The attitude of the Nightborne

[Khaza-R]

So,I was running the island expedition and in one of them I encountered the opposite team,consisting of the nightborne. Now,what made me wonder were the things they were yelling when they encountered us,such as "lowborn scum". We got used to them saying such things,when they were under Elisande's rule,but now,they are a part of the Horde. My main is a night elf,but I highly doubt,that they shouted these things specifically because my character was a kaldorei,so I think,that they consider everyone but themselves as the lowborn. Where am I going with this?

I wonder,how can they be a part of the Horde,consisting of way more exotic races than the Alliance and actually swallow their pride and be allied with "low races"? Do they think,that they are far more greater than the rest of the Horde (well,they might see themselves on par with the sin'dorei)? The elves are known for their arrogance,but this is a brand new level of it. They also mentioned something about them being the highborne,which makes me think,that they think of themselves as of those highborne,who were fiercely loyal to Azshara.

Its completely plausible that those loyal to Elisandre rejoined with the rebels after the destruction of the Nightwell. I would imagine they would really have no where else to turn. So I think we would see some pretty diverse attitudes within the Nightborne. Even racist ones.

[Beloren]

Its completely plausible that those loyal to Elisandre rejoined with the rebels after the destruction of the Nightwell. I would imagine they would really have no where else to turn. So I think we would see some pretty diverse attitudes within the Nightborne. Even racist ones.

Ofc it is plausible, where else would they go? And Elisande, did turn and help the cause of the rebels, so they would have too. And yes you would have pretty diverse attitudes, agreed.

I really feel blizzard should separate the nightfallen rebels and the Elisande loyalists, the former should join up with the alliance after the War of the Thorns (turn them into kaldorei by the druids or elune accelerating the effects of the Arcan'dor) and Thalyssra should go with them. It's not that I hate Thalyssra, but she doesn't fit the horde, and they'd either have to do gymanastics with her character, cheapening the lore again, or do gymnastics with the horde again further homogenizing them into white knights. THe horde are survivalists, not necessarily eveil, but they do what they must, it is exactly what the blood elves became that the naive high elves couldn't adapt. Thalyssra is more the white knight type. Let her go, and let us have a stronger more powerful leader

Bring Elisande back, her echo must still be about, that should be a start, The horde are lacking seriously powerful characters and Elisande fits the bill perfectly. Plus she turned to our side as well as her remaining guards, sort of like the blood elves turned from the demonic path too, we really fit. Elisande would never have run away from Jaina too in the opening BFA scene.

this way blizzard can write more drama, the alliance can get the nightborne they always wanted ...but in kaldorei form (hahaha) it is 2 birds with one stone. Gone will be the alliance cries of "we both saved Suramar etc" they'd have nightborne, just not how they thought, they could leave the arcane runes on their night elven forms to distinguish them a little from non-nightborne kaldorei, and the horde gets a powerful new racial leader and nightborne that fit us.

I really am tired of blizzard not taking care to do things like this properly, they did this with the night elves in classic, rather than make only the younger ones join the alliance and the older ones stay neutral, they made teh whole race join and never explained it well. It's like someone upstairs said- you have to give the horde the nightborne, and rather than write it well they just went, ah well, here you go, nightboren - if they look at the nightborne closer, it is easy to see some nightborne really fit the horde, and some fit the kaldorei.

Some of the nightborne are bat shit crazy over their kaldorei superiority, they want to save and defend the world, they put right causes above all else, even though it may mean their people suffer or have to die, others are the exact opposite, the world is there to be owend, progress, survival these are all paramount over ethics and tehy will do what they must even make a deal with the devil they hate to get to survive while plotting to destroy said devil and be free of it, because afterall, it's not like they like evil, they don't, they just do what is necessary. That is the horde.

THe horde would have made a deal with the legion to buy enough time to survive and execute a plan that factored it in a plot to overthrow them completely. The alliance would have gone, no way, we will fight to the death if we must, but we will never tolerate such evil or compromise with it, life is to sacred blah blah blah.


See where I am going?

