Saurfang is an SI:7/Alliance asset

[Super Dickmann]

This chain of events isn't new. The Alliance gets to help the Horde beat the Horde! It's tradition!

The issue is you've broken etiquette. You're supposed to send a robot cat to feed our rebels after the rebellion has already begun. Sending a rogue with a big bag of money to help Vol'jin Saurfang out before that is just a faux pas.

[Necroxis]

The Alliance backed the Horde rebels during the siege on Orgrimmar and none of the Horde leaders were called traitors for accepting Alliance help. Saurfang seems to be building up a similar resistance and he is called a traitor for accepting Alliance assistance?

This chain of events isn't new. The Alliance gets to help the Horde beat the Horde! It's tradition!

Shhhh its almost like they're gigantic hypocrites and making a distinction for a character they like vs one they don't.

Don't ruin the magic. Even though the Darkspear Rebellion was ACTUALLY working with the Alliance, while Saurfang, from everything we've seen so far, is not.

The bubble must be maintained.

[Archmage Alodi]

Aaand player character is force to help this alliance scum. Well fuck this shit.

[Deleted]

Shhhh its almost like they're gigantic hypocrites and making a distinction for a character they like vs one they don't.

Don't ruin the magic. Even though the Darkspear Rebellion was ACTUALLY working with the Alliance, while Saurfang, from everything we've seen so far, is not.

The bubble must be maintained.

I am quite sure alliance players LOVED that patch with the robot cat, it was amazing.

[Deleted]

The Alliance backed the Horde rebels during the siege on Orgrimmar and none of the Horde leaders were called traitors for accepting Alliance help. Saurfang seems to be building up a similar resistance and he is called a traitor for accepting Alliance assistance?

This chain of events isn't new. The Alliance gets to help the Horde beat the Horde! It's tradition!

The Darkspear Rebellion approached the Allaince as equal partners on thier own terms to defeat a mutual threat.

Saurfang is not a equal partner, not done on equal terms and sent to dispose a threat to the Allaince. (assume his aware his escape was architectured by the humans).

Not remotely the same

[Stormmantis]

Why not just wait and see what happens before you all start complaining, its all guess work and assumption so far so chill out

[faithbane]

can we please kill saurfang in somewhat 8.3
he's old, stupid and his character ruined anyway
still I can't understand why they made pandaria 2.0
especially I don't understand why they force me to follow that shit orc

You clearly weren't around early in wow . For anyone who played vanilla Saurfang is a the epitome of badass. Those saurfang/chuck norris memes werent created out of nothing. I have seen entire ally raids zerging into org unexpectedly get chopped down by Saurfang before they can even reach Thrall. His cleave had a huge range and was 1 shotting anyone not wearing plate. Allies learned to use teh back entrance not to avoid the horde at the front but Saurfang. For the AQ40 event, he was the general of the entire united force of the fucking planet, he had an epic speech and fought at the front lines.

[Deleted]

Jesus. I'm out. Enjoy the lying and disingenuous freakout.

Nuance doesn't exist here. Why would it when you can just lie and make up definitions of things?

This thread and the official forum one (Which I assume you or the OP also made since its literally identical) are hilarious popcorn entertainment.

You calling other people liers, while not having any argument which makes sense, is hilarious. But of course everyone else is stupid, while you are right in your temper tantrum.

On one side Saurfang is supposed to be this extremely experienced leader and war general, on the other hand he isn't supposed to be noticing, that his escape goes very smoothly. And in this scenario, we presume, which is very generous, that he doesn't have a deal with Anduin and trys to escape on his own.

But it is easily possible, that he works with Anduin to get out and this is the reason, Shaw pays off the guards and gives them false orders and informations, so Saurfang has an easier time. Especially because Saurfang seems not to be worried about pursuers from the Alliance. He does warn Zekhan about Horde Assassins only. Why? Does he fear Sylvanas spies know of a deal he made with Anduin? Sylvanas has Banshee's, who can take over the mind and body of another person with ease. So she can have spies deep in Anduins networks. Hell, looking at Matthias Shaw's performance in Legion, i'm not sure why Sylvanas doesn't send a powerful Banshee to Stormwind to possess Shaw. Saurfang warning Zekhan only about potential Horde Assassins makes this whole scenario extremely suspicious, because it literally screams "I have a deal with Anduin and now i fear, that Sylvanas knows about it and wants to kill me!" Which Sylvanas would have any right to do so at this point. And her Dark Ranger want to capture him, not kill him. As Super Dickmann already stated, the Dark Ranger could easily ambush Saurfang and Zekhan successfully, if they had orders to simply kill Saurfang.

