[EU] Brexit negotiations at a standstill

[Deleted]

Ask Theresa who is seeing Trump in the next day or two for the exact same trade deal the EU seems unwilling to want. Failing that, I suppose China would be happy to supply them, probably at 1/10th the EU price. As the buyer of goods you have many options in this global world, once out of the protectionist EU.

You know, fun fact, blackberries have been ripe all over the English countryside recently yet we get them from Guatamala wtf?, not the EU or even the UK. Same with Sloe Berries, everywhere you look at the minute, even Nigel on here won't go short of Gin! Who needs the EU for our essentials...

Brilliant, so we can jump into bed with the yanks, who will demand whatever they want for a 0 tariff trade deal, almost definitely including full access to the NHS, so we can kiss that goodbye.

Or we can jump into bed with China, the country that doesn't understand the phrase "human rights" let alone "workers rights", who'll demand that massive amounts of publicly owned companies are sold to them, because that's how they do business.

We have nothing to offer these countries, and they know that we need them, so they'll take us to the cleaners.

As for your comments are berries, speaking as someone who manages logistics for one of the largest supermarkets in the UK, if it is cheaper for us to buy Blackberries in Guatamala, ship them across the Atlantic, package them here and then sell them, than it is to purchase them from independent pickers right here in the UK, that's an issue for the independent pickers, no one else.

If you want to support your local farmers, go to a farm shop, instead of going to a supermarket. Oh wait that'd be too much effort wouldn't it.

[Slant]

Brilliant, so we can jump into bed with the yanks, who will demand whatever they want for a 0 tariff trade deal, almost definitely including full access to the NHS, so we can kiss that goodbye.

Or we can jump into bed with China, the country that doesn't understand the phrase "human rights" let alone "workers rights", who'll demand that massive amounts of publicly owned companies are sold to them, because that's how they do business.

We have nothing to offer these countries, and they know that we need them, so they'll take us to the cleaners.

As for your comments are berries, speaking as someone who manages logistics for one of the largest supermarkets in the UK, if it is cheaper for us to buy Blackberries in Guatamala, ship them across the Atlantic, package them here and then sell them, than it is to purchase them from independent pickers right here in the UK, that's an issue for the independent pickers, no one else.

If you want to support your local farmers, go to a farm shop, instead of going to a supermarket. Oh wait that'd be too much effort wouldn't it.

As I understand it, the local farmers don't even produce enough to feed the entire island, do they?

[Crispin]

Ask Theresa who is seeing Trump in the next day or two for the exact same trade deal the EU seems unwilling to want. Failing that, I suppose China would be happy to supply them, probably at 1/10th the EU price. As the buyer of goods you have many options in this global world, once out of the protectionist EU.

You know, fun fact, blackberries have been ripe all over the English countryside recently yet we get them from Guatamala wtf?, not the EU or even the UK. Same with Sloe Berries, everywhere you look at the minute, even Nigel on here won't go short of Gin! Who needs the EU for our essentials...

You arent equal "partners" with the US let alone China, speaking through the EU, the UK had a far stronger voice. Now you'll be the beggar, and beggars can't be choosers.

And as you, probably unintentionally, put it yourself, prices will rise when you have to buy local goods.

[Kiri]

You arent equal "partners" with the US let alone China, speaking through the EU, the UK had a far stronger voice. Now you'll be the beggar, and beggars can't be choosers.

And as you, probably untintentionally, put it yourself, prices will rise when you have to buy local goods.

Don't try. The British Empire still lives in Dribbles' mind. On the day of Brexit, they will pull a Soviet Union a la Simpsons Tide. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cQKzesTq0Wo

[Deleted]

As I understand it, the local farmers don't even produce enough to feed the entire island, do they?

They do for certain items, cabbages, lettuces, pretty sure potatoes is another one, not entirely certain for Blackberries, because they'll be such a small amount of goods sold, but i'll hazard a guess and say that they don't no.

[Slant]

Don't forget fruit. I think fruit isn't Britain's strong point. At least you'll have enough fish, so you won't literally starve.

[Demolitia]

Don't forget fruit. I think fruit isn't Britain's strong point. At least you'll have enough fish, so you won't literally starve.

That would depend on where their gas and electricity will come from, because they don't "grow" enough of that either.

[dribbles]

That would depend on where their gas and electricity will come from, because they don't "grow" enough of that either.

Very apt you bring this up as just yesterday...