[Alanar]

Tyrande is afraid of change, one of the two elves that uprooted their peoples' way of thinking after a great catastrophe is afraid of change while the one that stuck with the arcane for 10,000 years under a literal bubble is able to adapt. I don't want to say you're wrong, buuuuut...

I just think shes weak thats all

[Shadowtwili]

Tyrande is afraid of change, one of the two elves that uprooted their peoples' way of thinking after a great catastrophe is afraid of change while the one that stuck with the arcane for 10,000 years under a literal bubble is able to adapt. I don't want to say you're wrong, buuuuut...

When has Tyrande shown to be afraid of change? She willingly worked with the mortal races after the Long Vigil, she allowed the Highborne back into the fold, lifting the ban on the usage of arcane magic, she works together with (heretical?) Light worshippers, joining their Alliance and she even supplies soldiers to their shared "alliance army", she opened up the elven World Tree for human/worgen refugees and she allowed worgen to join the Sentinel Army.

[Beloren]

When has Tyrande shown to be afraid of change? She willingly worked with the mortal races after the Long Vigil, she allowed the Highborne back into the fold, lifting the ban on the usage of arcane magic, she works together with (heretical?) Light worshippers, joining their Alliance and she even supplies soldiers to their shared "alliance army", she opened up the elven World Tree for human/worgen refugees and she allowed worgen to join the Sentinel Army.

Tyrande is definitely not afraid of change, even I know that. Weak argument or the argument of a person that doesn't know his lore, so when Thalyssra says something like that he automatically interpretes it as Tyrande is afraid of change., I'm a hordie and even I know that.


Anyway, I'\m not satisfied with the nightborne currently, they need more work to properly bring them into the horde, atm, i don't know which nightborne we have. The nightfallen resistance of 7.0 does not appear or seem horde like at all, not in the slightest, the nightborne npcs of Suramar, the Elisande loyalists, they seem very horde like.

so after Thalyssra takes a step to the horde, what ahppens then? does she have a character flip? do all those night fallen become like the elisande loyalsists? what is their character? ARe they the white knights they were in 7.0? or the arrogant city folk of the npcs? The nightfallen rebellion is a different beast to the rest of the city.


The nightfallenrbellioin are like the kaldorei which they were, remembering their "noble" i.e. whit knight heritage, and basically finding humility in their world falling a part (withering and the legion), the Elisande loyalists are not, they embrace the change that had to be made for their people, they are not afraid of exploiting, capitalizing on what they have, moving forward - i.e. dominating and doing whatever it takes to survive. Nightfallen aren't like that.

As I said in the other 2 posts i made in this topic, blizzard should take the nightfallen over to the Alliance, have the fruit of the arcan'dor turn them to kaldorei because they are celarly like them, and they are the only nightborne that expressed a love for their night elven roots - look at the guy in Tel'Anor, look at what Valtrois says about the kaldorei their, loook at how kaldorei Thalyssra sounds in 7.0, she works with a druid valewalker, rescues moonguard Elisadne woudl rather destroy, shelteres refugees who are kaldorei - this is not a woman that would sanction genocide against the kaldorei or view it as @Survial@ - so my solution, give them to the alliance but change them to kaldorei, so we keep the proper nightborne and possibly find a way to restore Elisande from her echo who was powerful enough to grant as access to the night well.

[sillag]

nightborne on the horde will forever be one of the most ridiculous things blizzard have done to the lore. they just don't fit. i don't care what tyrande said about who's mom. the aesthetic clashes too hard. the horde are the downtrodden underdogs rising up against the world that oppressed them. nightborne literally live in the lap of complete and absolute luxury. even blood elves actually went through some shit especially with the humans, whatever side you come down on with garithos it happened.

nightborne got a bit sick but then ate some magic fruit and were wholly cured of the affliction that gave their lives an interesting conflict. they lost none of their city and everyone who withered a bit was immediately turned back to normal by eating a blue pear. fuck off blizzard seriously. the nightfallen should have stayed nightfallen. that allied race would have looked a lot cooler than the wide-eyed semi-nelves they gave us.

