Why is the Horde prefered by those in it?

[Maljinwo]

Horde doesn't have humans in it. And isn't lead by anduin. These are all the reasons you need.

To be fair, we have humans. Sure, they are rotten and don't have elbows. But they are still humans.

Hell, the current Warchief is a Windrunner, the family that worship male human reproductive organs.

[Super Dickmann]

Most of Illidans evil has been retconned. And no matter what Both of them would choose the Alliance over the Horde. Especially Kayn.

No, it hasn't. All of the things I name took place in the Illidan book with the exception of the Eye of Sargeras which appeared in Chronicle and was thus also canonical. Hell, Altruis even references these events as his complaints, so clearly they happened. Kayn joining the Alliance is laughable considering he's both fully in support of all these things and a blood elf and thus not a viable person to enter. Let alone so he could have the privilege of waging war against his own race.

[Mehrunes]

Let's face facts here, the only reason Tauren and Blood Elves haven't told Sylvanas to go kick rocks and joined the Alliance is because of game play reasons, and Blizzard's lazy inability to shake things up and maintain the status quo. Blood Elves and Tauren would be more than welcome in the Alliance between the Cenarion Circle and Alleria alone. I say make sense of the story, put Tauren and Blood Elves in the Alliance and give Horde Ogres and Ethereals to compensate.

Because of Alleria alone? Alleria is not only a threat to the Sunwell and a traitor that came running to bask in Blanduin's light rather than come back to her people (if away from the Sunwell).

But why do you think he's an unrealistic doofus? Both the Horde and the Alliance have the same magic users and a lot to bond over. The only actual racial conflict is really convoluted and forced to make this expansion work. It's also the older characters, the ones with old grudges, that keep it going. The younger characters like Anduin and our dear zappy boy don't have those burdens.

Because even for Anduin all that talk about peace and sunshine is nothing more than empty platitudes he babbles about to hide his hypocrisy? If he was serious about peace he'd punish Genn for breaking that very peace and attacking the Warchief of the Horde while acting against Anduin's own orders.

But he didn't. Because Anduin's vision of peace is that of a world where all the Genns of the Alliance can rape the Horde in the ass with complete impunity while the Horde members only bend over and ask their human overlord to go even deeper.

And they don't even need to! Who on the Alliance has actually ever knelt to Anduin? I can't recall that ever happening. I'm not saying the Horde races should join the Alliance, but I am saying that there's more things we now have in common than ever before. That's further solidified when even Anduin seems to understand what Saurfang wants, andn Saurfang begrudgingly accepting it. Saurfang didn't even think this war made sense. This is all because Sylvanas is a petty, sour bitch.

Except Saurfang thought the opposite, because Sylvanas convinced him.

Who's free in the Horde? What freedom is there when you MUST obey or be KILLED? Nobody is a slave in the Alliance, they're all in it on their own volition and all races within the Alliance can choose to participate or choose not to. They're not forced to do anything.
Where does this notionn that the Horde is free and the Alliance is servitude come from? If anything, the Horde has ever been forced into slavish obedience, made to commit attrocities, made to fight wars they didn't want, and so on.

Where are you getting the notion that any disobedience in the Horde is punished by death from? Baine outright betrayed the Horde by conspiring with his human masters. Twice. He's still alive.

Worgen and Draenei are hardly any less alien and monstrous than Tauren. Undead sure, they're strange, but even in the latest book Anduin and others of the Alliance leadership see them in a different way.
Sylvanas is the one that perpetuates hatred. Sylvanas is the one that forces conflict.

The only other Alliance leader to comment on how he sees the undead in BtS was Genn. Who said he no longer sees the Forsaken as monstrosities that can't coexist with humans to the point of being unable to control their murderous rage when near them. Dat positive opinion. And when it comes to the Gathering, more than half of the humans approached by mail by the Forsaken attending it outright refused to even participate. In a meeting with people that weren't just random strangers but their close ones. Further humans rejected the Forsaken participating when the Gathering already began. Great attitudes towards the Forsaken right there.

