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  1. #541
    Why are they making a different Joker now? This isn't part of the DCEU right?

  2. #542
    Quote Originally Posted by Xilurm View Post
    Why are they making a different Joker now? This isn't part of the DCEU right?
    Nah it probably isn't. As for the DCEU, I think that one is headed for reboot anyway with their batman and superman essentially having to be recast anyway. I think they will wait how the Aquaman movie does, because so far the only character they have that actually did well was Wonderwoman.

    Someone probably approached them with an interesting script and after suicide squad their plans for this versions joker were probably on the backburner anyway.

  3. #543
    Quote Originally Posted by Haidaes View Post
    Nah it probably isn't. As for the DCEU, I think that one is headed for reboot anyway with their batman and superman essentially having to be recast anyway. I think they will wait how the Aquaman movie does, because so far the only character they have that actually did well was Wonderwoman.

    Someone probably approached them with an interesting script and after suicide squad their plans for this versions joker were probably on the backburner anyway.
    That's what they get when they try and rush things I suppose. They could've just started with a couple WW movies, a couple of solo Superman movies and a Batman, Flash and Aquaman movies and then make Justice League.

  4. #544
    Quote Originally Posted by Xilurm View Post
    That's what they get when they try and rush things I suppose. They could've just started with a couple WW movies, a couple of solo Superman movies and a Batman, Flash and Aquaman movies and then make Justice League.
    I still can't wrap my head around how we got a bats v sups when we didn't even have the most iconic enemy of batman first. But I guess since they turned sups arch nemesis into jessy eisenberg we were lucky in that regard, even though I could have seen the Leto joker actually work since the DCEU was pretty much the grim-dark version the DCU in the first place..

    Edit: I gues we were already quite saturated with batman films, especially after the Bale trilogy, but as far as building a shared universe goes, and I'm not the first to regurgitate that point, you are right that they should have started more solo films. bats v sups had to compensate for 3-5 other films essentially and it shows. Introducing luthor like that, while playing out the doomsday plot, the justice league founding and the death of superman plot was just not properly doable.
    Last edited by Cosmic Janitor; 2018-10-03 at 03:21 PM.

  5. #545
    Quote Originally Posted by Haidaes View Post
    I could have seen the Leto joker actually work since the DCEU was pretty much the grim-dark version the DCU in the first place..
    Stop right there.

    Leto misunderstood FUNDAMENTALS of the character. Joker + Harley is not Romeo and Juliet. Joker is abusive as fuck and treats her like property. He doesnt love her and call her babe. He gets possessive and jealous sure, but joker only cares about the batman. He doesnt "care" for Harley, he uses her. So one big swing and a miss from Leto/suicide creative team.

    And "damaged" tattoo on the forehead, dont need to say anymore even the director agrees he went overboard with that one.

    http://screencrush.com/david-ayer-on...squad-editing/

  6. #546
    The best Batman movie ever made is coming back to theaters in November for its 25th anniversary! It looks like its in the US only

    https://www.cbr.com/batman-mask-phan...urns-theaters/

  7. #547
    Quote Originally Posted by Xilurm View Post
    That's what they get when they try and rush things I suppose. They could've just started with a couple WW movies, a couple of solo Superman movies and a Batman, Flash and Aquaman movies and then make Justice League.
    People have said that, but I don't really see how they needed to build anything up for Justice League. I think Man of Steel was a worse movie than BvS or Justice League. The problem was not the base, the problem was the path, IMO. I think Wonder Woman was a great movie, and have some hopes for Aquaman, but the issues with the DCEU are the schizophrenic leadership and plotting, not that we needed more Batfleck first. Look at Suicide Squad too.
    "I only feel two things Gary, nothing, and nothingness."

  8. #548
    Quote Originally Posted by RobertoCarlos View Post
    Stop right there.

    Leto misunderstood FUNDAMENTALS of the character. Joker + Harley is not Romeo and Juliet. Joker is abusive as fuck and treats her like property. He doesnt love her and call her babe. He gets possessive and jealous sure, but joker only cares about the batman. He doesnt "care" for Harley, he uses her. So one big swing and a miss from Leto/suicide creative team.

    And "damaged" tattoo on the forehead, dont need to say anymore even the director agrees he went overboard with that one.
    Fundamentals of all the characters are wrong in the DCEU, I don't see why the joker should be sacred and the grand exception, he is the character with the most crass variations across the whole franchise to begin with imho.. I have filed the whole thing under elseworld anyway, not to mention that the whole possessive thing is on an edge in the first place, film 1-2 more scenese where he just abandons her (like in the car when she was caught in the first place) and it wouldn't be a jarring deviation from the current path of the character. That is also a detail in the suicide squad movie, which they could retcon in the main-line films anyway.

    I give you the stupid tattoo though, that one actually made me buy into the fallen-robin theory, but it doesn't work with the way harley joined him. Still a joker with a street thug/gang theme is something I could see work (which is what I was refering to) within the universe, some of the more classical ones would be more out of place even tbh.