[codeGnave]

nightborne on the horde will forever be one of the most ridiculous things blizzard have done to the lore. they just don't fit. i don't care what tyrande said about who's mom. the aesthetic clashes too hard. the horde are the downtrodden underdogs rising up against the world that oppressed them. nightborne literally live in the lap of complete and absolute luxury. even blood elves actually went through some shit especially with the humans, whatever side you come down on with garithos it happened.

nightborne got a bit sick but then ate some magic fruit and were wholly cured of the affliction that gave their lives an interesting conflict. they lost none of their city and everyone who withered a bit was immediately turned back to normal by eating a blue pear. fuck off blizzard seriously. the nightfallen should have stayed nightfallen. that allied race would have looked a lot cooler than the wide-eyed semi-nelves they gave us.

A large portion of their society sided with the legion and killed and sold another large portion to the legion soul engines...
We SAW them kicked around and ruined in real time.
I would have preferred they go alliance myself, but if your criteria for horde membership is past hardship, the, i think the nb fit fine.

Also, those who fully withered are gone for good. They are, as persons, dead when you get down to it.

[Ielenia]

There's also the fact that they are now working alongside the Lightforged, what should in theory be their arch nemesis given that they are polar opposites of the cosmic scale, but this is not seemingly explored in much detail in terms of rationale. But this is probably a matter for a different thread.

Why should they be arch-enemies? The Void Elves don't follow the void.

[Combatbutler]

Why should they be arch-enemies? The Void Elves don't follow the void.

They are tainted by it though and the Lighforged should view them with at least disgust as a consequence. Mingling with the void was after not even remotely acceptable in the army of the light.

[Ielenia]

They are tainted by it though and the Lighforged should view them with at least disgust as a consequence. Mingling with the void was after not even remotely acceptable in the army of the light.

It wasn't in X'era's eyes only. I don't recall Alleria having any sort of issue with the other Lightbound Draenei around the Vindicaar or anywhere else on Argus.

[Combatbutler]

It wasn't in X'era's eyes only. I don't recall Alleria having any sort of issue with the other Lightbound Draenei around the Vindicaar or anywhere else on Argus.

Because it was their former comrade, having dozens of void tainted elves running around embracing it, should by all means ruffle their feathers. It is enough for the ordinary light worshipers to be spooked and telling them they have no place in their cathedral for example. The light forged follow the one true path, they outright tell you that in their intro. Light and the void are enemies on that path it is just that simple.

[Ielenia]

Because it was their former comrade, having dozens of void tainted elves running around embracing it, should by all means ruffle their feathers. It is enough for the ordinary light worshipers to be spooked and telling them they have no place in their cathedral for example. The light forged follow the one true path, they outright tell you that in their intro. Light and the void are enemies on that path it is just that simple.

Yeah. Alleria is their comrade. Therefore they know that just because you're void-touched it doesn't mean you're automatically their mortal enemy.

[Deleted]

All Horde members have no morals or integrity.

They're evil, arrogant, sell outs, one and all......even (sadly) the Tauren.

hahahahaha, you must be an alliance troll, secret race.

[Beloren]

How did this become about void elves anyway?

Given how the nightborne are Suramar night elves like the alliance night elves and their heroes it is really surprising that blizzard took all of this group over to our side. For some reason it isn’t sitting well with me at all. I would expect Thalyssra’s nightborne to be far more sympathetic and relate better to Tyrande and her bunch. This fits with everything we are shown in 7.0.

The nightborne we fight in the city, not the felborne, but the loyalists following Elisande, they fit our mindset better. They don’t like the demons but are in line because they trust Elisande has a plan. While Elisande takes that step as a means to save her people, she doesn’t hesitate once we defeat her to assist us, as we prove to her we have what it takes and she is no lover of the legion.

Elisande fits us like a glove, Thalyssra doesn’t. Elisande and her loyalists are nightborne who sided with evil for a good reason but got redeemed turning from that path and helping g the right side. They aren’t white knights like Thalyssra and they would do anything to ensure survival and they respect strength, not necessarily compassion or justice.