HUGE gas field FOUND: Total locates 'one trillion cubic feet' of GAS in UK waters

https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/10...K-waters-Total

Discovered by an EU company in soon to be ex EU - UK waters. Suppose the EU are good for something then, shame they won't be able to share in the UK's good fortune with no deal. Shame the French company that discovered the new field only had a licence for exploration, not extraction. Shame the license to extract for non UK companies will not be available post Brexit for "reasons" of national security. Shame shame shame. Thanks though eurochums for finding it for us. Bwahahahahaaaahaaa

[caervek]

HUGE gas field FOUND: Total locates 'one trillion cubic feet' of GAS in UK waters

https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/10...K-waters-Total

Discovered by an EU company in soon to be ex EU - UK waters. Suppose the EU are good for something then, shame they won't be able to share in the UK's good fortune with no deal. Shame the French company that discovered the new field only had a licence for exploration, not extraction. Shame the license to extract for non UK companies will not be available post Brexit for "reasons" of national security. Shame shame shame. Thanks though eurochums for finding it for us. Bwahahahahaaaahaaa

That's not UK or EU waters, it's international waters, the North Sea gas fields are split between the bordering European countries via treaty (which predates the EU). This discovery will most likely be completely unaffected by Brexit, unless the government manage to bargain away some of our stake in the North Sea in which case we will lose territory/fields (having seen how well they have done at negotiation so far this is a possibility).

[dribbles]

That's not UK or EU waters, it's international waters, the North Sea gas fields are split between the bordering European countries via treaty (which predates the EU). This discovery will most likely be completely unaffected by Brexit, unless the government manage to bargain away some of our stake in the North Sea in which case we will lose territory/fields (having seen how well they have done at negotiation so far this is a possibility).

Wrong.

Global energy consultancy Wood Mackenzie said it was the largest conventional gas discovery in UK waters since Culzean in 2008

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotla...iness-45625287

Of course the EU navy could always argue the point, if they have one.

[Demolitia]

Wrong.

Global energy consultancy Wood Mackenzie said it was the largest conventional gas discovery in UK waters since Culzean in 2008

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotla...iness-45625287

Of course the EU navy could always argue the point, if they have one.

The french navy disagrees

[caervek]

Wrong.

It's not.

International waters start x miles from the coast, that field is significantly more than x miles from UK territorial waters.

What the article you are referencing is saying is that the field has been discovered in international waters which are allocated to the UK via a Europe wide treaty, not that they are in the UKs waters.

Like I said before, the UK's treaty allocated share of North Sea waters will either remain unchanged after Brexit of diminish if our government use it to bargain, but it's not actually related to EU membership.

[Fuiking]

It's not.

International waters start x miles from the coast, that field is significantly more than x miles from UK territorial waters.

What the article you are referencing is saying is that the field has been discovered in international waters which are allocated to the UK via a Europe wide treaty, not that they are in the UKs waters.

Like I said before, the UK's treaty allocated share of North Sea waters will either remain unchanged after Brexit of diminish if our government use it to bargain, but it's not actually related to EU membership.

Up until the moment Scotland gives the UK the finger and rejoins the EU, then poor Dribbles has lost that access too

[Pann]

It's not.

International waters start x miles from the coast, that field is significantly more than x miles from UK territorial waters.

What the article you are referencing is saying is that the field has been discovered in international waters which are allocated to the UK via a Europe wide treaty, not that they are in the UKs waters.

Like I said before, the UK's treaty allocated share of North Sea waters will either remain unchanged after Brexit of diminish if our government use it to bargain, but it's not actually related to EU membership.

The field is within the 200 nautical mile UK Exclusive Economic Zone which is defined by United Nations law.

[Slant]

So, nobody is going to mention that this field is owned 60% by a french company? Mkay...

[Demolitia]

So, nobody is going to mention that this field is owned 60% by a french company? Mkay...

Dribblesry aside, I don't think the shared waters apply to oil and gas reserves, do they? Total got a license to survey the area, and will pay a lease and fees to extract the gas. It's not like they can just go there, drill holes as they please and be on their merry way once they got all the gas out. If it's not total, it will be BP, but the UK will get the same amount in the end.

[Slant]

Dribblesry aside, I don't think the shared waters apply to oil and gas reserves, do they? Total got a license to survey the area, and will pay a lease and fees to extract the gas. It's not like they can just go there, drill holes as they please and be on their merry way once they got all the gas out. If it's not total, it will be BP, but the UK will get the same amount in the end.

