Rape Happens, Most Don't Report, Men aren't in any Major Danger, Stop it

[Craaazyyy]

Apparently you lack the capacity to think critically about the overarching themes. Let me give you some baby steps.

1. note low number of false claims.
2. Note attitude towards rape victims who come forward
3. Note people who are saying how big a deal false accusations are to the point those get spoken more about than well.. rape.
4. Tell those people that unless they're actually raping people there isn't much to worry about.

That is not a thread made solely to say "don't rape people men!" because the over arching themes are in 1-2-3, not in 4-5 but I can see why a person such as yourself wouldn't be able to see that and be stuck on tiny details. You are incapable of seeing entirety are pictures or arguments, you are incapable of thinking critically. You are incapable of deep thought. At least that's how it seems from the fact you missed this rather simple premise.

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people tend to not speak more about obvious things.. thats why they're not speaking about rape because they know that rape is bad.. thats why they speak more about not so obvious things that could happen if you got falsely accused of rape

and yeah i dunno where you going because you clearly told people not to rape in your OP

also i dunno if you cant read or you just ignore things you dont agree with completely, but people pretty much proved that the numbers arent as low as you keep telling us

[Themius]

people tend to not speak more about obvious things.. thats why they're not speaking about rape because they know that rape is bad.. thats why they speak more about not so obvious things that could happen if you got falsely accused of rape

and yeah i dunno where you going because you clearly told people not to rape in your OP

also i dunno if you cant read or you just ignore things you dont agree with completely, but people pretty much proved that the numbers arent as low as you keep telling us

You say this but a person literally said saying no doesn't mean she doesn't want it. Another said if a woman goes alone to a party what does she expect and basically said she deserves it so... are you sure people know?

[melodramocracy]

There is no proof of that. Often in cases with he said she said, he wins the case. She gets castigated, and her entire character is called into question. Juries also feel a skank often deserves what she got because "well what did you expect" especially in conservative areas.

I'll throw the Aziz Ansari story here as a quick counterpoint. While he still has a career based on some brief reading, the story of what most folks agree was absolutely consensual (but just really cringey and awkward) sex absolutely tarnished his reputation. It didn't even need to reach a court.

I will agree, however, that the victims persona and general behavior DO get brought into question in cases where it shouldn't.

[Noxx79]

What the fuck you talking about?

The op claims numbers are massively higher for rapes because of self reporting online surveys. A thread where people mention X is much like the online survey. Using the actual forum population would be more akin to using the entire population of the world or US or what ever.

Do you not understand simple concepts?


And I'm not saying those are the actual numbers I'm saying people don't always tell the truth.

And your examples are bullshit.

You don’t understand studies and statistics.


You made up crap, got called out on it, and are deflecting.

Not to mention that you think dick size (a positive thing worth bragging about) is comporable to being raped (a negative thing that carries a stigma). By your reasoning, there should be exactly as many people bragging about raping someone as there are saying they were raped, because people lie, right?

Also, most crimes are self reported by the victims: how else would you and the police find out about it?

[Craaazyyy]

You say this but a person literally said saying no doesn't mean she doesn't want it. Another said if a woman goes alone to a party what does she expect and basically said she deserves it so... are you sure people know?

who said that every single human being is a sensible one? ofc not, but the ones who arent wouldnt listen

also when it comes to "no" thing yeah it could be exactly the way someone said.. because its almost impossible to prove consent.. no one else heard that no, and that no could've been just dropped randomly.. or that no maybe never even took place

was it no, dont fuck me i dont want it or was it just a single no? was she/he trying to resist? you can have sex with your gf and she could be yelling no and then start yelling yes 3 seconds after jesus christ

this shit is hard to prove even when you got raped, its just that theres nothing you can do but report is as soon as possible, because thats the only thing that can potentially prevent shit like that from happening to others and actually increase chances of sending that rapist to jail

[Checkt]

i dunno in what society you live in, but in the one i live rape isnt acceptable, but at the same time you have to prove that you actually got raped tho

Yeah, no, you live in a society where aggressive rape isn't acceptable. Saying someone groped you, met with ridicule. Saying that someone took advantage of you while you were drunk is laughed at, or labeled as you just regretting it now. Saying that someone refused to take no for an answer is met with 'well why did you do __'

I could go on, but the fact that you're already this hilariously niave means it's unlikely your extremely troubling views will ever change.