Blizzard made a mistake taking all the nightborne over to the horde, and they should fix it. Take Thalyssra and her lot over to the alliance. At this point I don’t care if they turn them to Kaldorei or give them part or all of Suramar, just as long as we get Elisande leading the nightborne and they write our future to reflect the strength of her character and the mastery of the nightborne.

I.e, We retake Suramar if we lose it or we create something even better with the blood elves, like a new elven empire on Kalimdor with the Well of Eternity in the hands of the nightborne. I actually wouldn’t mind that if blizzard was good at using assets they create Sadly given how Elune, the Well of Eternity, the Vindicaar, the Sunwell, even the magic of the Emerald dream and. world trees are grossly under utilised.

Can you imagine comic book writers failing to employ those assets? How many incredible stories concerning magical races like Elves, Draenei, Trolls could be told outside our expansion adventures that could see a lot of stuff happening?

I wonder if they don’t do these things because they don’t want to update the game world? A decision I don’t understand becauseAzeroth in game continents exist at fixed periods, as long as they make this clear to players that when they return to Orgrimmar or Kalimdor / Eastern Kingdoms, they are in a past iteration, they technically only need to update them if they visit these zones again - which they can do as an actual expansion. Return to Azeroth or they do it a few zones at a time throughout 1-2 expansions like BFA requiring activity in various zones.

[Deleted]

hahahahaha, you must be an alliance troll, secret race.

Am I wrong? The Horde are actively fighting for an evil, genocidal psychopath.

[ravenmoon]

the group that appears on the island and you can also see in zuldazar have a title <the highborne>

I recognize that inside night elves there is also highborne even if it is a very small group. but the reality is that the night elves abandoned the highborne culture.

the only ones who can say that they are true highborne are the sindorei and shaldorei


clearly the shaldorei could only feel at home in quelthalas!

The sin'dorei do not regard themselves as highborne in this current generation, but they recognise their highborne ancestory. Think of it this way: part of becoming high elves was creating a new identity of highborne that was not tied to the corrupt failings of the past, remember they were part of the most loathed of highborne, the Zin Azshari palace ones who were summoning the demons, and they get exiled because the druids wouldn't believe them that even arcane magic could be used responsibly, because they were the famous reckless highborne, so quel'dorei in Thalassian translates to High Elf, not highborne, it is a slight difference to a night elf, but not to a thalassian elf , they are elves Rhlor, they are particular about details. Highborne is a kaldorei/night elf thinh, they want nothing to do with that, or as littke to do with that as possiblem so they change as much as they can, it reminds me of Americans and Brits, thouh largely a British speaking English colony, Americans did try to be as different as they could from the brits they wanted independence from. Americans refuse to change their English to UK English and rejected the ways and culture of the crown, even though the two communities were similar, they both had cities, and governments, progressed in science (arcane), post civil war America was a very different society to Britain.

Again, some of the Nightborne are highborne, not all of them, if the ones on the island have the title highborne, then they are highborne, but not all nightborne are highborne.

Finally, there are several kaldorei cultures, you shouldn't say, because you think the shen'dralar are few, therefore it is accurate to say that the kaldorei abandoned their culture. There are 4 groups that carry on the arcane culture of the pre-sundering night elves - 4 Chloe, one of them works closely with the long vigil kaldorei who are now in a post vigil culture, and whose numbers are very very few now, the other 3 are the nightborne, the Moonguard and the Farondis highborne ghosts.

You have to stop thinking of night elves as forest elves and that their distinction from horde elves is that they follow nature. You have been shown they have arcane groups, they have a huge priesthood culture, and several eras operating, they are not a simple race, as you would expect for a people that have existed for nearly 15,000 years and have achieved what no others have.

This is not ESP or NWN, or DnD, Warcraft elves are not split into nature and arcane or forest and city, the lore is a lot more detailed and developed. The Thalassian culture is an entire culture of its own, as are the night elven cultures. In wow, each elven race is it's own fully fledged and diverse people's, with several facets, cultures and groups. The dark elves of wow, the night elves have forestry druids, heavy arcane highborne and nightborne, religious devoted priests and and feisty Amazonian warrior hunter females, wardens, demon hunters, they span multiple zones and a variety of cultures and traditions where they worj together in various ways, some are heavily intertwined, others are nearly independent of each other, as you would expect of a world with different groups and peoples who have been around a long timr, making them come alive as a proper people, and making them unique and original in a way other fantasies have failed to do for elves.