I don't care about the gas. Dribs sees a gas field for energy, what I see is a money field full of money. Someone's going to get that much richer, and so far it looks like it's a French company. And he's celebrating it like a clown. I find that amusing.

[dribbles]

I don't care about the gas. Dribs sees a gas field for energy, what I see is a money field full of money. Someone's going to get that much richer, and so far it looks like it's a French company. And he's celebrating it like a clown. I find that amusing.

Without a licence granted by the UK to extract the gas that EU/French company owns 60% of nothing.

So Dribbles rubs his hands together in glee and tries to come up with an appropriate fee for the UK to charge the EU company for a licence to extract. £40 billion sounds about right, glad you find that amusing. Me too.

[Slant]

Without a licence granted by the UK to extract the gas that EU/French company owns 60% of nothing.

So Dribbles rubs his hands together in glee and tries to come up with an appropriate fee for the UK to charge the EU company for a licence to extract. £40 billion sounds about right, glad you find that amusing. Me too.

Well, 60% of the field is owned by Total. So... nothing to grant that isn't already granted. But hey, make up another fantasy in your head, it's not like you don't have enough already.

[Kallisto]

Labour: Don't rule out Remain option in Brexit vote says Starmer

Labour will not rule out including the option of staying in the EU in any future Brexit referendum, Sir Keir Starmer told the party's conference.

The shadow Brexit secretary said all options should be kept on the table, including a so-called People's Vote, to "stop a destructive Tory Brexit".

But a senior Unite official said another vote would "reopen the wounds of Brexit" not heal them.

Labour members are debating the controversial issue, with a vote later.

Labour's policy is to force an election if MPs are deadlocked over Brexit but members have succeeded in getting a debate on getting a fresh referendum on to the agenda at the conference in Liverpool.

Starmer insists Labour 'clear' on EU vote
Kuenssberg: Labour's conference '360'

Sir Keir told Labour activists if a general election was not possible "then other options must be kept open".

"That includes campaigning for a public vote," he said.

"It is right for Parliament to have the first say but if we need to break the impasse, our options must include campaigning for a public vote and nobody is ruling out Remain as an option."

The conference motion currently being debated says: "If we cannot get a general election, Labour must support all options remaining on the table, including campaigning for a public vote."

Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn - who has previously ruled out another referendum - has vowed to respect the decision of party members.

But Monday saw confusion over whether the leadership thought any fresh referendum should include staying in the EU as an option.

Shadow chancellor John McDonnell said he thought any vote should be on the terms of a Brexit deal - rather than on remaining in the EU.

But he later said "all options" were on the table - a point reinforced by Sir Keir.

Labour - which wants the UK to remain in a customs union but not the single market - has not ruled out voting for any deal Mrs May brings back from Brussels, ahead of the UK's 29 March departure date.

But Sir Keir said the six tests his party has set - including guarantees on workers' rights and retaining the economic benefits of existing market arrangements - were unlikely to be met.

"Some have said Labour could vote for any deal the Tories reach. Some have said we may abstain. Some have said we may vote for a vague deal," he said.

"So, let me be very clear - right here, right now: if Theresa May brings back a deal that does not meet our tests - and that looks increasingly likely - Labour will vote against it. No ifs, no buts.

"And if the prime minister thinks we'll can come back a vague deal asking us to leap blindfolded into the unknown, we will vote that down."
'Move on'

But Unite assistant general secretary Steve Turner said any vote on the outcome of the Brexit negotiations could not be a re-run of the 2016 in-out referendum.

"Despite what Keir said earlier, it's a public vote on the terms of our departure," he said.

"We desperately need a better, fairer society - we need to heal the wounds of Brexit, not reopen them, and only our movement, united with a proud socialist government, is capable of doing that."

The Labour Leave campaign group, which backed Brexit in the 2016 referendum, said Sir Keir was "playing with fire" and talk of a referendum made Labour look like "the party of Remain".

"We're damaging the Labour brand and alienating our supporters," said its general secretary Brendan Chilton.

"We have already had a vote on the UK's membership of the EU; it's been done and dusted. The Labour Party and its members must accept this and move on."

The prime minister's Chequers plan, which would see the UK staying closely aligned to the EU in some areas, such as the trade in goods, has been criticised by EU leaders and many of her own MPs.

The Conservatives accused Labour of "playing political games".

"Labour seem determined to take us all back to square one by rejecting a deal out of hand then trying to delay Brexit and re-run the referendum," said Brexit minister Robin Walker.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-45631792

Slight movement it seems.