a little benevolence for your fellow eurochums and being a little less harsh on them? It is not like they have slaughtered millions of innocent people, they just took what appeared to be almost free money from stupid EU banks unwisely offering loans when they shouldn't have. Now they are enslaved to German/EU banks liable for interest payments they can never make to the destruction of their country.

https://www.express.co.uk/finance/ci...t-IMF-eurozone

Have some empathy man, at another point in time you could and would of been them for much much worse than inadvertently maxxing the credit card. Or is it just a one way street? It seems that way doesn't it.

You're cute. First you post meaningless stock charts out of context. When I provide context, you whinge that I only talk about Germany, because that destroys your argument. When I ask if you'd like to be compared to a cherry picked example that would show the UK in a better light, you pretend like I was the one whinging about the Germany comparison. You're just a bit nationalist crybaby, aren't you. Whinge, whinge, winge. I'm beginning to think you're not even British. I haven't ever seen a Brit whinge like you do.

Empathy? Yeah, we can do that. That's why we took over a million refugees from Greece when they needed our help. Your myth that Germany is exploiting everyone else is cute, and I'm sure it makes sense in your nationalist head, but reality is quite different. Especially, because the EU is a democratic institution and Germany doesn't call the shots alone. Nobody is enslaved. The Greek still have control over themselves. How they spend it, is their own choice. Largely. Their country isn't being destroyed. It's recovering. Slowly, sure. But they have another chance at least. Germany isn't the IMF, by the way.

You're a pathetic boy, really... that you even make these whinge posts still... have some pride man. :P

- - - Updated - - -

I would not be so sure. The independent governors, audit committee requirement, all those things add up. For one, they make a large class of investors and specialists very rich in the City for doing nothing and they would fight to keep that privilege. It also create trust in the UK financial system to be able to hold, trust that will be necessary the day after passporting is lost and everyone will be waiting for the shoe to drop.
Now if the Tories are really stupid, greedy and/or corrupt enough to sell the UK wholesale to the US, then yes, you will deregulate.

British politicians as a group don't seem to be too bright to begin with. Whenever problems in the US swap over to Europe, it seems to go through the UK. And let's not forget that little scam the British Banks initiated with Deutsche Bank, I believe. If you want to find corruption in European high banking, look to England. They are just as filthy as Wall Street.

[caervek]

Are you that daft mr Dribbles? You claim that germany benefits from the EU above all others, that might be true? but you know why? You've seen the sacrifices they had to make to do that? German wages have not risen for longer then anyone, welfare neither, and they had to pump Billions into East-Germany, and seeing im not a sour asshole, like you appear to be, I allow them to have the benefits of the EU

In all fairness, they did get West Germany fixed for free post WW2 so it's not like they got left with a shorter straw than anyone else by having to fix East Germany, all of the major European countries had to fix themselves after WW2. In fact you could argue that they got a better deal because even though the GDR was in a right state when the wall fell it was better than the smouldering ruins most countries had to rebuild.

Then of course there's the added bonus that the USA/UK/etc decided to write off all of Germany's WW2 debt when it reunified, even debt that wasn't theres. I'm sure given their financial state Greece would love to have Germany finally pay what they owe lol.

[Slant]

In all fairness, they did get West Germany fixed for free post WW2 so it's not like they got left with a shorter straw than anyone else by having to fix East Germany, all of the major European countries had to fix themselves after WW2. In fact you could argue that they got a better deal because even though the GDR was in a right state when the wall fell it was better than the smouldering ruins most countries had to rebuild.

Then of course there's the added bonus that the USA/UK/etc decided to write off all of Germany's WW2 debt when it reunified, even debt that wasn't theres. I'm sure given their financial state Greece would love to have Germany finally pay what they owe lol.

We'll see how much they actually pay, once they start paying. I'm fairly certain they won't have to pay the full amount. This is still 10 years down the road.