We can only hope, that Saurfang still trys to play Anduin. But it looks like he knows, that Sylvanas has her spies in Stormwind. Of course he would know, as a former high ranking member of the Horde. But if he only plays Anduin, he could at least inform these spies about it, even though he still would have to answer, why he didn't break out of Stormwind dungeons, when he had the chance. Not just answer to Sylvanas, but to the Orcs as well. As their leader, he has responsibility, which he just abandons and breaking the Blood Oath as well. Awesome honor right there.

And looking at the writing skills of the Blizzard authors, its not unreasonable to fear the worst.

You clearly weren't around early in wow . For anyone who played vanilla Saurfang is a the epitome of badass. Those saurfang/chuck norris memes werent created out of nothing. I have seen entire ally raids zerging into org unexpectedly get chopped down by Saurfang before they can even reach Thrall. His cleave had a huge range and was 1 shotting anyone not wearing plate. Allies learned to use teh back entrance not to avoid the horde at the front but Saurfang. For the AQ40 event, he was the general of the entire united force of the fucking planet, he had an epic speech and fought at the front lines.

Which, sadly, is only engine. Saurfang was never portrayed as strong as that in Lore at all.

[Deleted]

You calling other people liers, while not having any argument which makes sense, is hilarious. But of course everyone else is stupid, while you are right in your temper tantrum.

On one side Saurfang is supposed to be this extremely experienced leader and war general, on the other hand he isn't supposed to be noticing, that his escape goes very smoothly. And in this scenario, we presume, which is very generous, that he doesn't have a deal with Anduin and trys to escape on his own.

But it is easily possible, that he works with Anduin to get out and this is the reason, Shaw pays off the guards and gives them false orders and informations, so Saurfang has an easier time. Especially because Saurfang seems not to be worried about pursuers from the Alliance. He does warn Zekhan about Horde Assassins only. Why? Does he fear Sylvanas spies know of a deal he made with Anduin? Sylvanas has Banshee's, who can take over the mind and body of another person with ease. So she can have spies deep in Anduins networks. Hell, looking at Matthias Shaw's performance in Legion, i'm not sure why Sylvanas doesn't send a powerful Banshee to Stormwind to possess Shaw. Saurfang warning Zekhan only about potential Horde Assassins makes this whole scenario extremely suspicious, because it literally screams "I have a deal with Anduin and now i fear, that Sylvanas knows about it and wants to kill me!" Which Sylvanas would have any right to do so at this point. And her Dark Ranger want to capture him, not kill him. As Super Dickmann already stated, the Dark Ranger could easily ambush Saurfang and Zekhan successfully, if they had orders to simply kill Saurfang.

We can only hope, that Saurfang still trys to play Anduin. But it looks like he knows, that Sylvanas has her spies in Stormwind. Of course he would know, as a former high ranking member of the Horde. But if he only plays Anduin, he could at least inform these spies about it, even though he still would have to answer, why he didn't break out of Stormwind dungeons, when he had the chance. Not just answer to Sylvanas, but to the Orcs as well. As their leader, he has responsibility, which he just abandons and breaking the Blood Oath as well. Awesome honor right there.

And looking at the writing skills of the Blizzard authors, its not unreasonable to fear the worst.



Which, sadly, is only engine. Saurfang was never portrayed as strong as that in Lore at all.

I like you, I mean seriously Saurfang is not dumb he must be aware that his escape was smooth as hell or unless he has an agreement of some sort. But either way unknowing or not I wouldn't follow him.

[Aeula]

No surprise. Saurfang doesn’t have ‘honor’ at all. Just a need to sate his survivor guilt.

If we’re truly forced to side with him then I’ll probably not bother resubscribing until this mess is over.

[Daedius]

So he's an Alliance puppet.

Fucking R.I.P

Oh and as a PC you lie to Sylvanas for no reason, when you yourself found out that he's an Alliance plant with the Dark Ranger. What a mess man, they managed to fuck him up even more.

At this point IF they are replacing Sylv, freaking Gallywix would be a better option than Saurfang. Like seriously, what the actual...

Gallywix for Warchief!

--- snip ---

Infracted.

[andrewjoy]

Why does everyone who talks about honour have no idea what it means. Everyone thinks that Saufang working with the alliance (knowingly or not) is an act of dishonour, in fact its quite the opposite. Honour is earned through respect, for yourself, your enemy and your allies. Its about doing the respectable thing, even if that means working with your enemy. Yes there is also honour loyalty, but that has to be earned or it means nothing. Galiwix can buy the loyalty of as many goblins as he likes, but there is no honour in the loyalty, they would betray him in an instant if they would think it would help there bank balance.