[frogger237]

No, it hasn't. All of the things I name took place in the Illidan book with the exception of the Eye of Sargeras which appeared in Chronicle and was thus also canonical. Hell, Altruis even references these events as his complaints, so clearly they happened. Kayn joining the Alliance is laughable considering he's both fully in support of all these things and a blood elf and thus not a viable person to enter. Let alone so he could have the privilege of waging war against his own race.

Kayn values Illidan above all else. Sylvanas isn't committing evil acts for the greater good which is why he would be against her. And you seem to forget there are already 2 factions of blood elves in the Alliance already.

[Arrashi]

To be fair, we have humans. Sure, they are rotten and don't have elbows. But they are still humans.

Hell, the current Warchief is a Windrunner, the family that worship male human reproductive organs.

Nathanos redeemed himself with "Next time leave less anemic blood trail" comment, so he is ok.

[Schmilblick]

Nothing is appealing for me anymore, I just can't faction change 11 character or level them again on Alliance side :/

[Friendlyimmolation]

Most of Illidans evil has been retconned. And no matter what Both of them would choose the Alliance over the Horde. Especially Kayn.

Haha, what?

Kayn isn't an obsequious ass-kissing human worshiper, nor is Illidan even around. The Illidari did far worse shit than Sylvanas, and his people he sacrificed everything for are the Sin'dorei, not the traitor high elves nor the traitor void elves.

[Mehrunes]

The only thing Anduin has been naive about was Sylvanas. That's it. Nobody likes Sylvanas apart from her enthralled lover Nathanos. Nobody wants her. Nobody wanted this war. It's all in Sylvanas and that's what Anduin was naive about.
Sylvanas is wrong! What she believes is not true! In that latest book, even Genn comes to accept that the Forsaken can be allies.

This is an outright fabrication, Genn said no such thing. He came to accept that some of the Forsaken are still the people they were in life and that Forsaken aren't some mindless monstrosities out to snuff all life, incapable of parting ways with humans who reject them without bloodshed. That's all. He said nothing about allies or even having a desire for them to be that.

She says all these things and yet SHE is the one that instigates further conflicts! She is the one that propagates MORE hatred! She is the one that doesn't want to let these grudges die, because she benefits from it and she wants to turn all the living in the Alliance into Forsaken.

She said those things because they are true. Kirin'tor itself commented on how various Elves hate each other even more than the Horde and the Alliance. And the Alliance is always willing to sing kumbaya with the Horde. Until the time when it no longer does. Then it invades Horde territory in the name of archaeology and/or imperialism. Or attacks their fleet in a surprise attack. Or outright declares a war.

And Sylvanas wouldn't need to turn more humans into Forsaken if she got Eyir and turned the Forsaken she already has immortal. But that went to shit because "peaceful Alliance" attacked her.

Anduin and the Alliance arranged the meeting between the Forsaken and their living relatives, in good faith. It went great, until the Menethil girl decided to try and literally ssave the Forsaken by letting them come with them. That's when Sylvanas attacked them and killed ALL OF THEM. That's what she was planning, she wanted to KILL the people that had hope and kill the people who were in favor of reconciliation. Even freaking Genn Greymane ends up thinking it's a good idea!

Sylvanas wanted to cause infighting between the members of the Desolate Council that were spurned by the humans and those that were not. She only started killing people when she had an ongoing defection to an enemy faction and in favor of a pretender to her throne on her hands. Which she wouldn't have if Anduin actually did what he promised Sylvanas to do and kept human side in check.

There is no hypocricy!

Yeah, singing songs about peace and condemning Sylvanas for spurning it all the while Anduin did nothing about Genn and Rogers taking a colossal dump on the concept of peace is totally not hypocritical. Not at all /s

By going to war, AGAIN, Sylvanas has solidified prejudice against the Horde. Don't you see her manipulation in all of this? How long do we hold on to these grudges and mistakes? How long does the past control the future? It makes no sense! What Sylvanas belives is twisted and hateful. Not even Saurfang wants to follow her anymore and he's so destroyed by it that he says to the Horde player that he hopes they never have to make the choice between loyalty and honor.
The world has changed but Sylvanas hates it, because the more at peace the world becomes, the more people realize that she is the problem.