We're aware of the support West Germany got. Mind you, the allied forces didn't do that out of altruism. It wasn't a freebie because they pitied us, it was a pragmatic solution to a mistake that was made after WW1, when harsh reparations provided fertile soil for Hitler's victim story. And we let the US and Russia use Germany as their personal agent playground in return, too. Dragging the GDR out of 40 years of mismanagement was quite the feat, too. We had to literally propell them forward about 20 years in progress. Not sure how to compare that to smouldering ruins, but we're still paying for it every month out of our wages. So I'll say, from a very personal point of view, we're still not done financing that adventure. And while we do that, they take money out of our literal wallet and pay for Greece, too. And refugees.

That's the source of this sub debate, and I'll not have some people come into this thread and tell me I'm profitting from any of it. I'm not complaining, but have the decency to not say I exploit people in Greek by throwing my tax money at them.

[Slant]

Just to clarify, I am not saying anyone is exploiting Greece. But they are profiting from this. Simply at lesser rates than they could profit from investing elsewhere but still everything is repaid with interest. There is nothing wrong with that, money has value and Greece has to pay for that additional value.

I'm not attacking you, I'm attacking Dribbles who thinks he has to defend the Greeks from evil Germany. I mean, whatever the fuck we do, we can't do it right for some people. The only way to get banks to do anything is to promise profit. Sure, but the majority of the money Greece gets is from tax money, really. I don't even care about a return. I just want to see Greece do well. Or at least better than before.

What I don't want to hear is someone in this thread going "Oh yeah, corruption? Worse than before... and the civil service sector grew even bigger!" That's not what I paid for. I paid for reforms and change, not more of the same shit that got Greece into trouble in the first place.

[dribbles]

Are you that daft mr Dribbles? You claim that germany benefits from the EU above all others, that might be true? but you know why? You've seen the sacrifices they had to make to do that? German wages have not risen for longer then anyone, welfare neither, and they had to pump Billions into East-Germany, and seeing im not a sour asshole, like you appear to be, I allow them to have the benefits of the EU, on the other hand....

...Do you know why Greece, Italy and Spain are deep in the shit financial wise? High corruption, a rather lax attitude towards taxation of there populace, that we had to step in, and send them loans, but those loans dont come for cheap, we want something back: Tax reforms, the ''lazy'' attitude else we can keep dumping money into those shitholes.

On the interest payments of the EU: Better that then a complete economic collapse like Turkey is experiencing at the moment, Im not sure if you'd like having a bunch of Wall Street assholes being happy they can pillage your broke country, that was another reason for the bailout.

And being little harsh on them? Something they've done themselves? Never, otherwise we'd have to safe them in 10-15 years again.

And im tired of your stabs at Germany for there ''mistakes'', they've paid more then enough for that.

Then again, lecturing you about history and geopolitical processes is the same about teaching a mule to read.

And there we have the admission - you think all the mediterranean countries are shithole countries that the Germans have to pay for? Like honestly, do you own those countries now because of your money like some toilet you have to clean up?

And Slant and Crispin think that being called Baltic is an insult presumably because of the assumption it refers incorrectly to the Baltic States? Are they shithole countries too?

What about the troublesome Visegrade lot? They shitholes too?

Am I feeling the eurochum all in it unified together love here? Or is it now verboten to call out the master race that subsidises their great EU?

Or is it blatently obvious as I allege that the EU benefits the Germans at the expense of all others? Rebuilding their great new Reich off the blood, sweat, labour and tears of the rest of the EU, or as they refer to them, shithole countries.

Well some friendly advice from the UK, one shithole country to another, be brave and GTFO of the EU whilst you still can.

[Slant]

And there we have the admission - you think all the mediterranean countries are shithole countries that the Germans have to pay for? Like honestly, do you own those countries now because of your money like some toilet you have to clean up?

And Slant and Crispin think that being called Baltic is an insult presumably because of the assumption it refers incorrectly to the Baltic States? Are they shithole countries too?

What about the troublesome Visegrade lot? They shitholes too?

Am I feeling the eurochum all in it unified together love here? Or is it now verboten to call out the master race that subsidises their great EU?

