The "Stay faithful to the design" philosophy won't last, precedent is already there

[Hinastorm]

Im sure most people in this forum are aware of Everquests long line of progression servers.

At first it started out much like the majority seems to want. Stay faithful to the old experience, etc.

As time went on, more and more QoL changes were asked for, and implemented. They even added raid instances for the old raid bosses that used to be contested open world only. Now we have the instances AND the contested stuff, for the crazies.

Currently, everyone loves the instances, no one wants corpse runs back, changes to epic weapons are welcomed, almost everyone hates when they do lower exp rates, everyone enjoys being more powerful then we were back then etc etc etc I could go on with hundreds of these.

I sort of wish they would just accept this from the start, and we could get things like weapon skills removed. What about hitting trivial mobs for a couple hours to level a weapon skill is interesting or meaningful? What does only letting half the specs be able to raid accomplish?

Sigh.

[Byleth]

I think the point here is, these changes happened over time as the old school community experienced the original, and then iterated on it.

Let people experience Classic as it was, then in time we can discuss changes.

[NihilSustinet]

this is post is why i wont be playing classic

[draynay]

I have no problem with it playing out the same way with WoW if its what the player base wants.

[Hinastorm]

I think the point here is, these changes happened over time as the old school community experienced the original, and then iterated on it.

Let people experience Classic as it was, then in time we can discuss changes.

This is fair, I guess the slow process will just need to play out.

BUT, I still don't see any objective value to weapon skills. I'm sure there are many things like that, i'd rather us not waste time with the obvious changes.

But watcha gonna do I suppose.

[Mixxy]

I want Classic to be as faithful to the original as it can possibly be. I want it to be completely, truly, identical to how the game was back in 2004.

I want this for two reasons.

The first is that I want it so that the people who truly, genuinely want to be able to play a faithful recreation of the Vanilla experience - the people who have been begging and pleading for so long, and that Classic is quite literally made FOR - can have the experience they've been asking for, and promised, all this time. And if they love it, I'm super happy for them.

My second reason is the pure, simple vindication I will feel when all the people insisting that modern WoW is hot garbage and that "Vanilla WoW is the only real WoW" actually get a chance to replay it and finally figure out that something being amazing 14 years ago doesn't mean it's amazing right now. The smug, self-congratulatory feeling I'm going to get scrolling through all the threads filled with "I thought I wanted Vanilla but I don't."

I want the people who will genuinely enjoy Classic to have the genuine Classic to enjoy... and I want the idiot contrarians who were only interested because "all them casuals what ruined muh hardcore video game" to maybe learn a lesson or two about nostalgia and context.

[Hinastorm]

I want Classic to be as faithful to the original as it can possibly be. I want it to be completely, truly, identical to how the game was back in 2004.

I want this for two reasons.

The first is that I want it so that the people who truly, genuinely want to be able to play a faithful recreation of the Vanilla experience - the people who have been begging and pleading for so long, and that Classic is quite literally made FOR - can have the experience they've been asking for, and promised, all this time. And if they love it, I'm super happy for them.

My second reason is the pure, simple vindication I will feel when all the people insisting that modern WoW is hot garbage and that "Vanilla WoW is the only real WoW" actually get a chance to replay it and finally figure out that something being amazing 14 years ago doesn't mean it's amazing right now. The smug, self-congratulatory feeling I'm going to get scrolling through all the threads filled with "I thought I wanted Vanilla but I don't."

I want the people who will genuinely enjoy Classic to have the genuine Classic to enjoy... and I want the idiot contrarians who were only interested because "all them casuals what ruined muh hardcore video game" to maybe learn a lesson or two about nostalgia and context.

Ok. What do weapon skills add to the game? Its super easy to say "Just keep everything the same". But inevitably, things like weapon skills get changed over time.

Removing weapon skill would not hurt "the classic experience" in any meaningful way.

[Vineri]

If and when TBC comes out, any changes they made will become an issue going forward.

Best not to make too many changes.

With Activision-Blizzard's stock crashing though, I suppose it would be fitting that we never get Vanilla, even if we talk about it more. It's cursed. Official Vanilla servers are freakin cursed. Something always stops it.

If it does come out, Activision-Blizzard is going to add microtransactions out the wazoo, if it continues like their other games.... in light of Activision-Blizzard being money strapped.

[Cyrops]

Ok. What do weapon skills add to the game? Its super easy to say "Just keep everything the same". But inevitably, things like weapon skills get changed over time.

Removing weapon skill would not hurt "the classic experience" in any meaningful way.

Weapon skills were part of game mehanics, glancing blows were a thing, also there were a few items and racials that added weapon skill, which in turn increased damage potential with such weapons. If you get rid of weapon skills, then you have to normalize hit rating, then you have no RNG on hitting stuff, weather it's good or bad that's another topic.

[kyoloco]

i think this is why they were initially talking about pristine servers

which all of a sudden doesnt look that bad

[Seranthor]

If and when TBC comes out, any changes they made will become an issue going forward.

Best not to make too many changes.