The nightborne, like the highborne, like Azshara, like the kaldorei empire, like the Moonguard and like the Illidari demon hunters are all part of that night elf world, which also includes the forestry druids, walking trees, the priests and Elune, the moonwells and the very much arcane Well of Eternity.

They may share similarities with shaman, blood elves high elves, tauren, trolls, unread and touch divers parts of the other world in various ways but they are definitely their own world, night world of elves and are thus unique in this Kaldorei underpinning to them all, the stars and moon focus, Elunem the Well of Eternity and love for nature. Yes did you not notice that Suramar has a lot more nature than Silvermoon and that druids care as much about the arcane well of eternity and priests the arcane moonwell s as the mages.

They have their own thing, you must re-orientate your interpretation of them to fit the larger scope to them that you are shown, rather than trying to fit them into boxes created by other fantasies.

[Mehrunes]

u wat mate? When did Thalyssra do any of this? lol

Tyrande was right to be skeptical of the Nightborne seeing as their reaction to the first invasion was to hide. Being salty is one thing, being so salty you burn down someone's house is just sad.

U wat mate? When did @Kallisto say Thalyssra did it single-handedly? The people of Suramar did. That was their reaction to the first invasion. Them hiding? That was their reaction to the army Legion sent to destroy Suramar in retaliation. Because they had no strength to take on it by themselves. And the only one to help them was Ashamane. One Wild God. No Tyrande and her army. Not even Tyrande and her moral high ground.

If you go by VO Nathanos is a traitor to the Horde, because he constantly cheers you on for doing WQs on Kul Tiras that HELP the local population.

The general VO of this expansion (the one used repeatedly and randomly) is bad. It's just bad. There is no more to it, really.

It's almost as if the Horde was trying to get more of a foothold on Kul Tiras. Nathanos even complains the Horde couldn't get some of the rares to use against their enemies and had to put them down instead.

"They're just like the BElves guys!" Yes, we're well aware that it's the Sunwell story recycled, and the BElves cheapened. Nightborne were a huge effort:
- previews before Legion launched
- an entire zone and a gorgeous city
- endgame focused around them with a massive, fully voice acted campaign
- a huge story that played out over months
- a raid dedicated to their story

Void Elves were a lazy asspull:
- a brief "Alleria moneyshot" cinematic
- Alleria had a few quests sprinkled throughout the greater Argus effort
- story was completely overshadowed by the Argus effort (no attempt to pull it together like how the Nightborne/Gul'Dan story was a huge part of the Legion arc)
- a recycled "floating rock" zone
- not even present until after Legion was over

The general sentiment, including outside the people who care about the story, is "Of course the Horde got Nightborne, Blizz actually put effort into them."

And since all of that effort was not Horde content because they joined the Horde only later on, this entire notion is a gigantic pile of BS. Also, try to not equate the general sentiment of the player-base with the inane conspiracy theory of MUH HORDE BIAS the more special part of the Alliance players believe in. That's a projection on your part.

For the insult on top of injury, Hordies cried their eyes out that the 7.0 end game story was about "night elves" (finally getting a story that wasn't the Horde slapping them around to look tough) after three expansions focused in some way on the Horde and yet they get the reward, for an incredibly lame story reason.

First of all, the complaints were about Val'sharah and being forced to quest with Tyrande and Malfurion. Nightborne aren't even Night Elves. And the notion that the previous three expansions focused on the Horde is just more of that brilliant MUH HORDE BIAS conspiracy theory mentioned above. Cata and MoP were about Alliance-Horde war. Alliance-Horde war gotta have Alliance in it, not just the Horde. Otherwise it'd be Horde war. On top of that, Deathwing was a much larger focus of Cata. Then there's WoD, which isn't about the playable Horde whatsoever.

