I want an Alliance Civil War

[sam86]

Why does everything have to be balanced/mirrored from the oppisite faction?
Alliance feels fine.

because pre-cata era that was how alliance was set ? prior to varian return alliance was on serious boiling point, alliance even only faction i can name that had change of leader (from Bolvar to Benedicus then back) during vanilla to show how much power struggle they have
alliance was shown as faction that is far stronger than horde, but have zero unity, nelfs look high on anyone else, gnomes f8cked themselves up, dwarfs hate each other the most than anyone else (playable dwarf is only alliance faction that can be at war with wildhammer dwarf faction), and human noble power struggle was VERY obvious since even lvl 10 quests
It made alliance far more interesting than this boring whatever we have now
Then blizz turned the table on everyone head and made alliance horde and vice versa, i remember ppl even in-game calling alliance blue horde and red alliance during cata when horde started to have racist tension and tear itself apart like how alliance were in early days (but more extreme), now when u talk about a faction that is full of racists, races that don't tolerate each others and sub-factions inside and constant power shift, it is the horde...

So if u follow warcraft story since wc3, it used to be alliance that had internal war, while horde united, not other way around
Now to add insult to injury, blizz show alliance losing (how?) against mainly Sylvanas & co horde, a sub-faction of horde, how no idea

[tangers58]

Cata saw Thrall resign and Garrosh named Warchief.
MoP saw a full blown civil war between Garrosh and Vol'jin. Vol'jin was named Warchief.
Legion saw Vol'jin slain and Sylvanas named Warchief.
BfA sees the set-up for a full blown civil war between Sylvanas and Saurfang. Sylvanas will likely not be Warchief much longer.

In the span of 5 expansion, the Horde will have gone through 5 warchiefs.

One the Alliance side, Legion saw Varian slain and Anduin named High King.

Why doesn't the Alliance get the same level of palace intrigue and or turmoil? Hopefully we get some internal conflict soon? I mean, seems boring and predictable at this point. There are very interesting characters on the Alliance side with differing views on leadership and war. Genn is a separatist, Tyrande is a xenophobe, the Council of Three Hammers are literally at each other's throats, Velen is zealot, and the gnomes and the pandarens need some love. Surely, we could come up with a story. Why would the 3 Hammers be cool with Anduin inheriting the title of High King? Why would Tyrande?

Just something I noticed.

Problem is that the Alliance doesn't need a civil war. Anduin is a jellyfish, the leaders get whatever they want with his weak leadership. Need at least 2 strong leaders for a civil war and the Alliance is sorely lacking.

[sam86]

They don't need to fight a war over that. The High King is just a figurehead. They're not oath/honour bound to ask how high when he says jump, unlike a Warchief. Tyrande and Genn just up and take their forces, and there's zero implication that this is in any way not allowed.

zero what ? we literally saw multiple times since cata that humans ARE the leader of alliance and no one second talk them, we saw that in MoP scenarios and how 'happy' were nelfs with the amazing super human helping them, or dwarfs, and how varian literally talk and no one second his words regarding stuff like for example if worgen should join or not (if it was alliance, then shouldn't they join even if only 1 was against it and all other factions supported that?)
Anduin may 'finally' started to lose some control in 8.1, but prior to that, alliance was shown as the blue horde, 1 to rule above all the amazing super human king, blizz employees have serious fetish for humans to rule all else
And seriously how can a race that outnumber entire horde faction lose so hard that he will start recruiting farmers ? Is Sylvanas horde that OP ? Does he feed his soldier to dogs or something and we don't know because it is behind the scenes ?

[cparle87]

Cata saw Thrall resign and Garrosh named Warchief.
MoP saw a full blown civil war between Garrosh and Vol'jin. Vol'jin was named Warchief.
Legion saw Vol'jin slain and Sylvanas named Warchief.
BfA sees the set-up for a full blown civil war between Sylvanas and Saurfang. Sylvanas will likely not be Warchief much longer.

