The expansion saw strong participation in value-added services.

[Mad_Murdock]

I guess you didn't read it since the whole thing was about warcraftrealms not being accurate enough to make a statement about sub numbers. Why its not even close to accurate is also explained. In this situation your "rough measuring stick" is calculating distance just by watching in the right direction and saying "yeah its not that far". I mean if the web site states that the numbers are not reliable why the hell would you be here and try to say otherwise?

I guess we have different definitions of rough measuring sticks. I for example, don't need to see a server's numbers for 24 hours a day to know how well things are going. Just give me a snapshot of a couple of servers between 6-10PM local time and I can tell you if there has been a sizeable sub drop or at least, whether players have stopped logging in.

Its good for measuring in yards, but not inches. If we were arguing on whether it was 200K subs or 400K subs, it would be terrible to use that site. But from launch to now, it sure seems like we saw a WoD type drop (3 million the first 3 months). BFA I would say lost about a 1/3, at least in the US.

[shadowmatrix]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH

Translation: 90% already unsubbed but the whales still smash the cash shop. All good under the hood.

Or they sold a good amount of virtual tickets, race changes ,and charity pets. Stop acting like WOW has tons of things to buy on the store, it isn't FF 14.

[Deleted]

Or they sold a good amount of virtual tickets, race changes ,and charity pets. Stop acting like WOW has tons of things to buy on the store, it isn't FF 14.

Because connecting the dots between current WoW economy and gold from tokens is tough.

[God Save The King]

So anyone knows what's this PR mumbo jumbo? What does "value-added services" stand for? All cash shop transactions excluding game time and expansion / box sales? Or what. Could they be more specific...? (Ofc nope.)

I find it hilarious when people translate it as such: Makes no sense. People doing warfronts and islands (or not) doesn't add any financial revenue. Since it's an income report, they need to be talking about something generating income.

So far WOW doesn't have loot boxes (thank god) or paid dlcs (thank god again, hate the MMOs with paid classes, paid races, paid dungeon unlocks and whatnot), however I would assume things like race changes, faction changes, lvling boosts and whatnot go into that basket.

I saw people here saying gold buying probably goes into it too.

Unfortunately we have no 100% certainty what exactly Activision meant and what is their best selling component in wow.

It's not an income report, it is a MAU report, if you bothered to look at the context of the quote. It's preceding and succeeded by MAU metrics.

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Then what exactly is a casual player? I don't minmax and I barely even raid, yet I don't really have any goals to set, because it just all seems for naught. There's nothing to work towards and the content is spread pretty thing.

No idea. You'd need to ask Blizzard. Not sure why you think I'd know what player they're making their games for.

[Lightforged]

Because connecting the dots between current WoW economy and gold from tokens is tough.

The Gold from Tokens is not generated by the game, someone has to farm that gold and then buy a token in the Auction House.

[God Save The King]

Can you name a time that the community has been more unhappy with WoW than right now?

Basically every expansion and point in WoW history except maybe during Ulduar, and some parts of Legion. The community is always up in arms. We're basically the biggest case of the boy who cried wolf.

[davesurfer]

Or they sold a good amount of virtual tickets, race changes ,and charity pets. Stop acting like WOW has tons of things to buy on the store, it isn't FF 14.

Yeah that's what I was thinking. I buy mounts and pets for me and my wife. There aren't that many and my kids ask for more money to go out on a Friday than a pet. The costs is pocket change, hardly "Whale" buyers like F2P games.

[Deleted]

I don't get the warfront/island expedition thing.

Okay yes i do understand that there is probably a big quiet majority of casuals in the game that does this content, but... a lot?

How does someone enjoy autowin content?.. like.. for real? sure the first time because its new fine but repeatedly? q up and always win??

[Deleted]

The Gold from Tokens is not generated by the game, someone has to farm that gold and then buy a token in the Auction House.

You have a proof for that claim? Any?

[Zyrinx]

I don't get the warfront/island expedition thing.

Okay yes i do understand that there is probably a big quiet majority of casuals in the game that does this content, but... a lot?

How does someone enjoy autowin content?.. like.. for real? sure the first time because its new fine but repeatedly? q up and always win??

Islands, I sort of get (cuz I do a fair few myself). I do them as leveling content, and I do not really enjoy doing them. Why do I? Because I want to have all of my characters at max level in case the game actually becomes more fun again for me at some point.