[Themius]

I'll throw the Aziz Ansari story here as a quick counterpoint. While he still has a career based on some brief reading, the story of what most folks agree was absolutely consensual (but just really cringey and awkward) sex absolutely tarnished his reputation. It didn't even need to reach a court.

I will agree, however, that the victims persona and general behavior DO get brought into question in cases where it shouldn't.

She felt pressured into it.

“He said something along the lines of, ‘How about you hop up and take a seat?’” Within moments, he was kissing her. “In a second, his hand was on my breast.” Then he was undressing her, then he undressed himself. She remembers feeling uncomfortable at how quickly things escalated.

When Ansari told her he was going to grab a condom within minutes of their first kiss, Grace voiced her hesitation explicitly. “I said something like, ‘Whoa, let’s relax for a sec, let’s chill.’” She says he then resumed kissing her, briefly performed oral sex on her, and asked her to do the same thing to him. She did, but not for long. “It was really quick. Everything was pretty much touched and done within ten minutes of hooking up, except for actual sex.”

She says Ansari began making a move on her that he repeated during their encounter. “The move he kept doing was taking his two fingers in a V-shape and putting them in my mouth, in my throat to wet his fingers, because the moment he’d stick his fingers in my throat he’d go straight for my vagina and try to finger me.” Grace called the move “the claw.”

Ansari also physically pulled her hand towards his penis multiple times throughout the night, from the time he first kissed her on the countertop onward. “He probably moved my hand to his dick five to seven times,” she said. “He really kept doing it after I moved it away.”

But the main thing was that he wouldn’t let her move away from him. She compared the path they cut across his apartment to a football play. “It was 30 minutes of me getting up and moving and him following and sticking his fingers down my throat again. It was really repetitive. It felt like a fucking game.”

Throughout the course of her short time in the apartment, she says she used verbal and non-verbal cues to indicate how uncomfortable and distressed she was. “Most of my discomfort was expressed in me pulling away and mumbling. I know that my hand stopped moving at some points,” she said. “I stopped moving my lips and turned cold.”

Whether Ansari didn’t notice Grace’s reticence or knowingly ignored it is impossible for her to say. “I know I was physically giving off cues that I wasn’t interested. I don’t think that was noticed at all, or if it was, it was ignored.”

Ansari wanted to have sex. She said she remembers him asking again and again, “Where do you want me to fuck you?” while she was still seated on the countertop. She says she found the question tough to answer because she says she didn’t want to fuck him at all.

“I wasn’t really even thinking of that, I didn’t want to be engaged in that with him. But he kept asking, so I said, ‘Next time.’ And he goes, ‘Oh, you mean second date?’ and I go, ‘Oh, yeah, sure,’ and he goes, ‘Well, if I poured you another glass of wine now, would it count as our second date?’” He then poured her a glass and handed it to her. She excused herself to the bathroom soon after.

Grace says she spent around five minutes in the bathroom, collecting herself in the mirror and splashing herself with water. Then she went back to Ansari. He asked her if she was okay. “I said I don’t want to feel forced because then I’ll hate you, and I’d rather not hate you,” she said.

She told babe that at first, she was happy with how he reacted. “He said, ‘Oh, of course, it’s only fun if we’re both having fun.’ The response was technically very sweet and acknowledging the fact that I was very uncomfortable. Verbally, in that moment, he acknowledged that I needed to take it slow. Then he said, ‘Let’s just chill over here on the couch.’”

This moment is particularly significant for Grace, because she thought that would be the end of the sexual encounter — her remark about not wanting to feel “forced” had added a verbal component to the cues she was trying to give him about her discomfort. When she sat down on the floor next to Ansari, who sat on the couch, she thought he might rub her back, or play with her hair — something to calm her down.

Ansari instructed her to turn around. “He sat back and pointed to his penis and motioned for me to go down on him. And I did. I think I just felt really pressured. It was literally the most unexpected thing I thought would happen at that moment because I told him I was uncomfortable.”

Soon, he pulled her back up onto the couch. She would tell her friend via text later that night, “He [made out] with me again and says, ‘Doesn’t look like you hate me.’”