In the span of 5 expansion, the Horde will have gone through 5 warchiefs.

One the Alliance side, Legion saw Varian slain and Anduin named High King.

Why doesn't the Alliance get the same level of palace intrigue and or turmoil? Hopefully we get some internal conflict soon? I mean, seems boring and predictable at this point. There are very interesting characters on the Alliance side with differing views on leadership and war. Genn is a separatist, Tyrande is a xenophobe, the Council of Three Hammers are literally at each other's throats, Velen is zealot, and the gnomes and the pandarens need some love. Surely, we could come up with a story. Why would the 3 Hammers be cool with Anduin inheriting the title of High King? Why would Tyrande?

Just something I noticed.

Cata also saw Moira try to take over Ironforge, expel the other clans, and almost be killed by Varian before Anduin talked him down and they formed the Council of Three Hammer. Gelbin Mekkatorque was almost killed in an ambush. The draenei had a refugee crisis and riots.

There was plenty of upheavel in the Alliance just in Cata. Those were just things off the top of my head. Thing is most people don't bother to look at lore that isn't spoonfed to them ingame.

[MHMabrito]

I could really see a Glenn uprising of other alliance members against anduin for being weak on the Horde. To which ends with Anduin actually killing Glenn. that would be amazing.

[Weeps]

Everything is so dirty and messy in Horde that it makes you bored when you looking at this storytelling. It's like living in a homeless world.
You must be the most coward/boring person in irl if you follow the path of Thrall and act like a knave.

I fixed that for ya

[Skulltaker]

I could really see a Glenn uprising of other alliance members against anduin for being weak on the Horde. To which ends with Anduin actually killing Glenn. that would be amazing.

Glenn died two seasons ago, give the kid a rest. I really miss him on TWD.

[Dellis0991]

Cata saw Thrall resign and Garrosh named Warchief.
MoP saw a full blown civil war between Garrosh and Vol'jin. Vol'jin was named Warchief.
Legion saw Vol'jin slain and Sylvanas named Warchief.
BfA sees the set-up for a full blown civil war between Sylvanas and Saurfang. Sylvanas will likely not be Warchief much longer.

In the span of 5 expansion, the Horde will have gone through 5 warchiefs.

One the Alliance side, Legion saw Varian slain and Anduin named High King.

Why doesn't the Alliance get the same level of palace intrigue and or turmoil? Hopefully we get some internal conflict soon? I mean, seems boring and predictable at this point. There are very interesting characters on the Alliance side with differing views on leadership and war. Genn is a separatist, Tyrande is a xenophobe, the Council of Three Hammers are literally at each other's throats, Velen is zealot, and the gnomes and the pandarens need some love. Surely, we could come up with a story. Why would the 3 Hammers be cool with Anduin inheriting the title of High King? Why would Tyrande?

Just something I noticed.

No Velen isn't a zealot at all and Legion proved it, he doesn't follow the light blindly and he adopted Illidan's belief in "only we can save us". Velen has grown more than any other alliance leader.

[Mardux]

If someone dislikes how Alliance works he can just leave, like Gilneas, Kul Tiras or Quel'thalas. We are not a blue horde where you get killed for disobeying your autistic leader, 8.1. Darkshore stuff proves this.

Basis for saying that sylvanas is autistic?

Wondering if you're too stupid to know what being autistic entails or if you're just a bigot outside of the game.

[Nalorakk]

I keep thinking there will be corruption within the 7th legion. Just waiting for Mathias Shaw to become a bad guy.

Is this when we find out he was never taken by a dreadlord and planned the broken shore assault failure himself

[iindigo]

It won’t happen because the Alliance is made up of wise and/or reasonable races that know better than to let their internal racial problems bubble up to the faction level. Both dwarves and gnomes serve as a great example of this, where the gnomes tried to handle the Gnomeregan situation on their own because they knew the greater Alliance already had its hand full and didn’t have resources to spare. Similarly the dwarves dealt with their clan problems following the loss of Magni entirely on their own because the Alliance had recently been exhausted by taking out the Lich King while also grappling the cataclysm and Deathwing’s return. This expresses itself at the faction level, too… all the member races know damn well that if they start bickering, everything will cave in quite quickly.

