Sylvanas vs Saurfang - Battle for the Orgrim Throne

[Aucald]

Yet in lore, normal axe can't hurt spirit. You need better weapon, like Runespear.

I highly doubt anyone in the Warcraft universe save the most general of mooks carry "normal" or unenchanted weapons. Saufang's axe is probably a High Warlord's Battle Axe or something similar, meaning it is still enchanted and likely powerful enough to be a threat even to a spirit (and physical beings attack and destroy spirits in Warcraft all the time).

[Deleted]

I usually add it later to see if somebody treats this seriously.

Ah gotcha, the more I read it the more I thought "This guy has got to be joking" lol I guess we'll see how many other take the bait as the thread goes on

[Gavll]

Saurfang will just cleave her and that'll be it

[Nerovar]

Much of that is creative license and gameplay mechanics. We know for a fact that while Saurfang is strong on account of being an orc, and even stronger in particular since he's a top orc, and he's also among the most skilled warriors when he goes up against a threat that's actively supernatural in his physical abilities, that being Malfurion, he's massively outmatched. Saurfang, on account of being mortal, just wasn't able to keep up with Malf even in melee, before his magic kicked in.

To be fair Sylvanas also seemed to be losing against Malfurion until Saurfang casted axe.

[Aucald]

Much of that is creative license and gameplay mechanics. We know for a fact that while Saurfang is strong on account of being an orc, and even stronger in particular since he's a top orc, and he's also among the most skilled warriors when he goes up against a threat that's actively supernatural in his physical abilities, that being Malfurion, he's massively outmatched. Saurfang, on account of being mortal, just wasn't able to keep up with Malf even in melee, before his magic kicked in.

Sylvanas had no such issue. We can also compare their respective feats just in the launch trailer. Saurfang kills dudes, yes, but he's also overpowered by Genn. Sylvanas by comparison takes down a siege tower with one magically enhanced shot and then goes banshee and melts people to death. Now, if it was just physical vs. physical, and thus closer to the Genn vs Sylvanas fight than what Sylvanas does in other cases I can see this being more of a contest, but in an all out fight, magic users just have a massive advantage. See Thrall vs Garrosh for another example.

Malfurion isn't himself immortal - and nearly dies to an axe in the back. Saurfang's fear of Malfurion was one of Malfurion's strongest weapons (and one the Archdruid capitalized on brilliantly throughout Ashenvale and Darkshore). I definitely admit Malfurion had Saurfang outmatched, just as Sylvanas likely does, but I don't think he's a threat either party can just dismiss as irrelevant or non-dangerous - that's how Malfurion or Sylvanas wind up getting themselves beheaded or having their spines dislocated. In the Thrall vs. Garrosh fight, for example, Garrosh took the time to rant and bluster at Thrall, giving Thrall the time to rally and gather up his powers for a potent attack. Had Garrosh kept wailing on the prone Thrall until he was unconscious the story might be different (and that penchant was itself one of Garrosh's weaknesses).

I don't think magic user > melee warrior is an equation that always means victory for the magic user in every case, I just think they have an advantage in a one-on-one fight without any additional context.

[Super Dickmann]

To be fair Sylvanas also seemed to be losing against Malfurion until Saurfang casted axe.

That Sylvanas was even able to keep up with Malf pushed my suspension of disbelief, but it is what we have and even going from her earlier feats like breaking bones by screaming or the stuff she pulls in the cinematic trailer, she simply has a huge type advantage against Saurfang. The setting in general is more imbalanced than the game and a warrior has an upper limit that others don't, since they can either buff themselves to super strength or pull various magic. In a fight where both are limited to physical skills, there'd be more point to the discussion, but OP didn't do that.
@Aucald

Saurfang could cleave Sylvanas from behind like Godfrey and split her head open, but it'd be massively out of character and unlikely since he's a giant green man in a tin can. He can kill her if she's unaware, but in a proper fight, she has both stats and abilities over him. While I get your point about Garrosh and Thrall, nothing was really stopping Thrall from doing what he did from the start, except Thrall abiding by the rules. Sylvanas would have no such compunctions especially if you're in the camp that says that Thrall wasn't cheating. A magic user won't always beat a melee one, but they scale a lot better.

[The Stormbringer]

In the word of Genn Greymane...

"SYYYYLLLVAAANAAAAAAASSS!!"

[Nerovar]

That Sylvanas was even able to keep up with Malf pushed my suspension of disbelief, but it is what we have and even going from her earlier feats like breaking bones by screaming or the stuff she pulls in the cinematic trailer, she simply has a huge type advantage against Saurfang. The setting in general is more imbalanced than the game and a warrior has an upper limit that others don't, since they can either buff themselves to super strength or pull various magic. In a fight where both are limited to physical skills, there'd be more point to the discussion, but OP didn't do that.
@Aucald

Saurfang could cleave Sylvanas from behind like Godfrey and split her head open, but it'd be massively out of character and unlikely since he's a giant green man in a tin can. He can kill her if she's unaware, but in a proper fight, she has both stats and abilities over him. While I get your point about Garrosh and Thrall, nothing was really stopping Thrall from doing what he did from the start, except Thrall abiding by the rules. Sylvanas would have no such compunctions especially if you're in the camp that says that Thrall wasn't cheating. A magic user won't always beat a melee one, but they scale a lot better.

I too think that Sylvanas is probably more powerful in theory. That being said I still think that if Blizzard paired them in an actual fight, ultimately none of that would really matter. He'd most likely get close in her face, shrug off some arrows because he's stronk Orc and eventually land a lucky blow. Metz...- I mean Thrall nearly lost to Garrosh even though he was high on Draenor elemental power, Tirion got his lucky blow on Arthas after he won the actual fight etc.
This thread isn't about who's stronger. It's about who'd win and Blizzard usually favors the good guys (unless they want some tear jerking/dramatic effect).