Halfway into the encounter, he led her from the couch to a different part of his apartment. He said he had to show her something. Then he brought her to a large mirror, bent her over and asked her again, “Where do you want me to fuck you? Do you want me to fuck you right here?” He rammed his penis against her ass while he said it, pantomiming intercourse.

“I just remember looking in the mirror and seeing him behind me. He was very much caught up in the moment and I obviously very much wasn’t,” Grace said. “After he bent me over is when I stood up and said no, I don’t think I’m ready to do this, I really don’t think I’m going to do this. And he said, ‘How about we just chill, but this time with our clothes on?’”

They got dressed, sat side by side on the couch they’d already “chilled” on, and he turned on an episode of Seinfeld. She’d never seen it before. She said that’s when the reality of what was going on sank in. “It really hit me that I was violated. I felt really emotional all at once when we sat down there. That that whole experience was actually horrible.”

While the TV played in the background, he kissed her again, stuck his fingers down her throat again, and moved to undo her pants. She turned away. She remembers “feeling in a different mindset at that point.”

“I remember saying, ‘You guys are all the same, you guys are all the fucking same.’” Ansari asked her what she meant. When she turned to answer, she says he met her with “gross, forceful kisses.”

After that last kiss, Grace stood up from the couch, moved back to the kitchen island where she left her phone, and said she would call herself a car. He hugged her and kissed her goodbye, another “aggressive” kiss. When she pulled away, Ansari finally relented and insisted he’d call her the car. “He said, ‘It’s coming, but just tell them your name is Essence,’” she said, a name he has joked about using as a pseudonym in his sitcom.

https://babe.net/2018/01/13/aziz-ansari-28355

That story is it rape? It certainly feels inappropriate at the minimum but probably won't pass the bar for rape because she did go down on him, but why did she? According to her she felt tremendous pressure to. She voiced concerns and basically Aziz wore her down.

Do you believe a person can be so oblivious and caught up and horny that they ignore cues and unwittingly pressure a person into sex they didn't really want to have?

[Craaazyyy]

Yeah, no, you live in a society where aggressive rape isn't acceptable. Saying someone groped you, met with ridicule. Saying that someone took advantage of you while you were drunk is laughed at, or labeled as you just regretting it now. Saying that someone refused to take no for an answer is met with 'well why did you do __'

I could go on, but the fact that you're already this hilariously niave means it's unlikely your extremely troubling views will ever change.

keep telling that to yourself

naive because i know what you said only partly true?

also my troubling views? about what? did i say that rape is fine? cuz other than that i dont think theres anything i can say about this topic can be considered a troubled view?

did i say that its fine to ridicule actual rape victims?

[Najnaj]

Your main problem is probably that you don't have anything relevant to answer to my post, because every single word in it is correct, so i suggest you to learn the meaning of rant, that would help you to not being ridiculous next time you want to attack me without reason.

...and that would be the opposite of a citation.

[Checkt]

keep telling that to yourself

naive because i know what you said only partly true?

also my troubling views? about what? did i say that rape is fine? cuz other than that i dont think theres anything i can say about this topic can be considered a troubled view?

did i say that its fine to ridicule actual rape victims?

it doesn't matter if you said it, because suggesting we live in a society where rape is already unacceptable on all level definitely shows you're part of the problem.

[Craaazyyy]

it doesn't matter if you said it, because suggesting we live in a society where rape is already unacceptable on all level definitely shows you're part of the problem.

how can i be a part of the problem if i think that rape is unacceptable and that majority of people think the same?

you believe in rape culture? delusional

[Checkt]

how can i be a part of the problem if i think that rape is unacceptable and that majority of people think the same?

you believe in rape culture? delusional

I just explained it to you, and you agreed with it existing, but putting a name on it makes me delusional.

Like I said in my first comment, you ever notice those who disagree with anti-rape comments typically sound rapey? Cus you sound rapey.

[Morally Grey Storm]

it doesn't matter if you said it, because suggesting we live in a society where rape is already unacceptable on all level definitely shows you're part of the problem.

But rape IS unacceptable on all levels minus deranged and flat out evil ones amongst people.
Part of the problem is rape accusations being dished out so easy when defending oneself against such an accusation is not that easy.
Do you realize that if you met a girl at a bar and she had a glass of champagne and later on you had a sexual intercourse with her, you have no ground to defend yourself from rape accusations the morning after?
Because cmon, you took advantage of her! Defend yourself!