    Either way, I don't have any hope for the current DCEU, sadly their stuff is so bad atm, they could probably not even pull off one of "reset scenarios" woven into the story; hard re-boot it is, unless a miracle happens.
    Last edited by Cosmic Janitor; 2018-10-03 at 09:21 PM.

  9. #549
    Quote Originally Posted by Haidaes View Post
    Fundamentals of all the characters are wrong in the DCEU, I don't see why the joker should be sacred and the grand exception. I have filed the whole thing under elseworld anyway, not to mention that the whole possessive thing is on an edge in the first place, film 1-2 more scenese where he just abandons her (like in the car when she was caught in the first place) and it wouldn't be a jarring deviation from the current path of the character. That is also a detail in the suicide squad movie, which they could retcon in the main-line films anyway.

    I give you the stupid tattoo though, that one actually made me buy into the fallen-robin theory, but it doesn't work with the way harley joined him. Still a joker with a street thug/gang theme is something I could see work (which is what I was refering to anyway) within the universe, some of the more classical ones would be more out of place even tbh.

    Either way, I don't have any hope for the current DCEU anyway, sadly their stuff is so bad atm, they could probably not even pull off one of "reset scenarios" woven into the story; hard re-boot it is, unless a miracle happens.
    Both Harvey Dent aka Two face and Penguin are better characters for the underground crime world or "gangsta" as you put it imo.

    Jokers strengths are his intelligence and unpredictability thats why hes the biggest villain in the batman roster. Grunge emo juggalo gangster wannabe snarling like a tiger half the time doesnt scream intelligence/threatening to me
    Last edited by RobertoCarlos; 2018-10-03 at 09:22 PM.

  10. #550
    Quote Originally Posted by RobertoCarlos View Post
    Both Harvey Dent aka Two face and Penguin are better characters for the underground crime world or "gangsta" as you put it imo. Jokers strengths are his intelligence and unpredictability thats why hes the biggest villain in the batman roster. Grunge emo juggalo gangster wannabe snarling like a tiger half the time doesnt scream intelligence/threatening to me
    Pretty much why I saw Ledger's Joker as both seductive...and terrifying. Embrace the anarchy schtick x1000 that could change a person into something unrecognizable.

  11. #551
    Quote Originally Posted by Spaceboytg View Post
    Let's see: Man of Steel, Batman vs. Superman, Suicide Squad, Wonder Woman and then Justice League. So, four films before the team film.

    MCU phase 1: Iron Man, The Incredible Hulk (kinda), Iron Man 2, Thor, Captain America, The Avengers. So, five (four if you don't count the Hulk film, which I don't) before the team film.

    But yeah, DC rushed things and Marvel took the exact right amount of time. SMDH.

    eta: BTW, both groups took 4 years from the first film to the last.
    Of course they rushed things! Did DC do a solo film for all the main players of JL before the movie hit ? NOPE!

    We got an okayish supes film with a hilarious amount of collateral damage during the final battle.
    Then we dive straight into Batman vs Supes vs Wonder Woman as our 2nd movie ? They jam in cameo's of all the other JL crew too. Luthor was completely miscast...
    Sucide Squad. Great advertising campaign but complete turd of a movie. Joker was completely miscast... Felt completely disconnected from the other DCEU films.
    WW FINALLY a good movie! 3rd act was a let down unfortunately. Ares... miscast lol

    We should of got a Supes movie, Bats movie, WW movie, Flash movie, Aquaman movie and you could of prolly jammed cyborg into 1 of those movies cause he couldnt carry his own movie.
    Then and only then can you bust out JL.

  12. #552
    I can't see how we could have gained much from a Batman movie before Justice League. What did folks need to learn about BATMAN, the guy has 50 movies out? Batman's intro in BvS was fine. Wonder Woman got her movie after being introduced in BvS, so that just leaves Flash and Aquaman (since I think Justice League really should have been Cyborg's movie). I think Aquaman didn't need an intro really, he's pretty obvious, so that just leaves Flash. I think Ezra Miller is okay as Flash, but I don't think he's a strong enough presence to carry a movie. He can't pull off the Flash from the cartoons, IMO, and whenever he does get a stand alone movie it'll probably suck anyway.

    So again, I don't think the problem with Justice League was that it needed more buildup. I think the problems were the production, the split in direction, the reshoots and stuff. Looking at Man of Steel or Suicide Squad, I have no faith that further prequel movies would have added to the mythos rather than just being more movies to bitch about.
    "I only feel two things Gary, nothing, and nothingness."

  13. #553
    What DC needs to learn is that turning over the keys to the castle to Zack Snyder over and over again and then watching him burn that castle to the ground so that he can "fix it" next time was never going to work.

  14. #554
    Quote Originally Posted by Spaceboytg View Post
    Whereas Marvel had that solo Black Widow movie. Oh, and the Hawkeye film ... that was a good one.

    Come fucking on already, do we really need another Batman origin film? Both companies, though particularly DC, have characters that are so well known generally that origin movies are not really necessary for every character (as Marvel did with Widow and Hawkeye ... and, recently, Spider-Man).

