Anduin is a traitor. Discuss.

[Zora-Prime]

I mean sure, a forum infested with some vocal Horde fanboys makes it seem like Alliance players don't exist or they don't like their faction. If you wanna know, Alliance players do not tend to be vocal, they enjoy the game from their side, they definitely do not think the Alliance is boring and they are definitely eager to fix your rotten filth of a faction once again by killing your Warchief again.

Well said! A statement just as generic as the faction you play.
Also, I didn't say Alliance players don't exist. I said they're boring and push for a boring story.

I don't even dislike the Alliance as a faction, but the fact that so many people here (horde/alliance) equate questionable decisions and immoral actions with bad writing is mind boggling.

Is burning the tree the moral/honorable decision? Hell no.
Does it make for an interesting story? Yes, it does.
Does that mean that Sylvanas SHOULD die for burning the tree? Not necessarily, because I prefer unlikely/unpredictable stories.
Does that mean Sylvanas should get a personality change and save all of Azeroth? I sure as hell hope not.

[LuminaL]

Saurfang is a traitor, Sylvanas is a traitor, Anduin is a traitor, Bane is a traitor, im a traitor, you are a traitor, everybody is a traitor!

STOP THROWING THE WORD "TRAITOR" AROUND

A HIGH KING who is the definition of "I am law" is not a traitor because he decided to release a prisoner.

STOP THROWING THE WORD "TRAITOR" AROUND

Someone with a slightly different mindset who has the full authority is not a traitor

STOP THROWING THE WORD "TRAITOR" AROUND

people call most hero characters DUMB yet when someone makes a strategic call to stop a war, to save lives, is not a traitor

STOP THROWING THE WORD "TRAITOR" AROUND

Edit: sorry but had to type it this way...

[schwarzkopf]

No, he's trying to save his precious morality by refusing to take drastic steps to take out a deadly enemy and counting on prisoner of war to do it for him

What he knows:
Sylvanas and he are enemeies

Therefore - by releasing him one of two things will happen:
1. It will divide the Horde
2. It will assist in defeating Sylvanaus

In addition - he has the authority to let a prisoner go.

Either way - a benefit for the alliance against an enemy they are losing against.

[Zora-Prime]

What he knows:
Sylvanas and he are enemeies

Therefore - by releasing him one of two things will happen:
1. It will divide the Horde
2. It will assist in defeating Sylvanaus

Either way - a benefit for the alliance against an enemy they are losing against.

At the risk of straining the already shaky alliance he has with the Night Elves.

[Count Zero]

This. You guys act like he isn't well within his rights to pardon someone.

A pardon is a legal act. Secretly releasing a prisoner is not a pardon.

[Zeek Daniels]

A pardon is a legal act. Secretly releasing a prisoner is not a pardon.

True, however you dont know the laws of the alliance so you cant treat it like our worlds laws because every country has different laws regarding somthing like this. Also there are plenty of times where things like spies are flipped and dont have to do jail time because they give info on the people they flipped on.

This is that case. Anduin doesnt need to do a public pardon. This is covert operation. Telling people just hurts his spies chances of success. Making it seem as if he escaped is whats going to help saurfang complete his mission.

So again a prisoner wasnt just released. A spy under the employ of the King was released to do his new job.

[KaPe]

So again a prisoner wasnt just released. A spy under the employ of the King was released to do his new job.

Bullshit. Anduin has no authority over Saurfang, didn't give him any orders and even if he did, there's no guarantee they'd be followed. Hell, a random group of Alliance troops could in theory run into Saurfang and kill him, because he's an escaped prisoner. Maybe the Alliance champion and their allies were resupplying in Stormwind and fight him. Malfurion or Tyrande? Kill on sight. I mean, obviously this won't happen, since that's not the story Blizzard wants to tell, but a possibility exist, if only in theory.

"A spy under the employ of King" is someone like Shaw or any other SI:7 member, not a veteran Horde commander who killed hundreds/thousands of Alliance soldiers in his life.

[Darththeo]

At the risk of straining the already shaky alliance he has with the Night Elves.

Except Tyrande would likely support his decision as Saurfang could have killed Malfurion and did not. Saurfang could have attack her, but let her escape.

Tyrande can be stupid, but not that stupid.

[KaPe]

Except Tyrande would likely support his decision as Saurfang could have killed Malfurion and did not. Saurfang could have attack her, but let her escape.

Tyrande can be stupid, but not that stupid.

Saurfang is the very reason "sparing Malfurion" even came into being. He's the guy who planned the campaign, commanded Horde troops and made sure they achieved the victory by finding some "hidden paths" to bypass the defenses.

It's like being grateful that a guy who robs your house didn't shoot you. Technically, he did show mercy - except there'd be no need for it if he wasn't there in the first place.

[Palapop]

Il'gynoth: "The Boy-king serves at the master's table. Three lies will he offer you."

I'll leave this here.

[Deleted]

You guys really need to look up what the word 'traitor' means.

Anduin is King of Stormwind and this prisoner is within the custody of the Stormwind Military. Anduin has every right and authority to release him. He probably wanted to look like an escape because he know Sylvannas has spies within the city. Spies who would let her know if Anduin openly released him. Other members of the Alliance and his own Generals would also question the decision but ultimately it is still Anduins to make.

So no he is not a traitor.

[Darththeo]

Saurfang is the very reason "sparing Malfurion" even came into being. He's the guy who planned the campaign, commanded Horde troops and made sure they achieved the victory by finding some "hidden paths" to bypass the defenses.

