Class balance was alright, gearing and gear scaling was the main issue

[tikcol]

Big list of unreasonable changes that's what this thread is. The amount of ramifications each of those changes imply is astronomical. You clearly have no idea just how many other things would need to be changed just to accomodate each of those.

[Machismo]

If it wasn't an issue of class balance, then classes playng in the same gear would do the same damage (in all their DPS specs) and the same healing, as well as be able to tank the same. That is objectively not the case. You had several specs that were simply far inferior for PvP, as well as PvE.

Fury warriors did crazy raid damage, as did rogues with combat swords/combat daggers.

Full affliction was a dead spec, as was full destro, boomkins, feral druids, arcane, fire (until AQ), survival, elemental shamans, ret pallies, and a half dozen others. Paladins could not tank, it's really that simple... they didn't even have a taunt. Druids had weak threat gen, and could get crushed into oblivion. For heals, resto druids were behind the curve by quite a bit. They were there for innervates on priests, more than anything else.

[satella]

If it wasn't an issue of class balance, then classes playng in the same gear would do the same damage (in all their DPS specs) and the same healing, as well as be able to tank the same. That is objectively not the case. You had several specs that were simply far inferior for PvP, as well as PvE.

Fury warriors did crazy raid damage, as did rogues with combat swords/combat daggers.

Full affliction was a dead spec, as was full destro, boomkins, feral druids, arcane, fire (until AQ), survival, elemental shamans, ret pallies, and a half dozen others. Paladins could not tank, it's really that simple... they didn't even have a taunt. Druids had weak threat gen, and could get crushed into oblivion. For heals, resto druids were behind the curve by quite a bit. They were there for innervates on priests, more than anything else.

I get what you're saying, some specs were not viable in PvP or raiding. Spec balance was not really a thing they focused on.

However, there certainly was class balance, since every class was viable in some way, they all had their strengths and weaknesses. There was a balance of sorts.

The problem is that a limited amount of people want to play support classes. Almost everyone wants those killing blows. Every vanilla PvP video was from the perspective of a damage dealer.

[Machismo]

I get what you're saying, some specs were not viable in PvP or raiding. Spec balance was not really a thing they focused on.

However, there certainly was class balance, since every class was viable in some way, they all had their strengths and weaknesses. There was a balance of sorts.

The problem is that a limited amount of people want to play support classes. Almost everyone wants those killing blows. Every vanilla PvP video was from the perspective of a damage dealer.

Then your title is simply wrong. Class balance was terrible.

And no, there were plenty of videos with resto druids and holy paladins wrecking people. Tanks were useless in PvP, so there's also that.

[Warning]

I get what you're saying, some specs were not viable in PvP or raiding. Spec balance was not really a thing they focused on.

However, there certainly was class balance, since every class was viable in some way, they all had their strengths and weaknesses. There was a balance of sorts.

The problem is that a limited amount of people want to play support classes. Almost everyone wants those killing blows. Every vanilla PvP video was from the perspective of a damage dealer.

There wasn't any good class balance, and I don't buy the "every class viable in some way" either. Because some classes/specs were top tier everywhere (rogues, frost mages, warriors) while others sucked pretty much everywhere: prot paladins, ret paladins, moonkin etc.

[Mendzia]

Some good ideas but... it will not be Vanilla anymore so no.

[LazarusLong]

Nobody should be automatically listened to, that would be crazy. My voice has been heard by a few people, and some, like you, have made the effort to give me feedback on my thoughts. I thank you for it.

I am mostly against changes, because I know the ripple effect it would have on the game. There are a few changes that I know will not change the overall experience too much. Having an optional graphical overhaul, where you can check a box to show new models/animations/textures. That is a change I fully support.

Most of the changes I mentioned here were meant to be thrown out into the ether, and for people like yourself to poke holes in, expose it to the light if you will, to see where it could go wrong. So far you seem to be closest to genuine feedback.