[Super Dickmann]

It's about who'd win and Blizzard usually favors the good guys (unless they want some tear jerking/dramatic effect).

I'm assuming since it's a vs that it's a comparison of their feats, but narratively, yeah, whoever Blizzard want to win will win. Either Saurfang will cleave Sylvanas and bring in honor (for the Alliance) or he'll lose and become a sacrificial lamb for Baine to take over. That or they won't fight at all since she'll have become a tentacle monster by that point.

[Minikin]

LOL very true (love the Mario villain reference), although to be fair she could still not tell where he actually was going to attack from so it still says something about her reflexes that she was able to miss him as quickly as she did. Either that, or Genn just has a very bad aim

notching it up to general elf grace and reflexiveness. not to mention shes no ordinary elf. ranger general elf. basically shandris feathermoon for the blood elves but with more experience (which just shows how woefully bad blizzard has painted night elves as, recently getting utterly owned in their own forests).

All Genn has comparatively is equal speed (Debatable) and more strength (confirmed).

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I'm assuming since it's a vs that it's a comparison of their feats, but narratively, yeah, whoever Blizzard want to win will win. Either Saurfang will cleave Sylvanas and bring in honor (for the Alliance) or he'll lose and become a sacrificial lamb for Baine to take over. That or they won't fight at all since she'll have become a tentacle monster by that point.

pls remove this lol, we already have ENOUGH sylvanas fan art moving in a "certain direction" dont want to give them more ideas!

[Maljinwo]

Warriors are kinda awful on Lore unless they are backed up by a strong weapon.
So I'd say Sylvanas would probably win on a 1v1 with all her REEE screaming.


Unless Saurfang has a shotgun. Then he can one shot her like Godfrey did

[Skayth]

down to the basics.

In vanilla, no one knew saurfang until priests began mcing him and made him a meme on par of chuck norris. Has existed since, and his lore and backstory expanded greatly. But, at this time, he was one of the greatest warriors across all lands, and a veteran of all wars, and leader of the united front. So, the pinnacle of a warrior. Even in his old age, he would have bested most, if not all, in one on one combat with ONLY weapons.

In vanilla, Sylvannas already had a fandom that would die for her. But, her only powers was being an undead ranger (with all the dark ranger abilities from wc3) that can use fair bit of magic. With just her bow and arrows, she would be cleaved down. Even with her abilities from wc3, and had a fair bit of skeles, shed be killed. Silence doesnt work on a warrior, black arrow (while doing passive damage) wouldnt do enough to kill a blademaster or a tauren chieftan (which could be on par with saurfang in this scenerio), drain life is a channel and is easily interrupted, and charm wouldnt work on saurfang. in terms of Power (all the way till end of wrath, as there was no banshee form) sylvannas is the loser. Cata, she gains Valkyrs. If she is able to use them, then she would could use them to her advantage and wither down Saurfang, otherwise... again, cleaved down. Plague arrows beginning to show up will be her victory, using them to slowly kill Saurfang, as noone has a cure for them. So all she needs to do is get a hit on saurfang, and then wait on the Resurrection until the dot kills her opponent. BFA, she gained banshee form... and shes now stupidly op. Lorewise, everyone should either die or have their ear drums bursting and cause confusion and stunning instantly with her banshee scream (though that didnt happen with anduin + gang because plot armor) She can become incorporeal and mist like, (going full Death Eaters from harry potter movies) so actually striking her with an ax is impossible if she uses it correctly and should wear down her opponent.

So... vanilla,bc,wrath sylvannas vs saurfang, easy win for saurfang. Post, becomes harder, but doable. Post legion, impossible. At least it should be on paper. Remember... we are talking about the "ranger general" that power slid into range of 2h death knight that was wielding frost and unholy. So.... totally possible for that outcome again =D

[Sesto]

you know with all this tension i'm starting to feel saurfang and sylvanas should settle their differences someplace other than the battlefield

if you know what i mean

[Deleted]

Saurfang was once a powerfull Orc but he is a grandpa now a day.
Ppl should be happy we still see him being able to swing his axe.

Anyways Saurfang Son as DK could trap his father with ease in the encounter.
Pretty sure Sylvanas has more powerfull spellcasting then him.

[Deleted]

you know with all this tension i'm starting to feel saurfang and sylvanas should settle their differences someplace other than the battlefield

if you know what i mean

But-but...... what about poor Nathanos then? 8(

[EbaumsTipster]

But-but...... what about poor Nathanos then? 8(

Raid boss!

[derpkitteh]

But-but...... what about poor Nathanos then? 8(

he's already in the cuckshed. that's why he's so scornful of the player, we get treated relatively nicely while he gets coldly ordered around.

[Aeula]

Sylvanas would win. Saurfang got his ass whooped by Malfurion and Tyrande individually. Sylvie could beat him, especially since he’s too obsessed with honor to trick her.

I don’t like either but I’d still root for Sylvanas over Saurfang and his SI:7 buddies.

[Oakshana]

An axe wouldn’t kill her. She’s a banshee possessing her corpse

So, during Cataclysm, when she got shot by a normal gun, with a normal bullet by Godfrey... and she DIED and had to be brought back by a Valkyr?

Your explanation is... what?

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Which pretty much makes him horrible tactician.

No, it just means that the current writers are shit at writing the character.

[Guildenstern]

I'd rip the spine out of that traitorous alliance dog orc myself if he even dares approach Queen Sylvanas.