Or is it blatently obvious as I allege that the EU benefits the Germans at the expense of all others? Rebuilding their great new Reich off the blood, sweat, labour and tears of the rest of the EU, or as they refer to them, shithole countries.

Well some friendly advice from the UK, one shithole country to another, be brave and GTFO of the EU whilst you still can.

Nope, you're lying. What I said is that somehow you seem to think it's an insult. Otherwise you wouldn't keep on riding the train to rile Crispin up with it. But keep on trying to mislead. But feel free to quote me. Eventually I won't pay attention and you'll get that one lie in that nobody opposes. You just keep trying, buddy.

Twisting words, inventing lies. It's all you do. And it's pathetic.

[dribbles]

Nope, you're lying. What I said is that somehow you seem to think it's an insult. Otherwise you wouldn't keep on riding the train to rile Crispin up with it. But keep on trying to mislead. But feel free to quote me. Eventually I won't pay attention and you'll get that one lie in that nobody opposes. You just keep trying, buddy.

Twisting words, inventing lies. It's all you do. And it's pathetic.

Lies? Nah facts but the truth hurts so much you won't accept it.

Greece has become a protectorate of the dominant powers of the Eurozone, which behave as though in conquered territory.

Which Western European banks lend so massively to the Greek private sector?
They are mainly Hypo Real Estate (Ger.), [3] BNP Paribas (Fr.), Société Générale (Fr.),
the Crédit Agricole (Fr.), BPCE (Fr.), Commerzbank (Ger.), [4] Deutsche Bank (Ger.), Royal Bank of Scotland (UK), [5] ING (NL),
RaboBank (NL), Intesa SanPaolo (Italy), Unicredit (Italy), Dexia (Belg.), [6] KBC (Belg.), KA Finanz (Austria) and Erste Bank (Austria)


http://www.cadtm.org/The-Troika-s-Po...e-the-money-to

Look what your beloved EU regulated banks have done, you and the EU have no shame.

[Edge-]

https://twitter.com/JimMFelton/statu...50878182514688

So this appears to be from the Daily Mail. And if we're taking that seriously, it sounds like truck drivers get to enjoy the brand new feature that will be roadside toilets for when they're stuck waiting to get through border checks.

This continues to sound like it's all thoroughly well planned and going swimmingly.

[Slant]

What a circus.

[Breccia]

This continues to sound like it's all thoroughly well planned and going swimmingly.

Shh! No time for that! Theresa May is trying to downplay the departure's effect by saying, well, it won't be the end of the world.

May’s comments appeared to cast doubt on recent statements by Britain’s Chancellor of the Exchequer Philip Hammond, who warned that the country would be forced to borrow over $100 billion if it doesn’t reach a deal with the EU, a scenario that would lead to an inevitable economic stagnation. May instead invoked the recent statements from World Trade Organization Director-General Roberto Azevedo, who suggested that a no-deal scenario would not necessarily be catastrophic.

“What the government is doing is putting in place the preparation such that if we are in that situation, we can make a success of it, just as we can make a success of a good deal,” May told reporters at the launch of a three-day trip across Africa.

The U.K. will officially leave the EU on March 29, 2019, and it is looking increasingly likely that the country will be forced to leave without a deal in place. On Thursday, the government published 25 contingency plans, known as “technical notices,” to warn businesses about how to cope with Brexit in the case an agreement is not reached. Every industry, from airlines to pharmaceuticals, will be impacted by the change—and almost all will see a rise in costs.

Goods entering the U.K. from Europe would need import declarations and customs checks, and London will need to begin preparing its own food labels, among a litany of other new procedural requirements. Questions remain about cross-border data sharing and whether the U.K. will still have access to the official EU judicial database. Many have warned that the country is unprepared to deal with the technical challenges and requirements that will arise when Britain leaves the EU.

May set out terms for a Brexit deal in July, but it is unclear whether Brussels will accept her plan, which calls for free trade of goods but not of services, and for strict regulations on immigration. EU officials have complained that the proposal the U.K. put forward is “a nonstarter.”