Sylvanas is the traitor to the horde no saufang. Saufang is putting the honour of the horde before his own, in this sence he is a true hero of the horde. The best thing for the horde is for Saufang and Anduin to share a bottle of wine over Sylvanas's broken corpse, and then go there separate ways, next time they meet may well be in battle.

[Deleted]

Why does everyone who talks about honour have no idea what it means. Everyone thinks that Saufang working with the alliance (knowingly or not) is an act of dishonour, in fact its quite the opposite. Honour is earned through respect, for yourself, your enemy and your allies. Its about doing the respectable thing, even if that means working with your enemy. Yes there is also honour loyalty, but that has to be earned or it means nothing. Galiwix can buy the loyalty of as many goblins as he likes, but there is no honour in the loyalty, they would betray him in an instant if they would think it would help there bank balance.

Sylvanas is the traitor to the horde no saufang. Saufang is putting the honour of the horde before his own, in this sence he is a true hero of the horde. The best thing for the horde is for Saufang and Anduin to share a bottle of wine over Sylvanas's broken corpse, and then go there separate ways, next time they meet may well be in battle.

Sylvanas hasn't betrayed the horde(even if her tactics are extreme), Saurfang has betrayed the horde. Also the fact you want the horde warchief to be aided by the alliance in taking the throne is something most horde players don't want.

[Deleted]

Sylvanas hasn't betrayed the horde(even if her tactics are extreme), Saurfang has betrayed the horde. Also the fact you want the horde warchief to be aided by the alliance in taking the throne is something most horde players don't want.

Actually Sylvanas did betray the Horde, Alliance, Argents, Cenarion Circles and all the living species

She is constantly and regularly destroying world for living, agriculture and etc activities


You can't live in Gilneas, Hilsbrad, Lordaeron. Not only Alliance can't live there, but Horde as well. And raising Horde soldiers as skeletons is a bit much for any leader, but not for Lich King, whos intention was to make All undead, and Lich King was enemy of the Horde.

[Ergar]

5/5 storytelling Blizz. Sylvanas getting the Garrosh treatment is looking more and more likely now.

[andrewjoy]

Sylvanas hasn't betrayed the horde(even if her tactics are extreme), Saurfang has betrayed the horde. Also the fact you want the horde warchief to be aided by the alliance in taking the throne is something most horde players don't want.

She has betrayed everything the horde stands for! She is the litch king light. Sure sometimes the ends justify the means, but what ends? Whats her goal ?

[GetCrunk]

She has betrayed everything the horde stands for! She is the litch king light. Sure sometimes the ends justify the means, but what ends? Whats her goal ?

Tell me what The Horde stands for and if you say for honor explain what is this honor you all talk about?

[Dagoth Ur]

I don't wanna jump to conclusions but this looks pretty shitty for Saurfang. I feel like even if this is Alliance's plan to stir shit up for Sylvanas, Saurfang's probably unaware of it it which is at least somewhat redeeming. (Although how can somebody not be aware that inciting rebeliions in the middle of the war is not good for your faction's war effort is beyond me lol)

If he's aware of it then screw him and I guess that's easy #teamSylvanas for me.

As alternative, how cool would it be if Saurfang finds out Alliance is using him and screws them over by reaching some kind of compromise with Sylvanas.

[Deleted]

So Sylvanas has spies not only watching Stormwind (which is to be expected ofc) but also inside the Stockades watching Saurfang's cell day and night? 'one moment he was there and the next he wasn't' Hm.

And Shaw goes to Redridge and makes the guards get drunk instead of just ordering them to stay inside and not investigate if they hear something?

I'm really curious where this all leads.

[Mahmeya]

I am quite sure that Alliance players will be kept in the dark again.
There was nothing about how Talanji her bros even got into the stockade and only small mention they escaped - nothing about the way they did.
There was - and is - no hint about the possible talk between Anduin and Saurfang hinted by the end of Lordaeron battle - which could've shown more reasoning for both characters.
I am quite sure that Alliance players will only know about his escape if they play the Horde questline - which is massive BS considering that he escapes Stormwind. Just like there's no clue why even go to Uldir - and that possibly Horde players will have no hints for the Stormsong mini-raid.
------
As for all the fuss, I remember what Baine said in The Shattering: "Honorable enemy over a dishonorable friend." Now, Sylvanas is that dishonorable friend. Saurfang made several mistakes (getting pulled into Sylvanas' war plan and continuing to create it even when he saw how awful it is; not killing her on the spot for using the blight) but he realizes that the Horde can't get rid of her alone.