Why do you mean AGAIN? When was it that Sylvanas went to war against the Alliance on her own before?

[Super Dickmann]

Kayn values Illidan above all else. Sylvanas isn't committing evil acts for the greater good which is why he would be against her. And you seem to forget there are already 2 factions of blood elves in the Alliance already.

U wot m8. Who, the void elves who can destroy Quel'thalas, which he gave everything for or the Silver Covenant who culled them on the street and hate them because of fel? Sylvanas's PR line is committing evil to benefit the Horde, and thus by proxy the Sin'dorei. Whether that's actually what's achieved is something else entirely but Kayn followed Illidan who was ultimately perfunctory to beating the Legion.

[Mehrunes]

I USED to like the Horde, when they were noble savages and not literally the cause of everything evil always.

Up until the actual burning of Teldrassil (As in, Sylvanas getting triggered by an elf rightfully calling her out and choosing last-minute to burn the tree), everything the Horde did made sense. Yes, even storming up Kalimdor.

The Horde had every right prior to that moment to believe the Alliance was out to get them, and that there simply would be no peace so long as the Alliance still existed. Not more than an expansion ago, Genn decided he was going to attack Sylvanas and the Forsaken in open waters, despite there not having been war at all. And what was done about it? Genn and Admiral Rogers got a talking to. Both retained their positions as high ranking military officials, still able to give orders which would ensure a repeat of the same process. After breaking a peace treaty and attempting to depose the current-leader of the Horde with no provocation.

As such, this gave Sylvanas the fuel she needed to start a war. The Horde wanted safety and security. Sylvanas wanted to snuff out life. The Horde simply wanted to push the Alliance off of Kalimdor. Sylvanas wanted to raise Stormwind as undead.

Once she burned the tree, since the Horde had already started the war, they had no choice but to accept that the Alliance would retaliate - Not just against Sylvanas, but against them as well. With that retaliation incoming, they are stuck - They either surrender and are likely murdered by the Alliance for working with Sylvanas to burn the tree, or they fight back and try to survive - Most chose the latter.

Unfortunately, that's undoubtedly evil no matter how you look at it.

So you used to like the Horde until the moment you stopped paying attention to the story? Because Sylvanas didn't get triggered by the Elf. She was calmly thinking when Delaryn said what she said and then smugly delivered her response. That's not how a triggered person reacts. And from the events leading to the burning it was obvious that Saurfang ruined the war plan with his treason, making the occupation of Teldrassil unfeasible. Which was then outright stated by A Good War. Sylvanas burned the tree because without Malfurion dying the Alliance wouldn't be broken and they wouldn't be able to hold it in the way they wanted to and needed a replacement way to break Alliance's spirit.1

[frogger237]

U wot m8. Who, the void elves who can destroy Quel'thalas, which he gave everything for or the Silver Covenant who culled them on the street and hate them because of fel? Sylvanas is committing evil to benefit the Horde, and thus by proxy the Sin'dorei. Whether that's actually what's achieved entirely but Kayn followed Illidan who was ultimately perfunctory to beating the Legion.

Haha, what?

Kayn isn't an obsequious ass-kissing human worshiper, nor is Illidan even around. The Illidari did far worse shit than Sylvanas, and his people he sacrificed everything for are the Sin'dorei, not the traitor high elves nor the traitor void elves.

You guys realize why demon hunters become demon hunters right? Either to get revenge against demons or for the "greater good". Kayn is the biggest ass kisser in game. There is no way he would go against Illidans people + half his own unless it was for the greater good which Sylvanas's goal is not (turning everything undead). Unless she mindcontrolled every undead there would still be fighting, and once everyone is undead do you really think they wouldn't rise up against her and destroy her? Literally the only reason undead side with her according to Blizzard is because the believe humans wont accept them. What happens where there are no humans left? You go get revenge on the bitch who killed you and forced you into this terrible form and had you kill your former family and friends.