Cata: Garrosh and the Horde (bonus points for the entire world blessing Goel's marriage after a long quest chain with Aggra grunting and snarling the whole way)

MoP: Garrosh and the Horde

WoD: The Horde chases Garrosh and deals with an earlier, alternate Horde. Alliance suffers Yrel's voice acting.

7.0: OMG IT'S NOT ABOUT THE HORDE?!

Apparently Garrosh and the Horde existed in a vacuum despite their Cata/MoP story revolving around their war against some mysterious, unnamed and merely hypothetically existing faction. And, also apparently, only the Horde chased Garrosh and dealt with the Iron Horde. Fascinating.

Why should they be arch-enemies? The Void Elves don't follow the void.

Alleria was imprisoned by them for 500 years for dabbling with the Void, long before she applied a negative camera filter to herself. And unlike the other Void Elves, she can turn that off. And is the wife of their leader. And contributed to Antorus campaign.

Fair enough, a portion of the Horde cast them out. What were they supposed to do, go hang out with the orcs and fight a war alongside the elves that exiled them?

"Oh... this is awkward. How's exile treating you?"

"How do you think?"

The point is, and was, that people within the Horde overreacted and threw away a potential weapon. Okay, so the void messed with the Sunwell. And nothing bad has ever come of people wielding fel energies? Or locks summoning demons? Or even from wielding 'normal' magic?

All this stuff is dangerous. To single out Void energy as the one line not to be crossed, that moment of nopenopenope, was silly IMO.

Except Void is not just a potential threat to the Sunwell, it's an actual threat to the Sunwell. Alleria proved it. And she's supposed to have the greatest control over the whispers. Yet she acted like a moth in front of a bonfire right there. Yeah, sure, bad things happened because of Fel or Arcane. But this is whataboutism. Void is a threat to the thing the one thing the entire Blood Elven society relies on. Arcane isn't, the Sunwell is made of it. Fel isn't, Kil'Jaeden took a bath in it and it's still working. As such, it is indeed that one line not to be crossed in Silvermoon.

To claim (implicitly, in your case) special pleading one has to prove that the challenged exception to the rule is not justified. And in this case, you can't do that. Because the exception is justified and the story proves that.

Also, Baine exiled some Tauren from Thunder Bluff because he's an Alliance sympathizer and they wanted revenge for Taurajo. Nothing has been mentioned about those Tauen leaving the Horde, let alone jumping ship to Alliance to fight their homeland they supposedly cared so much about.

The Lightforged are, themselves, weaponized to an extent. It makes sense to me that they'd be more tolerant of other magics being used as a weapon against the enemy. And remember, the Void is what the Legion feared most, and you know what they say... the enemy of my enemy, is my friend.

And yet they imprisoned Alleria for half a millennium for merely dabbling with the Void, long before she actually infused herself with it. Unless you want to claim they just went overzealous on "keep your friends close".

[Ielenia]

And yet they imprisoned Alleria for half a millennium for merely dabbling with the Void, long before she actually infused herself with it. Unless you want to claim they just went overzealous on "keep your friends close".

Actually X'era imprisoned Alleria. The Lightforged draenei just followed her orders. Notice the complete lack of any type of animosity whatsoever in the Vindicaar or anywhere else in Argus toward Alleria from the Lightforged draenei.

[Rhlor]

The sin'dorei do not regard themselves as highborne in this current generation, but they recognise their highborne ancestory. Think of it this way: part of becoming high elves was creating a new identity of highborne that was not tied to the corrupt failings of the past, remember they were part of the most loathed of highborne, the Zin Azshari palace ones who were summoning the demons, and they get exiled because the druids wouldn't believe them that even arcane magic could be used responsibly, because they were the famous reckless highborne, so quel'dorei in Thalassian translates to High Elf, not highborne, it is a slight difference to a night elf, but not to a thalassian elf , they are elves Rhlor, they are particular about details. Highborne is a kaldorei/night elf thinh, they want nothing to do with that, or as littke to do with that as possiblem so they change as much as they can, it reminds me of Americans and Brits, thouh largely a British speaking English colony, Americans did try to be as different as they could from the brits they wanted independence from. Americans refuse to change their English to UK English and rejected the ways and culture of the crown, even though the two communities were similar, they both had cities, and governments, progressed in science (arcane), post civil war America was a very different society to Britain.