Warfront, though...... I usually do it maybe 1x per character. I stlll have no real idea if anything you do in there actually matters, like, at all. I mean if all 20 people just AFK'd but wiggled their mouse every few mins, would the team still win in the end?

[Deleted]

You have a proof for that claim? Any?

Here your tinfoil hat

[Dasharin]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH

Translation: 90% already unsubbed but the whales still smash the cash shop. All good under the hood.

Translation: I don't like the game so of course no one else did either because I'm so cool everyone thinks like me

[Deleted]

Translation: I don't like the game so of course no one else did either because I'm so cool everyone thinks like me

The 90% where obviously hyperbole for dramatic effect or whatever but how would you read it?
I'd surely want to know how much money blizzard actually makes from subs (and the wow token) and how much they do with ingame services/mounts/pets

[Dasharin]

The 90% where obviously hyperbole for dramatic effect or whatever but how would you read it?
I'd surely want to know how much money blizzard actually makes from subs (and the wow token) and how much they do with ingame services/mounts/pets

Play the game...or don't play the game...it's that simple

Or...I guess...open a thread on a gaming forum using unsupported BS numbers to push your own narrative

[Lightforged]

You have a proof for that claim? Any?

Counter argument: Show me proof that that is not the way it works.

The burden of proof is on you to corroborate your claim.

[Lightforged]

I don't get the warfront/island expedition thing.

Okay yes i do understand that there is probably a big quiet majority of casuals in the game that does this content, but... a lot?

How does someone enjoy autowin content?.. like.. for real? sure the first time because its new fine but repeatedly? q up and always win??

I find Warfronts enjoyable because I get a nice piece of gear, I get to wander around an amazing looking zone, I get to be followed around by cool NPCs and I get to wear a Lumberjack's flannel outfit. It is a fun diversion once every two weeks.

Island Expeditions are also fun. It is like farming old dungeons and raids, expect the drop rate for stuff you want is higher (compared to Dungeons and Raids) and you get Azerite, which progresses your character. I mean if Islands aren't fun, then you need to tell millions of players to stop farming old content because it "isn't fun".

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Like Warren Buffet has said, "Companies rarely hide numbers that are favorable to their product". The ONLY reason Blizzard wouldn't release subscriber numbers is if they didn't want to show that they have declined a significant amount. If you can come up with another reason, go for it. Same thing is happening with Apple now, they will no longer offer iPhone sales figures, why, well that's because they just had to admit that they sold fewer than before.

If a company has good numbers, they say it, plane and simple.

Blizzard is also trapped.

If the subs are below 5.5 million, then the game is dying. If subs are about 5.5, people will say the game is stagnant and thus on the slow decline to death. If the game has more than 5.5 million but less than WoD's 10 (or Cata's 12), then they will say the developers are bad at their jobs and have failed to recapture the glory of what came before.

Plus, to be honest, subs don't really matter. Blizzard cares about holding your attention and keeping you playing their games.

[Deleted]

Counter argument: Show me proof that that is not the way it works.

The burden of proof is on you to corroborate your claim.

You get a guaranteed gold amount when you place your token on AH. You can't cancel. You are right - I need proof to corroborate my claim. Thinking ain't cutting it.

[Sansnom]

https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...y-you-unsubbed
Countless forum threads here, official forums, vids on YT, Twitch. Everything is fine. Keep buying high RoI eye candy.

And the forums is of course representing the mass of players accurately. As does people posting on YT.

[Lightforged]

You get a guaranteed gold amount when you place your token on AH. You can't cancel. You are right - I need proof to corroborate my claim. Thinking ain't cutting it.

Is that why it takes a variable amount of time for each auction to close. Why make me wait hours and hours for my gold if the system is just generating gold for me? That is a terrible system that is very user un-friendly.

Also why design a system to sell gold and make it more complicated than it needs to be? I can buy currency in Heroes of the Storm and get it instantly. Why make such a byzantine system?

[Corroc]

I guess we have different definitions of rough measuring sticks. I for example, don't need to see a server's numbers for 24 hours a day to know how well things are going. Just give me a snapshot of a couple of servers between 6-10PM local time and I can tell you if there has been a sizeable sub drop or at least, whether players have stopped logging in.

Its good for measuring in yards, but not inches. If we were arguing on whether it was 200K subs or 400K subs, it would be terrible to use that site. But from launch to now, it sure seems like we saw a WoD type drop (3 million the first 3 months). BFA I would say lost about a 1/3, at least in the US.

You are entitled to your opinion but dont try to push the narrative to others when there are definite proof that the site is not accurate.