Void Elves sacrificed everything for more power for the greater good just like Demon Hunters. And don't forget that these blood elf demon hunters aren't just your average Blood Elf they are willing to cut ties with their homeland for what they see as the greater good.

[Malikath]

it's easy-mode.

[shiava]

The shoe could be put on the other foot.....why in the hell do you prefer Alliance? I prefer Horde because of what they are.....the outcasts, the misfits....the tag tale band of races that joined together and oppose what they see as wrong. The Alliance? The pretty little band of people...yes people....who are pure of heart and righteous and sit in their pretty cities on their pretty chairs so they shant muss their pretty clothes. They swoon over their boy, child, naive, immature "king" and proclaim him the next Jesus who could never do any wrong. The Horde looks at Sylvanas and say "wtf" but because they are loyal they do what they do. We are proud, we are strong, we are noble.....we are....the Horde.

Leaving aside the fact that both factions were made to have opposing bands on the game, you could argue the same for the Alliance. It's just that Blizzard kinda forgot to go a little bit deeper into that and decided the Alliance was gonna be Perfect McPerfection from the start. Actually all internal conflicts were mostly forgotten and the story always focused on outside threats, except for the whole Garrosh on Pandaria (That was pretty exaggerated in my opinion) and now Sylvannas.
When the game launched we had the internal conflict of the Defias bandits that could have lead to better plot branches. I'm pretty sure NE being so majestic weren't really interested in banding with dirty humans and their shitty politics. I'm not that much into lore but I'm pretty sure there were some dwarven conflicts. W3 showed it pretty nice with the high elves branching off the humans and converting to blood elves but that's it.

[Super Dickmann]

You guys realize why demon hunters become demon hunters right? Either to get revenge against demons or for the "greater good". Kayn is the biggest ass kisser in game. There is no way he would go against Illidans people + half his own unless it was for the greater good which Sylvanas's goal is not (turning everything undead). Unless she mindcontrolled every undead there would still be fighting, and once everyone is undead do you really think they wouldn't rise up against her and destroy her? Literally the only reason undead side with her according to Blizzard is because the believe humans wont accept them. What happens where there are no humans left? You go get revenge on the bitch who killed you and forced you into this terrible form and had you kill your former family and friends.

This is veering into powerful fanfiction right there. The Illidari weren't fighting for some nebulous greater good, they were fighting to destroy the Legion and that was accomplished. From then on they have basically fuck all in common in terms of goals. Before hand, the blood elf portion of the demon hunters were Sunfury, the most diehard blood elves who went to Outland to find another source for their people and save their kingdom. The goal you invent as Sylvanas' end goal isn't her public line, no more than failing at everything was Illidan's goal even if it was the ultimate result of his actions.

The void elves didn't sacrifice shit. They wanted to use void magic to sate the blood elves, which we know eats your soul and were exiled because if they'd succeeded they'd fuck up the Sunwell as indeed Alleria does. Then they wandered around doing fuck all for years until they got themselves caught by a void relic and would all have become mindslaves to the Void Lords if Alleria didn't happen to pass by.

[Deleted]

When I started playing Warcraft I chose the Alliance, because I didn't like the concept of a Warchief and thought the Alliance would be more democratic.
Then came the Highking, which was the Warchief in blue and the afore mentioned reason was gone.
I liked the conflicts within the alliance, e.g the angry citiziens in Westfall during Cataclysm, the betrayal of Lady Prestor, the aftermath of the betrayal of Aiden Perenolde, the Defias, Fandral against Tyrande, the Scarlett Crusade or the heir of the Bornzebeard Moira being the bride of Dagran Thaurissan.

But that's the past and there aren't real conflicts within the alliance anymore and it feels like the races of the alliance have lost their identity because the humans are always in the spotlight. It might seem that way, bc the alliance races are very similar.... but it feels a little bit boring.