    And you missed my entire point, both "universes" had the same number of movies (Marvel one more if you count the Norton Hulk) before they did the "team up" movie. If that's DC rushing it, then it's also Marvel rushing it ... yet Marvel never gets that criticism.
    Because it just takes some critical thinking to realise that equal number of movies does not fulfill some requesit for a team up movie. Marvel had laid there ground work well with the movies they introduced and they EARNED there avengers movie.
    Every movie focused on one of the core founding members in a self contained movie that made sense while also laying groundwork for the Avengers and the larger MCU as a whole. We didnt need a black widow/hawkeye movie just as we dont need a cyborg movie as they are not the core foundation of the team.

    DC dropped the ball on there solo movies and they hamfisted the world building big time with only there 2nd movie, Batman V Superman. Sucide Squad had literally nothing to do with the DCEU apart from god awful Joker. DC didnt earn there Justice League movie at all IMO.

  15. #555
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    Very interested in this animated series. Shame it;'s gonna be on that DC platform no ones gonna watch

    I love Warcraft, I dislike WoW

    Unsubbed since January 2021, now a Warcraft fan from a distance

  16. #556
    Merely a Setback PACOX's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wyattbw09 View Post
    What DC needs to learn is that turning over the keys to the castle to Zack Snyder over and over again and then watching him burn that castle to the ground so that he can "fix it" next time was never going to work.
    From what I take, It was more studio execs pressuring Snyder because they desperately wanted to emulate the MCU. They didn't have a real plan in mind, all they knew was MCU has X so they want X. That put a ridiculous amount of stress on Snyder, who never really got to flesh out any ideas.

    Its in the same vein as to why Affleck backed out. WB upper management is a hot mess and really not worth dealing with after so many failures to launch.
    Last edited by PACOX; 2018-10-09 at 01:52 AM.

    Resident Cosplay Progressive

  17. #557
    Quote Originally Posted by Spaceboytg View Post
    Whereas Marvel had that solo Black Widow movie. Oh, and the Hawkeye film ... that was a good one.

    Come fucking on already, do we really need another Batman origin film? Both companies, though particularly DC, have characters that are so well known generally that origin movies are not really necessary for every character (as Marvel did with Widow and Hawkeye ... and, recently, Spider-Man).

    And you missed my entire point, both "universes" had the same number of movies (Marvel one more if you count the Norton Hulk) before they did the "team up" movie. If that's DC rushing it, then it's also Marvel rushing it ... yet Marvel never gets that criticism.
    one of the problems with DC movies, aside from just randomly shoving in half the justice league in with NO introductions (its not about the quantity, its about introducing the characters and how they connect to each other - in Marvel movies, even characters that didn't get their solo movies, WERE introduced in prior movies for other characters, so they see them all connect) - DC team didn't act or fight like a team. there is like ... ONE point in justice league where characters are actualy cooperating, and it involves cyborg catching aquaman. aside from that they are just a bunch of people in solo fights that just happen to be going on in roughly the same area. contrast that to marvel fights where they have ACTUAL teamwork. directly assisting each other, discussing strategies, having ACTUAL battle conversations.

    the ONLY DC movie where I saw that kind of teamwork? was Wonder Woman. amazons actualy worked together. Diana and Steve and the team, actualy work together, directly assisting each other. its kinda funny when solo movie for a character is more of a team up then actual team up movie is.

    DC's biggest problem is that instead of just trying to build their own universe, they keep trying to chase trends without understanding what made them trends in a first place.

  18. #558
    Quote Originally Posted by Orby View Post
    Very interested in this animated series. Shame it;'s gonna be on that DC platform no ones gonna watch
    I would get the DC streaming service if it was offered in canada

    I just want it for Young Justice and Batman the animated series.

  19. #559
    Quote Originally Posted by Spaceboytg View Post
    Let's see: Man of Steel, Batman vs. Superman, Suicide Squad, Wonder Woman and then Justice League. So, four films before the team film.

    MCU phase 1: Iron Man, The Incredible Hulk (kinda), Iron Man 2, Thor, Captain America, The Avengers. So, five (four if you don't count the Hulk film, which I don't) before the team film.

    But yeah, DC rushed things and Marvel took the exact right amount of time. SMDH.

    eta: BTW, both groups took 4 years from the first film to the last.
    Marvel made a movie for each of the principal characters of the Avengers before having them all team up.

    DC made movies for what are arguably the three most well known superheroes on the planet...but decided it wasn't important to introduce the Flash, Aquaman, or Cyborg before making a team up movie where you're allegedly supposed to care about those characters. And Suicide Squad contributes very little to the Cinematic Worldbuilding.
    “The biggest communication problem is we do not listen to understand. We listen to reply,” Stephen Covey.

  20. #560
    James Gunn the guardians of galaxy director/writer is taking over the suicide squad franchise, lolz

    https://deadline.com/2018/10/james-g...ct-1202479455/

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