Why can't the father choose not to pay the child support if he wants abortion?

[Witchblade77]

ok, so I was thinking about another way to try and explain why the argument about men not getting to decide is so flawed.

point one. forcing a man to pay is slavery. no. no its NOT. why? becasue its functionally the same as paying taxes. you don't get to chose whether you pay or do not pay taxes. you live in a country - you pay taxes. tax avoidance lends you in jail. portion of your earnings is taken from you. the main difference is - with taxes you have no idea exactly whom your money is going to, other then general pot of "running of things", while with child support - your money goes to specific person. but the rest of your money - is yours. the rest of your life - is yours. you can buy or not buy property. you can change jobs. you can move. you can enter another relationship or stay single. you can do whatever you want with your body. its NOT slavery, its a tax like financial obligation

point 2, men doesn't get to decide. well yeah. that's kinda the point. becasue its NOT. YOUR. BODY. you concent to a possibility of pregancy when you have sex with a woman. THAT is when you get to make a choice. but while sperm is a catalyst for pregnancy if you will - it doesn't magically create a child, you need an egg inside a woman's body for that. you do not get to decide what a body of another person does. you only get to decide whether you give them that catalyst or not.

a few examples. lets say you decided that you wanted a child, both of you. so you have sex in hopes of having a baby. but... conception just doesn't happen. she doesn't get pregnant. YOU don't get to decide whether it happens on not. her body is the one that doesn't conceive. and you cannot change that (yes, I'm aware that male infertility is a thing, in those cases you can consent to using donor sperm, but woman's body is STILL the one that has to get pregnant). another common situation. you want a child. and she has a miscarriage. do you get a choice in that? NO. you do not. becasue its not your body that's going through the process. you. cannot. control. other. people's. bodies. it is as simple as that. if you could force a woman to carry a child to term, or force her to abort, THAT would be slavery. becasue that is what slavery is. not having bodily autonomy.

paying taxes? aint bodily autonomy or violation of thereof.

a man has bodily autonomy to use protection. your bodily autonomy is whether you chose to have sex.

[Hilhen7]

The stupidly fucking obvious one? Opting out of having to pay child support.

It's his child, thus his obligation to support it. Obviously...

Sorry if he can't terminate the pregnancy, but it's still his child.

[Machismo]

No i support equal rights and not one based on i have vagina and you don't, how hard is to understand that.

So, equal rights, like bodily autonomy? Great. Equality, like everyone being responsible for the consequences of their actions? great. then stop arguing against me, and you might actually be right for a change.

[Hitei]

It's his child, thus his obligation to support it. Obviously...

Except that it should be readily apparent that it isn't obvious, because women are completely able to opt out of that obligation despite it being their child. How are you so dense?

[Deleted]

Because of this thing called responsibility for doing things. Grow up.

[Hilhen7]

Except that it should be readily apparent that it isn't obvious, because women are completely able to opt out of that obligation despite it being their child. How are you so dense?

Okay so your saying it's not fair that women can opt out via abortion?

Well we cant force an abortion so no we can't help you.


On the other hand if the women tries to give the child up for adoption you can claim custody and sue for child support.

[markos82]

So, equal rights, like bodily autonomy? Great. Equality, like everyone being responsible for the consequences of their actions? great. then stop arguing against me, and you might actually be right for a change.

Actually i am right, you are the on who doesnt understand the fact where i have vagina coems to play. Anyway off to run and grab dinner after.

[Machismo]

Actually i am right, you are the on who doesnt understand the fact where i have vagina coems to play. Anyway off to run and grab dinner after.

I said both men and women should have bodily autonomy. Nope, no double standard.

I said everyone should be responsible for the consequences of their actions. Nope, no double standard. Your desire to bring your hatred for women into this is not really my problem.

[Deleted]

If a woman can choose (not) to abort without father's consent, why can't father choose not to pay child support if he wants her to do an abortion but she refuses? Either that or he should be able to stop the abortion but take full responsibility for the child once it's born.

Wouldn't that make the playing field equal?

That sure is the standard of a coward like man.

[dayne87]

At least in the United States I believe fathers can sign away their parental rights and not be forced to pay child support. But it means they also sacrifice visitation and guardianship rights. But I mean, if a man doesn't want to pay to support their child then they shouldn't care whether they ever see them or not, either.

[Hitei]

Okay so your saying it's not fair that women can opt out via abortion?

Well we cant force an abortion so no we can't help you.

I honestly cannot tell if this is just you pretending to be retarded or you are actually having this much trouble. You don't need to force an abortion, because you can literally just opt out of child support, the same way that women can opt out of supporting a child by aborting it or putting it up for adoption.

[Hilhen7]

I honestly cannot tell if this is just you pretending to be retarded or you are actually having this much trouble. You don't need to force an abortion, because you can literally just opt out of child support, the same way that women can opt out of supporting a child by aborting it or putting it up for adoption.

Then why are people here complaining about child support? Shouldn't be any problem whatsoever....

Also a women can be prevented from putting a child up for adoption if the father uses his parental rights.

[Rendark]

At least in the United States I believe fathers can sign away their parental rights and not be forced to pay child support. But it means they also sacrifice visitation and guardianship rights. But I mean, if a man doesn't want to pay to support their child then they shouldn't care whether they ever see them or not, either.

If that is true then that is perfect. If not then it should be.

[Xandrigity]

At least in the United States I believe fathers can sign away their parental rights and not be forced to pay child support. But it means they also sacrifice visitation and guardianship rights. But I mean, if a man doesn't want to pay to support their child then they shouldn't care whether they ever see them or not, either.

That is 100% not true.

[klepp0906]

because our society is anti-men at current. it would be comedical if it wasnt so sad. Women scream equality yet in family court they win by default almost every single time. Im not saying that its right or wrong, im saying that standards exist and exist for a reason. gotta take the good w/ the bad. People are unable to be objective and our current sjw/pc society is the result.

[Hitei]

Then why are people here complaining about child support? Shouldn't be any problem whatsoever....

Also a women can be prevented from putting a child up for adoption if the father uses his parental rights.

Wow, you really aren't pretending, Jesus. I don't know how to write it any more simply for you.

Right now. Men cannot opt out of child support. Women can opt out of supporting a child.

If that is true then that is perfect. If not then it should be.

You can only sign away your rights and be absolved from child support if there is a new (step) father who is adopting the child and agreeing to take on supporting it.

[Xandrigity]

It has nothing to do with being for women and against men. It’s soley about taking care of the child in the laws eyes. Whether the parents like it or not, the,child exists and must be cared for.

[smegmage]

I'm just glad this hypocrisy exists, so my taxes don't have to go towards paying for your poor choices. Pay for your damned kids.

[Captain N]

That is 100% not true.

Parents can sign away their custodial rights to their children called Voluntary Termination of Parental Rights. That does halt all child support payments but as dayne said does also do away with visitation and guardianship rights. This includes any tax incentives one would receive by having children.

This can only be done of there is someone else to take full parental rights.

[Hilhen7]

Wow, you really aren't pretending, Jesus. I don't know how to write it any more simply for you.

Right now. Men cannot opt out of child support. Women can opt out of supporting a child.



You can only sign away your rights and be absolved from child support if there is a new (step) father who is adopting the child and agreeing to take on supporting it.

Okay then your not getting the point.

There are only 2 ways a mother can absolve responsibility...

1. Abortion
2. Adoption (Unless father wishes to keep the child)

Father has the same rights as the mother in case 2, and 1 isn't an option.

So unless you want to give fathers the right to abortion (And remove bodily autonomy) they have the same rights. Case closed.