Having special ammunition drop from raid bosses is an idea that can be worked on. If for example, a pouch with 1000 arrows would drop, and it would be rare enough that expending them on anything other than progression fights would be a waste, a case where the hunter actually uses them in PvP to kill someone powerful could be made. "He used his special arrows, he must've really wanted that kill, he can't do that again".

On the other hand, a unique item could drop from certain raid bosses that would dispense temporary magical ammunition that could only work inside the raid in question, like the legendary weapons in Tempest Keep. That would preclude the arrows from being used for anything other than raid damage, and the arrows could have a high enough dps so that scaling issues would be fixed.

There is always a way to fix problems, without introducing new ones. Saying that just because most people don't have a clue, that I am one of those people is not logical at all. It's lazy and defeatist.

You don't strike me as lazy.

Just let hunters craft ammunition from elementium.

[Beerbill Society]

Beware, you still can delete this before the #nochanges guys come here with their pitchforks and torches...

Oh no too late.

Blizzard is probably aware of how to balance things after all they already did that, the problem really is people will get mad, nobody can't change a single line of code of classic.

Maybe we are not mature enough for a fair classic experience, give it a few years we will see how things go.

[stevepelle91]

Every class had a purpose and that's all the balance you need. You rarely had a raid without having at least 1 of every class. Game was totally different back then, it was more of a role playing game and everyone was truly unique. Was the game perfect? Obviously not, but neither is retail or any other expansion in the past. I'm totally aware of the intellect/spirit gear with 0 spell damage on it and I would still choose vanilla over retail.

[Morssoe]

Ppl will die trying to find this thing called "balance". I will tell you there is nothing at the end of it! Or sure there is, it is blizzard breaking your class each expansion.

[Tiwack]

You know these reasons you have for changes is exactly the reasons some people look forward to playing it.
Maybe on an alternate fixed-classic-server you can play something akin to what you suggest, ask and you shall receive!

[klepp0906]

class balance is TOO alright. its literally the same. everyone now with minor degrees of variance depending on niche. so generic and homogzenized. game has been reduced to a blanket equation due to scaling everything. All for the sake of plebs & cost cutting on blizzards end.

meh.

[Bhanzai]

Nothing needs to be done with class balance. Nothing needs to be done with gear. Guilds completed all vanilla content with the classes and gear that was in the game at the time.

Yes some classes aren't as good as others but its been like that pretty much every expansion and patch since this game has been out.

Just doing something as simple and easy as giving druids and paladins taunt would be game breaking for vanilla content.

[RobertMugabe]

I’ve thought about classic a lot and the problem is is that once you touch class balance, the whole thing breaks.

This game is for nostalgia, if you “fix” it you break it.

Although classic is going to be very different from vanilla because the players have changed so much, but if they start balancing classes it just becomes a Frankenstein and no one will be happy.

Yeah pretty much...

These threads are a waste of time anyways, Blizzard won't "rebalance" anything and yet People are still making These suggestions

[Hyral]

Why do you want to play Classic if you don't want to actually play Classic? The people asking for optional stuff like models at least want things that don't affect the core of Classic, what you are asking is something else. Go play a funserver.

[Gungnir]

As everyone has already stated, it's a good mental exercise but Vanilla balance was definitely INCREDIBLY delicate, even moreso than most other expansions due to the nature of HOW they were balanced.

[quite an expert in wow]

Finding a solution before the game isn't even out / we don't know how things will turn out is least to say interesting. Maybe this works for private servers devs or something.

[xerath]

There wasn't an issue. If you don't like the way a certain class scaled you played another class.

[MoanaLisa]

Hello everyone,

There have been a lot of threads started about whether balancing should be changed along with a lot of other things. We would like to begin to move all of this into one place since changes to the game relate to one another.

The new thread is here: https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...nge-Discussion

Closing this one as it's not very busy and there are other threads about class balance already active.