Despite the uncertainty, however, people in Britain appear to be taking the situation in stride.

“If the public really thinks that in eight months’ time Britain is going to be plunged into the economic equivalent of a nuclear winter, the economy will take a serious hit,” Larry Elliot, the economics editor for The Guardian’s U.K. edition, wrote in an op-ed. “So far, though, people seem relatively relaxed and haven’t spent the bank holiday weekend stripping supermarket shelves of baked beans and bottled water.”

Bolded for stuff I'm sure these 420 pages have taken a hit from.

Red text for, damn, how British is that phrasing?

No worries, UK. Trust me when I say the USA can't criticize your life choices.

[Mayhem]

Shh! No time for that! Theresa May is trying to downplay the departure's effect by saying, well, it won't be the end of the world.



Bolded for stuff I'm sure these 420 pages have taken a hit from.

Red text for, damn, how British is that phrasing?

No worries, UK. Trust me when I say the USA can't criticize your life choices.

I especially like the last sentence of the guardians op-ed.

[Slant]

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/b...-a8516206.html

So, Panasonic is moving its "HQ" to Amsterdam. Not that dramatic, only half of the 30 people sitting in London, probably. But still made the headlines. This is after the known banks and other businesses moving parts of their operations to mainland Europe as a direct response to Brexit. Good for us, I'd say.

[dribbles]

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/b...-a8516206.html

So, Panasonic is moving its "HQ" to Amsterdam. Not that dramatic, only half of the 30 people sitting in London, probably. But still made the headlines. This is after the known banks and other businesses moving parts of their operations to mainland Europe as a direct response to Brexit. Good for us, I'd say.

Clutching at straws, how desperate.

Meanwhile back in the real world :-

"Britain remains the top destination for foreign investment in the whole of Europe - with London still the number one city despite warnings that a Leave vote would deter foreign investors, the report estimates a record number of jobs were created last year as a result of new money pouring in.

The annual Global Trends report by tech giant IBM says London remains the number one city globally for direct foreign investment (FDI). Manchester, Liverpool and Birmingham also saw growth and are in the top 20 globally, according to the report."

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...nt-Europe.html

Bad for you I'd say.

As the once upon a time fairy tale crescendo whine of the remainers whimpers and dies, all that is left is the cold hard facts as they mourn those wasted tissues and tears.

[Kallisto]

Back with real news. Not Daily Mail crazytown

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-45389610

TL : DR again Chequers is still dead and the only options are not leave, norway or we're all fucked.

[ranzino]

deadline is mid-November, but that's it. ~11 weeks sound much, but UK will have to move earlier.

[Slant]

Nothing will happen. The UK is still convinced that the EU is bluffing. As long as they don't realise that the real EU isn't the one from their fantasy, May won't have a reason to change her attitude. She'll continue hoping for a miracle in the last second and waste time not looking for realistic solutions.

[NED funded]

Your disconnect with reality is total. I never expected to say this but Dribbles, how old are you even? Your lack of knowledge about Greece, and who is to blame for Greeces Austerity Programs tells me that either you lived under a rock, or your like 17....


For Greece's austerity problems, and here I tend to agree on anti - EU people, thats its harsh but the option otherwise was a complete collapse of many banks (Bank of England etc etc) due to a cascading failure of banks to keep coverage over many of there services, the only thing you could blame the EU for is that they should have taken action far sooner, if you saw Greeces folk sport of tax evasion and corruption you would have expected them to take earlier action, alas however that never happened and heres the result of it: Nasty austerity measures, mostly on greeks on fault.

And you know who wanted extremely harsh austerity measures on the Greeks? wasnt Germans, nor French, nor Austrians, but it was the dutch actually.

EU nations couldve just bailed their banks internally and let investors burn or not. The idea that the money had to be extorted to greece is nonsense. The USA did it during the 08 crisis without incurring to massive austerity, quite the contrary we had boosting plans.

EU apologists bother me