0/3 Titanforging?

[rrayy]

Completely against it, current system is fine. Except sockets should be fixed on items like in TBC/Wrath and not random upgrades.

This. There is absolutely nothing wrong with it.

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Yes nothing makes me happier than getting worse gear than other people that killed the same boss because RNG.

Because you should care about what gear others get why?

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The issue is, if it doesn't have a socket and isn't super high TF it's disappointing.
The new system killed all excitement for loot.

No it did not. You killed your own excitement because you get mad over what someone else gets. Not the systems fault you let your jealousy consume you.

[Schmittay]

I'd rather a system where you can upgrade your gear. Being able to ADD sockets, reshuffle stats to a certain extent...wait this is all sounding so familiar...

[melkesjokolade]

No, REMOVE IT ENTIRELY! Bring back valor points.

[Dakara]

Remove WF/TF
Add back Valor point to upgrade gear X times
All weapons come with sockets. 2H have 2, 1H/Shields/OH have 1.
Crafters can add sockets to some items slots. (BoE)
Move Tertiary stats to Gems/Enchants.

[HuxNeva]

Yes nothing makes me happier than getting worse gear than other people that killed the same boss because RNG.

But why? Why are you not happy that you got the drop, and also happy for the other people they also got a drop and a bonus at that?
I honestly don't get this. If this happens in our runs, everyone is happy and sincere gratz'es fly out over discord.

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No, REMOVE IT ENTIRELY! Bring back valor points.

I don't get people calling for yet another point grind.
Do they love farming AP so much that it is not enough for them?

[cparle87]

Have Valor points return, let us upgrade it like we had in mop and remove WF/TF/random sockets.

You mean the upgrades we had in the last tier as a way to psuedo-nerf the content so they didn't have to add a chill of the throne/depressed debuff?

Also as to valor vendor, hell no. I don't want people wearing the highest ilvl stuff the vendor has, even if it's crap for them, simply for the ilvl. I remember Wrath and people wearing the worst 264 stuff from emblems of frost simply to look better on gearscore.

[Deleted]

It would be better if the lootsystem would be the same as in D3. Items with random stat, "legendaries" with spell modifiers. No fix loottable on bosses.

[Niwes]

Have Valor points return, let us upgrade it like we had in mop and remove WF/TF/random sockets.

sign that.

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You mean the upgrades we had in the last tier as a way to psuedo-nerf the content so they didn't have to add a chill of the throne/depressed debuff?

Also as to valor vendor, hell no. I don't want people wearing the highest ilvl stuff the vendor has, even if it's crap for them, simply for the ilvl. I remember Wrath and people wearing the worst 264 stuff from emblems of frost simply to look better on gearscore.

ok. and know think again about the game system per se, decoupled from the quality of the gear. good or bad ? after that, think about valor gear that is as good as gear from m+ or raids, or at least nearly good, but not crap.

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No, REMOVE IT ENTIRELY! Bring back valor points.

sign that.

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Remove WF/TF
Add back Valor point to upgrade gear X times
All weapons come with sockets. 2H have 2, 1H/Shields/OH have 1.
Crafters can add sockets to some items slots. (BoE)
Move Tertiary stats to Gems/Enchants.

and sign that too.

80% of the ideas here are betterr than blizz ones. this brings the question to the table how some random gamers come to better ideas than a giant multi billion dollar company. and exactly thats the point. cause of $$$. they are not too stupid to realize that too. but their data just show that they can attract more ppl and use the human dopamin reward system better via that RNG shit and in the end just milk more profit out of it, otherwise they would not do it. sad but true.

result: Nothing will change. RNG and TF and all that fucked up shit will go nowhere. not as long as blizz make more profit with that game model.

[cparle87]

sign that.

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ok. and know think again about the game system per se, decoupled from the quality of the gear. good or bad ? after that, think about valor gear that is as good as gear from m+ or raids, or at least nearly good, but not crap.

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sign that.

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and sign that too.

80% of the ideas here are betterr than blizz ones. this brings the question to the table how some random gamers come to better ideas than a giant multi billion dollar company. and exactly thats the point. cause of $$$. they are not too stupid to realize that too. but their data just show that they can attract more ppl and use the human dopamin reward system better via that RNG shit and in the end just milk more profit out of it, otherwise they would not do it. sad but true.

result: Nothing will change. RNG and TF and all that fucked up shit will go nowhere. not as long as blizz make more profit with that game model.

We had things like adding extra sockets and such up until MoP. All it lead to was people complaining that JCers were slightly stronger, everyone complaining how they were "forced" to choose a crafting profession instead of what they wanted.

Valor gear was just as much RNG as anything else. There were two levels of it. That there was gear of the slot you needed an upgrade for. That the secondaries were such that it was actually an upgrade. And there was also the nerdrage which occured when you bought a piece of valor gear, only to invalidate it with an upgrade shortly after. "I spent 3 weeks saving up the points for these legs, which were a 20 ilvl up over my dungeon ones, but I got my tier legs the next day. Give me my point back Blizz or I quit." I remember those threads.