[frogger237]

And your examples are bullshit.

You don’t understand studies and statistics.


You made up crap, got called out on it, and are deflecting.

Not to mention that you think dick size (a positive thing worth bragging about) is comporable to being raped (a negative thing that carries a stigma). By your reasoning, there should be exactly as many people bragging about raping someone as there are saying they were raped, because people lie, right?

Also, most crimes are self reported by the victims: how else would you and the police find out about it?

Ok now I see you are just trolin so this is my last response to your dumb ass. I was never talking about actual reports I was mentioning why using anonymous surveys isn't completely accurate.

Who is more likely to respond to a thread about false accusations or rapes? People who have been in that situation and trolls that's who. What does that do to the numbers then? It increases the numbers from a random sampling.

I think the one who doesn't understand studies and statistics is you. A thread is very much like an anonymous survey as anyone can respond to it and takes into account only a small fraction of the population of the area/forums plus the people willing to respond to it are more likely to be related to it in some way.

[Xarkan]

how can i be a part of the problem if i think that rape is unacceptable and that majority of people think the same?

you believe in rape culture? delusional

Sometimes i wonder

On the surface almost everyone agree that rape is bad

But then you have people complaining about the idea that sex with a woman incapable of consenting (for example blacked out, drugged etc.) could be seen as rape as if it would hurt mens rights or leave men open to attack (even when the burden of proof is not changing, only the criteria)

Sometimes it seems there is an undercurrent that wants to make sure that some forms of undesired sex will not be defined as rape

As i said sometimes i wonder

But maybe it is just how it seems

Not sure it amounts to rape culture but it does seem puzzling

[Craaazyyy]

I just explained it to you, and you agreed with it existing, but putting a name on it makes me delusional.

Like I said in my first comment, you ever notice those who disagree with anti-rape comments typically sound rapey? Cus you sound rapey.

what? i didnt agree with anything existing.. i said that what you said is partly true, partly means only a part of it true, maybe 1% of it LOL

i sound rapey because i disagree with you

LMAO

[Checkt]

But rape IS unacceptable on all levels minus deranged and flat out evil ones amongst people.
Part of the problem is rape accusations being dished out so easy when defending oneself against such an accusation is not that easy.
Do you realize that if you met a girl at a bar and she had a glass of champagne and later on you had a sexual intercourse with her, you have no ground to defend yourself from rape accusations the morning after?
Because cmon, you took advantage of her! Defend yourself!

OK. let's do a little thought experiment ok? You find 100 instances of a false rape accusation, I'll find 100 instances where the rapist gets off. Let's see who has the easier time gathering data. Your idea of what rape is, and how men can be accused so so hilariously 'but poor men' uninformed it's not even funny.

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what? i didnt agree with anything existing.. i said that what you said is partly true, partly means only a part of it true, maybe 1% of it LOL

so disprove it then, LOL

[Deleted]

ur not allowed to fuck drunk people?

Are you bill cosby in disguise?

[Craaazyyy]

Sometimes i wonder

On the surface almost everyone agree that rape is bad

But then you have people complaining about the idea that sex with a woman incapable of consenting (for example blacked out, drugged etc.) could be seen as rape as if it would hurt mens rights or leave men open to attack (even when the burden of proof is not changing, only the criteria)

Sometimes it seems there is an undercurrent that wants to make sure that some forms of undesired sex will not be defined as rape

As i said sometimes i wonder

But maybe it is just how it seems

Not sure it amounts to rape culture but it does seem puzzling

yeah that happens, but on the other side there is a thing happening where people think that if they were touched by someone or even just approached by someone on the street its almost(or not even almost) a rape

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OK. let's do a little thought experiment ok? You find 100 instances of a false rape accusation, I'll find 100 instances where the rapist gets off. Let's see who has the easier time gathering data. Your idea of what rape is, and how men can be accused so so hilariously 'but poor men' uninformed it's not even funny.

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so disprove it then, LOL

well first of all i dont need to disprove anything you say to disagree with you

[Deleted]

So let's get rid of the entire justice system?

I don't think Rendark has heard of a jury of one's peers.

Best to ignore dickheads, in my opinion ;(