Those WW nerfs

[Deleted]

I'm not surprised by the ToK nerf, PvP is apparently dictates every ability tuning in this game.

PvE tards took snapshotting, totems, stances and Heroic Strike down due to the streak of endless complaints because better players' colored bars was above theirs on any given damage meter.

I'll take "dumb stuff people keep saying after 12 years".

On topic, to be honest there's one thing WWs are severely lacking, and that's utility.
I started playing a Rogue in BfA. There's simply nothing a WW brings aside from an aoe stun (and maybe RoP, which you wouldn't take given Good Karma), and even then a Rogue can simply Dance tab Cheap Shot. But I mean, does it really compare with Sap, Blind, a single target 6s stun and Tricks of the Trade?

Paralysis at 45s is dumb. The direct comparison, DH, can talent into an hard stun, has an aoe stun, has a ranged banish, can talent into a cleaving slow, has an aoe slow (albeit one as clunky as Flying Serpent) and pretty strong defensives.

You don't compare apples to oranges, but there's got to be a limit where damage alone can't justify bringing a class. And it's not Monks alone who are in dire need of stuff.

[Parhelion]

PvE tards took snapshotting, totems, stances and Heroic Strike down due to the streak of endless complaints because better players' colored bars was above theirs on any given damage meter.

Sure, because all these things are gamebreaking in PvE. ROFL!

[klepp0906]

If this is the first pass in removing monk's reliance on a defensive CD for DPS, then it's going in the right direction.
I'm not surprised by the ToK nerf, PvP is apparently dictates every ability tuning in this game. So here's a big middle finger to whoever got the idea of introducing competitive PvP to this game.
Considering how bland this future 8.1 WW monk will be, I suspect the 5.5% damage boost is not enough. More like a 13% would do the trick.

I certainly hope that a company like Blizzard will somehow manage to hire several competents class developers in the near future, because these corporate aparatchiks are clearly not up to the task.

yea ww overall sucks cack atm. those changes will make it even more so from a bland or otherwise perspective. For some reason they felt compelled to remove our niche, and left demon hunters alone. meh.

im done by the time bfa is out anyhow, if not sooner. Pantheon should be ~1yr out.

[Jingshui]

I.... guess I understand the changes. But I gotta say, I've LOVED the flow of ToD mega-windows, and trying to get ToK blasts tucked into them. I feel like a tiny god on MOTHER, getting a ToK'd fire circle within the ToD window and blowing a GD hole in Recount. I was never crazy enough to consider taunting the boss and such, but this has been a lot of fun. RIP, come 8.1.

Will there be any gameplay here, once that's nerfed?? I mean, just adding damage into our baseline abilities might (might) fix numbers, but there's more to this than numbers. I hate when numbers rule everything.

[Deleted]

Sure, because all these things are gamebreaking in PvE. ROFL!

Gamebreaking? No.
The difference between a good player and a great player? Yes.

This game needs more of those, if anything. And less catering to whiners.

[Deleted]

I dont really think Blizzard know what they are doing with WW. Nerfs even with "buffs" as how its in PvP...

[TrickNasty]

Just reverted them so...

[Juliansfist]

Just reverted them so...

Could you or someone else elaborate please? I don't see any posted ptr notes

[Jingshui]

So, have they removed the Touch nerfs? If they -are-, are there any plans to replace that gameplay with something else compelling? I'm going to miss these burst windows so much......

[MasterOutlaw]

Could you or someone else elaborate please? I don't see any posted ptr notes

I'm not sure what he's talking about. The only change that I'm aware of them reverting is the nerf to FoF damage. All of the other incoming err... "adjustments"... are still on tap as far as I know.

[Malikath]

this is why i hate "no u" damage reflection on DPS class in the current development meta, it'd be fine as a option for brewmaster or for PvP, but because blizzard take it into account as a damage CD rather then a defensive CD it's existence weakens WW overall.

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Sure, because all these things are gamebreaking in PvE. ROFL!

bull. shit.

[TrickNasty]

Evidently I’m not allowed to post links to the page, but here is what Lore had to say. You can find it under a thread called “WW Monk nerf” under the blue tracker.

“We've actually reverted several of these changes (and similar ones for Frost Death Knight, Havoc Demon Hunter, and Arms Warrior) in the next PTR update. Those specs should be among the best at burst AOE, but we believe they're currently ahead of everyone else by a little too much. We want to take a little more time to collect data before making changes along those lines, though.”

[Jingshui]

Personally, I can handle being a burst-AoE class that's had a gentle retuning. /fingerscrossed!

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https://blue.mmo-champion.com/topic/...-ww-monk-nerf/

The Blue post in question, from the Lore himself.

[klepp0906]

Personally, I can handle being a burst-AoE class that's had a gentle retuning. /fingerscrossed!

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https://blue.mmo-champion.com/topic/...-ww-monk-nerf/

The Blue post in question, from the Lore himself.

cept we're basically the worst of the burst ae classes, if thats supposed to be our niche anyhow. shit all over by rogues, dh, mages. we "used" to be compettitive for elite burst dps. they removed that niche. Everyone cried we need better ST. So they gave it to us, at a price. Now we're average ST, average ae, meh in general.

[Deleted]

Damn mana cost..

[Hightotemz]

I can feel WW starts to reach it's max potential when you start hitting M+ 15 with < 380ilvl. The WW doing above that are running with a good Demon hunter to make up for their lack of damage. Demon hunters will have over 2k overall damage in a dungeon compared to a WW, Gear for Gear and similar skill levels. 2k overall damage is the difference between a +14 and a +17/18 run on time.

DH in my guild has 1400 raider.io and 91st ranking on the realm. I am 17th with 1224.

So yes, I don't understand how they can nerf our spec when they not touching DH damage?

[Pronbear]

From what it seems with the current build on the PTR, its more a ST CD nerf, with a global damages buff, which results prolly end up with :
- Somehow similar ST damages, maybe a bit nerfed if u were able to fully optimize ur Touch of Karma damages.
- Buff in aoe damages : SEF untouched, Xuen untouched, base damages buffed, dunno how to compare new Winds vs old Winds tho.

[Juliansfist]

The RJW change is a wait and see. Maybe nerf, maybe buff, maybe neutral. I'm hoping for buff haha.

[Hightotemz]

I gotta say Survival hunters are pretty OP Single Target atm, they really leave Windwalkers in the dust, it's sad that blizzard makes a melee spec the best performer for a range class when melee already has trouble finding spots in most mythic Uldir progress raids.

[Parhelion]

I gotta say Survival hunters are pretty OP Single Target atm, they really leave Windwalkers in the dust, it's sad that blizzard makes a melee spec the best performer for a range class when melee already has trouble finding spots in most mythic Uldir progress raids.

The biggest fail of Survival hunters is not melee spec design, but the fact they are melee. The PVE melee camp is already crowded. It does makes sense for PvP to have one melee spec.