No matter what is done people are going to go 'omg blizz you had one job.' Personally I think they're so tired of it that they go with whatever ideas they think will get them whining from the smallest demographic. Like the ML change only being hated by raiders while casuals don't care.

[HuxNeva]

Another solution is to knock titanforging out of Heroic and Mythic raids, have items only ramp up to heroic level, and most people who wouldn't like this idea haven't completed heroic beyond buying aotc, it keeps both groups effected by it happy.
I'd also keep world bosses on the gambling wheel.. but make the gear from there more "fun" than bis.

Being for or against TF has nothing to do with how good or casual you are.
So far in all the discussions on this topic I have only seen 4 groups/arguments against TF:

- Competitive raid racers: mostly at first, as they haden't yet gotten accustomed to the system, and felt like it increased the preparation workload. Most of them worked out the probabilities and did adapt to the system.

- OCD sufferers that have low self control. They need to be handed an absolute checklist by someone else that they can 'complete' to be able to relax. These people can never adapt to the open system as their affliction does not allow it.

- Highly insecure people that need continuous external affirmation of their 'adequateness', and are overcome with doubts that others may not immediately and without any potential confusion notice their signaling. They are unable to adapt as imagined impurity of signal feeds their insecurity.

- Strict authoritarians. For them it is not a practical but a moral issue. There must be strict stratification. Ordnung muss sein! A ruthless meritocracy is their ideal. They can't deal with probability, as any deviation from 'purity' is blasphemy. They will never tolerate the new system as it is an insult to their ideology.

The groups are of course not mutually exclusive.

[Malikath]

feels to me

i'll re-iterate, how does a passive non-interactive system, even have a "feel"? and why should we give a shit about your feelings at all?
you clearly don't care about ours, so what motive do people such as myself have for giving even the slightest fuck about you and your "feelings"?

[Hatorri]

Best way was on TBC, we were allowed to warfoged current stats on gear and improve stats in general then valor points to purchase items was good now the current system sux, plus personal is the worst system ever happen, from the day raid has open till today I was "lucky" to get 3 items from raid killing 6 bosses every lockout and some in hc. last 2 days I killed Ghuun in HC and guess what I got on the extra roll..NOTHING (azerite is nothing to me if I want them I can do expedition).

Game designer in Blizz should be a nongamer person to change in-game things like that.!!

[deadman1]

But why? Why are you not happy that you got the drop, and also happy for the other people they also got a drop and a bonus at that?
I honestly don't get this. If this happens in our runs, everyone is happy and sincere gratz'es fly out over discord.

Because you should care about what gear others get why?

I love how both of you abandoned context, we were talking about disappointment, stay on topic. I'm not upset other people got better gear, I'm disappointed that my gear was markedly worse.

[HuxNeva]

I love how both of you abandoned context, we were talking about disappointment, stay on topic. I'm not upset other people got better gear, I'm disappointed that my gear was markedly worse.

You are just playing semantic games here. It is the same thing. You are like the kid trowing a tantrum over getting a new gaming rig for xmas that 'only' has a gtx2080, while Jimmy's parents got him a gtx2080ti with RGB!

[Deleted]

Would be nice to have MoP upgrade system back, yes.

That sucked, no thanks. So if you have say a 340 item upgraded to 350 and then you get a 345, it's a better item but after you farm 1k valor. Fuck that shit.

[bigbleach]

I really dont think Titanforging is a big problem. At all.
I watched the asmongold video and i dont understand his point of view

From what i understand he wants to get the best items in the game, which is not possible with titanforging.
And for some reason he is mad if a lower skilled player get titanforges.

If i understood him wrong, plz tell me.

But i really dont see the problem with any of this.

I watched one of his rants, I think you are correct. While you can get really lucky and have a really high titanforge item, if the player isn't good enough to use their gear to the fullest, it really doesn't make much of a difference. I've seen plenty of people in 360+ that can't do more than 10k DPS in M+ and in raids. The people who seem to be the most upset about azerite seem to be those who want to min/max too.

[valky94]

i like the 0/3 idea, and make scraping raid gear give you aditional mats that are used to upgrade gear

[Nikkej]

Valor would how not force ppl to grind?

[HuxNeva]

i'll re-iterate, how does a passive non-interactive system, even have a "feel"? and why should we give a shit about your feelings at all?
you clearly don't care about ours, so what motive do people such as myself have for giving even the slightest fuck about you and your "feelings"?

There is a difference between not agreeing and not caring.

[Baroclinic]

I'm happy as-is. Id fear if they made a currency model again, then the content might end up being tailored around gear being upgraded around the forges... kinda like how I felt that later Legion content was tailored around having your artifact stick traited up.