The horde on the other hand is more diverse. And because of that diversity it is easier to ignite conflicts. The forsaken are pretty much predestinated to clash with the living races. They can't procreate, they can withstand hunger, tiredness or their superweapon the blight. And it was stated more than one time, that the transformation makes them less empathetic and they have less positive emotions and these are dulled (But that information is from a C&A from 2014, I don't know if they retconned it).
Therefore undead aren't very pleasant people to begin with.

The goblins aren't the nicest fellas either, which was hilighted in the recent events of Drustvar, when Gallywix didn't give a flying f*** about his peopling dying, instead worriyng about his profit.

The horde has too races who's identities is based on flaws, which Blizzard isn't afraid to use to create conflict (+ the part of the orc who like wars more than peace). I would prefer, if Blizzard would let the "good" races mess things up or create conflicts based on cultural differences, even if they aren't that big.

But I don't think that's going to happen. At this point the horde has the more interesting story, and like Thalyssra stated, their races haven't lost their identity (to the humans).

[frogger237]

This is veering into powerful fanfiction right there. The Illidari weren't fighting for some nebulous greater good, they were fighting to destroy the Legion and that was accomplished. From then on they have basically fuck all in common in terms of goals. Before hand, the blood elf portion of the demon hunters were Sunfury, the most diehard blood elves who went to Outland to find another source for their people and save their kingdom. The goal you invent as Sylvanas' end goal isn't her public line, no more than failing at everything was Illidan's goal even if it was the ultimate result of his actions.

The void elves didn't sacrifice shit. They wanted to use void magic to sate the blood elves, which we know eats your soul and were exiled because if they'd succeeded they'd fuck up the Sunwell as indeed Alleria does. Then they wandered around doing fuck all for years until they got themselves caught by a void relic and would all have become mindslaves to the Void Lords if Alleria didn't happen to pass by.

1. Use wowpedia or what ever and you will see it isn't fanfiction.

2.We haven't destroyed the Legion completely.

3. You still haven't explained why Kayn would side with the blood elves other than "looks like me!"

4. The Horde have already seen that Slyvanas uses them as pawns including raising them as mindless skeletons.

5. If you would actually look up the void elf stuff you would see they did it for the greater good as well.

[Enkrypt]

Simply because the Alliance is lame.

[Super Dickmann]

1. Use wowpedia or what ever and you will see it isn't fanfiction.

2.We haven't destroyed the Legion completely.

3. You still haven't explained why Kayn would side with the blood elves other than "looks like me!"

4. The Horde have already seen that Slyvanas uses them as pawns including raising them as mindless skeletons.

5. If you would actually look up the void elf stuff you would see they did it for the greater good as well.

1. It's pure fanfiction. The Illidari literally say that nothing is more importan than the Legion's destruction. It's their main goal.

2. Okay, then they might as well be killing demons in space for all the difference it makes, but those that do join the factions do so because they have ties with their race.

3. Because he joined the most pro-blood elven organisation, the Sunfury, then joined the Illidari to destroy the Legion and once that was basically achieved, he could default to his original pro-blood elf goals.

4. The Horde enthusiastically support Sylvanas throughout 8.0 in all things, and even then, Illidan did the same shit for much more feelbe reasoning when he offed his mages. Not a dealbreaker for any DH, let alone Kayn, who enslaves people's souls to make them his servants, see Akama.

5. And they were morons to do so because the problem was already solved. Everything they were called out on was true.

[Mehrunes]

Because the individual Alliance leaders can act on their own if they want to, when it regards matters of their own nation. That's why they only got a stern talking to.

Except it wasn't a national matter. And they were under Anduin's command at the time.

[Kyphael]

Because of Alleria alone? Alleria is not only a threat to the Sunwell and a traitor that came running to bask in Blanduin's light rather than come back to her people (if away from the Sunwell).

It's highly hypothetical, I know they're never going to do it, but they could do it if they really wanted since the Alliance was actively negotiating with Lor'themar in Mists when Jaina fucked it all up. Alleria can use her political influence to bring them in without actually ever having to get close to the Sunwell.