I’m all for more interesting Alliance lore, but it need not be through factional conflict and strife like the Horde sees. That’s one of the few perks of the Alliance right now – our story isn’t a mirror of the Horde's, so it offers an escape hatch for those who aren’t down with the Horde’s story.

[MHMabrito]

Glenn died two seasons ago, give the kid a rest. I really miss him on TWD.

I meant Genn, sorry.

[MechaCThun]

Inner-faction civil wars is becoming boring.

[Liarparadox]

Whenever I read something like this, I assume two things.

1) You think you're actually part of the Horde in real life.
2) That would be the limit of your real life accomplishments.

Yeah pretty much, though it was granting more than i would have.

- - - Updated - - -

Inner-faction civil wars is becoming boring.

Agreed. There's nothing interesting about it anymore. It's way overplayed. And sorta sick of the motivation behind these requests as well.

[Skulltaker]

I meant Genn, sorry.

I know, but the chance was to good. No hard feelings!

[Niroshi]

Inventing drama within the Alliance strictly because Horde players feel like they're owed something is a bad idea. There's no reason for the Alliance to fight any kind of civil war and there are far better ways to grow the characters involved.

[Justpassing]

And I want a good medium-rare steak. Good luck to us both!

[Cronovey]

Cata saw Thrall resign and Garrosh named Warchief.
MoP saw a full blown civil war between Garrosh and Vol'jin. Vol'jin was named Warchief.
Legion saw Vol'jin slain and Sylvanas named Warchief.
BfA sees the set-up for a full blown civil war between Sylvanas and Saurfang. Sylvanas will likely not be Warchief much longer.

In the span of 5 expansion, the Horde will have gone through 5 warchiefs.

One the Alliance side, Legion saw Varian slain and Anduin named High King.

Why doesn't the Alliance get the same level of palace intrigue and or turmoil? Hopefully we get some internal conflict soon? I mean, seems boring and predictable at this point. There are very interesting characters on the Alliance side with differing views on leadership and war. Genn is a separatist, Tyrande is a xenophobe, the Council of Three Hammers are literally at each other's throats, Velen is zealot, and the gnomes and the pandarens need some love. Surely, we could come up with a story. Why would the 3 Hammers be cool with Anduin inheriting the title of High King? Why would Tyrande?

Just something I noticed.

You skipped over Magni turning to diamond and the Council of Three Hammers being created in the first place, which took place in Cataclysm. In fact, you skipped over the whole part of Moira being kidnapped in the first place, or the fact that Varian was missing for Vanilla and TBC in the first place, the part where Maiev went bananas and started shanking Highborne who were brought back into Night Elf society, the fact that the Gnomes still haven't really reclaimed their city and (PTR spoiler) Mekkatorque being turned into a statue/stasis thing in the next raid coming up as well. They may not have actual changes in who is in charge, but there's no shortage of turmoil on the Alliance side of things either. The Horde has leadership roulette while the Alliance just has internal conflicts that they don't want to talk to each other about.

[Lane]

The problem is the factions that would make the most sense to leave the Alliance are in the least opportune positions to do so. Tyrande has an excuse since being in the Alliance hasn't served her people well during recent events. Genn is still (so far) wholly reliant upon Stormwind's military to reclaim Gilneas. Velen has no reason to turn on or abandon Anduin. The gnomes are still dependent upon the dwarves. I don't know what's currently going on with the dwarves?

The Alliance at this point are a group of broken nations allied under the Stormwind banner for military protection. It's generally not in their best interest to leave, especially during active conflicts with the Horde.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

Could there even be a civil war? wouldn't a member of the alliance just leave?