It's like being grateful that a guy who robs your house didn't shoot you. Technically, he did show mercy - except there'd be no need for it if he wasn't there in the first place.

That was war, it is common place in War ... something Tyrande is aware of. Again, Tyrande is stupid, but not that stupid. She understands sometimes you have to do something in order to win. Anduin is almost using Sylvanas' idea against her ... she wanted to divide the Alliance to make them easier to defeat, with Saurfang out, he will potentially divide the Horde.

[Zora-Prime]

Except Tyrande would likely support his decision as Saurfang could have killed Malfurion and did not. Saurfang could have attack her, but let her escape.

Tyrande can be stupid, but not that stupid.

She doesn't. Didn't the QnA panel already spoil this or something?

[Justpassing]

He's the king, he can do whatever the fuck he wants.

[Zeek Daniels]

Bullshit. Anduin has no authority over Saurfang, didn't give him any orders and even if he did, there's no guarantee they'd be followed. Hell, a random group of Alliance troops could in theory run into Saurfang and kill him, because he's an escaped prisoner. Maybe the Alliance champion and their allies were resupplying in Stormwind and fight him. Malfurion or Tyrande? Kill on sight. I mean, obviously this won't happen, since that's not the story Blizzard wants to tell, but a possibility exist, if only in theory.

"A spy under the employ of King" is someone like Shaw or any other SI:7 member, not a veteran Horde commander who killed hundreds/thousands of Alliance soldiers in his life.

Such is the life of a spy thats been turned. Your making absolutely no sense. So if American turns a Russian spy they have absolutely no authority over him right? Its called trust. You trust that the spy is going to give you info partially because the spy has been burned or found out by you so hes absolutely useless to his home country but hes not useless to you since his country doesnt know hes flipped. And of course the spy still risks being killed by the side hes turned to. Thats spy life for you.

As for Shaw and SI:7 thats not what i was talking about and you know it. Saurfang is a spy now for the alliance and as for being given orders, Anduins orders were pretty clear to me. Help me take down Slyvannas because i cant do it alone.

[Ehrenpanzer]

I looked at a recent interview, that had some audio recording issues so the transcript is damaged, but see what it says here.

https://old.reddit.com/r/wow/comment...con_interview/

Even with the holes, it reads clear as day. Anduin is keeping his actions a secret, even from the Alliance. The Alliance will even try investigating how it was possible, if I'm looking at this right.

He cannot be a traitor for releasing a prisoner. He is the King... people really need to learn how justice systems work in a monarchy.

[KaPe]

Such is the life of a spy thats been turned. Your making absolutely no sense. So if American turns a Russian spy they have absolutely no authority over him right? Its called trust. You trust that the spy is going to give you info partially because the spy has been burned or found out by you so hes absolutely useless to his home country but hes not useless to you since his country doesnt know hes flipped. And of course the spy still risks being killed by the side hes turned to. Thats spy life for you.

As for Shaw and SI:7 thats not what i was talking about and you know it. Saurfang is a spy now for the alliance and as for being given orders, Anduins orders were pretty clear to me. Help me take down Slyvannas because i cant do it alone.

What kind of cinematic did you watch? In the one that I saw, there was no deal made between the two and Saurfang didn't agree to anything. That's not how "orders" or "trust" work. It's Anduin hoping that Saurfang's goals align with his, which might not really be the case. Taking down Sylvanas is in both of their interest, true, but it is Saurfang who planned and executed the Darkshore invasion. He's not a pacifist who only wants peace. He clearly wouldn't wage the war like Sylvanas does, but he wouldn't bend over to the Alliance, either. He was already suicidal once and it merely took one pep talk from a single troll to make him fight the Alliance.

That's the problem with these types of arguments. You're forgetting who Saurfang really is because of your hateboner for Anduin - whose bad influence on the story is another topic entirely. But Saurfang commanded orc warriors for decades. He commanded the Might of Kalimdor. He commanded during War of the Thorns. Claiming he's being "ordered" by Anduin is just laughable.

Whether or not he actively worked against the best interest of the Alliance in doing so, is another story. I doubt there is any scenario in which Anduin thought to himself "hey, let's release Saurfang so the Horde can win this war!". It seems more likely he was making a last-ditch, potentially poor decision to free an enemy he knew would cause unrest within the Horde.

It's a pure gamble on his part. Our meta-knowledge means we "know" it *probably* won't backfire on him, at least not too badly, but within the story, he's ignoring his fellow leaders and acting on his own. It goes against the idea of "Alliance" when High King acts more like a Warchief and doesn't take other opinions into account. It is likely that most of them would agree, with the possible exception of Night Elves, but when they're ignored completely, it undermines the whole idea of working together.

[Kaver]

I looked at a recent interview, that had some audio recording issues so the transcript is damaged, but see what it says here.

https://old.reddit.com/r/wow/comment...con_interview/

Even with the holes, it reads clear as day. Anduin is keeping his actions a secret, even from the Alliance. The Alliance will even try investigating how it was possible, if I'm looking at this right.

In the end he is trying to get rid of Sylvanas which is good for everyone, both Horde and Alliance. So no, he is not a traitor.

Right now the Horde and the Alliance should work together to remove the evil Banshee Queen from the position of power. It’s a common goal. Blizzard never said Sylvanas is morally grey.. she is evil. What the Horde has been doing is what is morally grey.

[Khaza-R]

Anduin committing treason against the crown, when he is the crown

[Zandalariprelate]

Man the amount of fanboys for both sides of this stupid faction war is incredible, I am even starting to believe blizzard is hiring trolls or something because this is not normal