With Activision-Blizzard's stock crashing though, I suppose it would be fitting that we never get Vanilla, even if we talk about it more. It's cursed. Official Vanilla servers are freakin cursed. Something always stops it.

If it does come out, Activision-Blizzard is going to add microtransactions out the wazoo, if it continues like their other games.... in light of Activision-Blizzard being money strapped.

You really need to explain this... are you suggesting that because of a stock dip that we aren't going to get Classic/Vanilla? Money Strapped? You cant believe this can you? Based on what? Please, explain it in detail

[Cyrops]

You really need to explain this... are you suggesting that because of a stock dip that we aren't going to get Classic/Vanilla? Money Strapped? You cant believe this can you? Based on what? Please, explain it in detail

He is talking out of his ass. He believes company has 0 money at the start of each month so only monthly income keeps them affloat.

[Craaazyyy]

well ignore all the cry babies that want QoL

[Byleth]

Ok. What do weapon skills add to the game? Its super easy to say "Just keep everything the same". But inevitably, things like weapon skills get changed over time.

Removing weapon skill would not hurt "the classic experience" in any meaningful way.

Are you still at it? I thought we settled this with the first response to your post?!

It would definitely hurt the classic experience because weapon skills were classic, and so are needed to experience classic.

Any more of this nonsense and you'll confirm yourself to be a troll.

[Irian]

Ok. What do weapon skills add to the game? Its super easy to say "Just keep everything the same". But inevitably, things like weapon skills get changed over time.

Removing weapon skill would not hurt "the classic experience" in any meaningful way.

Because it's another part of streamlining that inevitably turned the game into what it is now. I'm in no way a part of the "classic is awesome, #nochanges" group but I'd be firmly against the removal of weaponskills.

It adds more time investment and character progression, even if it's just a number going up it was a part of the Classic adventure. Leveling up and seeing the little "Your skill in two-handed axes has increased" message was another part of leveling up that made it feel like you were going somewhere and becoming stronger in a tangible way.
I can say personally as well, there was a level of excitement to getting a new weapon you didn't have the skill in and grinding it up to see how much stronger you are now. It was like being a kid at a candy store thinking "oh man I gotta see this cool proc in action! I can't wait until I can actually hit shit again!"

[Mixxy]

Ok. What do weapon skills add to the game? Its super easy to say "Just keep everything the same". But inevitably, things like weapon skills get changed over time.

Removing weapon skill would not hurt "the classic experience" in any meaningful way.

Actually, @Cyrops gives a pretty darn good answer to that:

Weapon skills were part of game mehanics, glancing blows were a thing, also there were a few items and racials that added weapon skill, which in turn increased damage potential with such weapons. If you get rid of weapon skills, then you have to normalize hit rating, then you have no RNG on hitting stuff, weather it's good or bad that's another topic.

[Baium]

Ok. What do weapon skills add to the game? Its super easy to say "Just keep everything the same". But inevitably, things like weapon skills get changed over time.

Removing weapon skill would not hurt "the classic experience" in any meaningful way.

RPG Immersion. It takes practice to be able to use a weapon effectively. The reason it was removed from modern WoW is because that element of the game has become less important. Vanilla was more Dungeons & Dragons in the warcraft universe, while WoW now is kind of its own things now.

[Vineri]

You really need to explain this... are you suggesting that because of a stock dip that we aren't going to get Classic/Vanilla? Money Strapped? You cant believe this can you? Based on what? Please, explain it in detail

Activision-Blizzard lost $10 Billion in a little over a more than a week. It was not a dip, it was a crash. They were in dept already for acquiring King.

Double the loss if you go back to early October 2018. From $85 down to $55.

That's a huge hit, and yes it affects Blizzard's cash flow. They need money like yesterday, essentially. When investors cashed out, they removed money from Activision-Blizzard. The difference becomes dept, which could be paid off easily -- except Activision-Blizzard is already in debt.

Yikes!

[Cyrops]

Activision-Blizzard lost $10 Billion in a little over a more than a week. It was not a dip, it was a crash. They were in dept already for acquiring King.

Double the loss if you go back to early October 2018. From $85 down to $55.

That's a huge hit, and yes it affects Blizzard's cash flow. They need money like yesterday, essentially. When investors cashed out, they removed money from Activision-Blizzard. The difference becomes dept, which could be paid off easily -- except Activision-Blizzard is already in debt.

Yikes!

Lost 10bn?? Damn someone's out of job. Who was it, was it Gary?

[Vaelorian]

People need to stop posting anything about the stock. If you actually work the market, this should not scare you at all. You'll yes see a dip. But it does not mean anything particularly. Blizzard is not going to come crashing down. You need to look at it for way back. If you for example see how the stock was at WOTLK/Cata.... the peak. You'll see a lower stock value than it has currently. You are really all looking into this waay too deep.

And buying King has nothing to do with suddenly running out of money. You think banks won't support Blizzard? They just made a wonderful deal and now had a slight hiccup.... omg the world is crashing.... Stocks are fickle things... next month they might have grown.