Again, some of the Nightborne are highborne, not all of them, if the ones on the island have the title highborne, then they are highborne, but not all nightborne are highborne.

Finally, there are several kaldorei cultures, you shouldn't say, because you think the shen'dralar are few, therefore it is accurate to say that the kaldorei abandoned their culture. There are 4 groups that carry on the arcane culture of the pre-sundering night elves - 4 Chloe, one of them works closely with the long vigil kaldorei who are now in a post vigil culture, and whose numbers are very very few now, the other 3 are the nightborne, the Moonguard and the Farondis highborne ghosts.

You have to stop thinking of night elves as forest elves and that their distinction from horde elves is that they follow nature. You have been shown they have arcane groups, they have a huge priesthood culture, and several eras operating, they are not a simple race, as you would expect for a people that have existed for nearly 15,000 years and have achieved what no others have.

This is not ESP or NWN, or DnD, Warcraft elves are not split into nature and arcane or forest and city, the lore is a lot more detailed and developed. The Thalassian culture is an entire culture of its own, as are the night elven cultures. In wow, each elven race is it's own fully fledged and diverse people's, with several facets, cultures and groups. The dark elves of wow, the night elves have forestry druids, heavy arcane highborne and nightborne, religious devoted priests and and feisty Amazonian warrior hunter females, wardens, demon hunters, they span multiple zones and a variety of cultures and traditions where they worj together in various ways, some are heavily intertwined, others are nearly independent of each other, as you would expect of a world with different groups and peoples who have been around a long timr, making them come alive as a proper people, and making them unique and original in a way other fantasies have failed to do for elves.

The nightborne, like the highborne, like Azshara, like the kaldorei empire, like the Moonguard and like the Illidari demon hunters are all part of that night elf world, which also includes the forestry druids, walking trees, the priests and Elune, the moonwells and the very much arcane Well of Eternity.

They may share similarities with shaman, blood elves high elves, tauren, trolls, unread and touch divers parts of the other world in various ways but they are definitely their own world, night world of elves and are thus unique in this Kaldorei underpinning to them all, the stars and moon focus, Elunem the Well of Eternity and love for nature. Yes did you not notice that Suramar has a lot more nature than Silvermoon and that druids care as much about the arcane well of eternity and priests the arcane moonwell s as the mages.

They have their own thing, you must re-orientate your interpretation of them to fit the larger scope to them that you are shown, rather than trying to fit them into boxes created by other fantasies.

did you read blood of the highborne? the name sin'dorei has two meanings, the first is for the blood of the fallen and the second is for the noble blood of the highborne.
those of highborne of dath'remar fought on the side of resistance, Dathremar saved a tyrande to die.

the playable night elf faction is different from moonguard (there are barely 3 survivors), the fantas of azsuna, Illidari (it's an independent blood / night elf faction), the shendrelar who joined the night elves led by tyrande and malfurion accept the rules where the use of arcane magic is limited.

[NutellaCrepe]

Is it cowardice and betrayal when you single handidly save azeroth by stopping the second (maybe even) bigger portal that was forming in the Tomb?

Or is it "Oh we can insult you all you like it means nothing get over it and kiss my arse." kind of thinking you have here.

Little hint about real life, diplomacy is a thing. Tyrande failed it from the first words she said to Thalysra, she failed it again by basically stating that Nightborne should die as meatshields for her.

Meanwhile Liadrin was diplomatic, helpful and extremely polite to the nightborne. If you had a choice between the two any sane person would have gone with Liadrin.

- - - Updated - - -



Of course not. Many of these people also cry about Blood Elves being in horde. It destroys the "Tolkein made it so these are all allies so all fantasies must have Elves, Humans and dwarfs vs Orcs, Trolls etc" POV they have.

Nah, the same way the rest of France dealt with Vichi after the occupation. "What do you have to say for your crimes?"

Liadrin's diplomacy was simply the easy way out. Instead of facing the wrongs you have committed, you just need to join whatever faction you haven't yet betrayed.