Viewpoint: 'Why most men should pay on first dates'

[Dwarfhamster]

Way back when I was dating I always paid for the woman's meal/drinks. Once we were serious I would rarely let the woman pay if she insisted.

Same with my wife even after being married for over a decade now, I always pay, enough though it's our money, and it's coming out of the same bank account.

Yeah came on to write exactly this. We have a shared account but also individual accounts.

[Theodarzna]

So emotional attachment is a bonus.

What about sex though? Since you stated that money and financial support is exchanged for sex and is the foundation why would a Rich woman have sex in a marriage?

My only thought is that because she actually enjoys it and it is beneficial for both parties. But then the man is providing nothing except emotional attachment / support which seems to have comparatively low value compared to sex or money. (At lest this is how it appears to me in the way you describe things)

In my opinion the emotional aspect is or should be a bigger part of the relationship. Instead of looking at marriage as a quid pro quo sex for money deal.

Emotional attachment is a nice thing and ideally will work out. Rich women have sex in a marriage to keep the guy around for whatever reason they wish to? I am unsure why you are being so autistic about the idea that marriages aren't exactly how they appear in a RomCom movie.

The biggest causes of divorce are still money and sexual problems. So, emotions alone don't work.

I personally value loyalty and a degree of obedience and manageability in boyfriends or my husband now. The sex is good, he is easy to satisfy and he is loyal and largely does what he is told and we enjoy the same things and let one another have hobbies outside the other person.

[GreenJesus]

Until she realises in what way he loves animals...

It's like saying on a first date "I like long walks on the beach". The fact she actually got a good feeling from someone saying something generic like "likes animals" her whole diary entry is even more pathetic if than I thought it would be.

[Dwarfhamster]

Come on, gentlemen, grow a pair of balls and just pitch for the first date. Doesn't matter who asked who out, if she insists on paying half, or whatever. (If she is legit getting pissed that you won't let her cover half the meal, she has deeper issues and you'd want to avoid her anyway.) If you're tight on funds, get lunch or coffee or dessert and not a dinner date. If you're doing a meal/movie combo, then let her pay for the movies (or whatever you do afterward). But make the effort to pay for the meal--it's not a big deal, it's not about what's "fair", it's not about feminism, or about keeping the man down. It's what gentlemen do.

(And people wonder where all the "men" are in this country ...)

[Kumorii]

But make the effort to pay for the meal--it's not a big deal, it's not about what's "fair", it's not about feminism, or about keeping the man down. It's what gentlemen do./SIZE]

Yet people make it a big deal if they don't.

[Hilhen7]

Emotional attachment is a nice thing and ideally will work out. Rich women have sex in a marriage to keep the guy around for whatever reason they wish to? I am unsure why you are being so autistic about the idea that marriages aren't exactly how they appear in a RomCom movie.

The biggest causes of divorce are still money and sexual problems. So, emotions alone don't work.

I personally value loyalty and a degree of obedience and manageability in boyfriends or my husband now. The sex is good, he is easy to satisfy and he is loyal and largely does what he is told and we enjoy the same things and let one another have hobbies outside the other person.

Causes of divorce also include incompatibility, communication, infidelity and a slew of other issues.

Sounds more like a pet then a husband / boyfriend. (Minus the sex)

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Come on, gentlemen, grow a pair of balls and just pitch for the first date. Doesn't matter who asked who out, if she insists on paying half, or whatever. (If she is legit getting pissed that you won't let her cover half the meal, she has deeper issues and you'd want to avoid her anyway.) If you're tight on funds, get lunch or coffee or dessert and not a dinner date. If you're doing a meal/movie combo, then let her pay for the movies (or whatever you do afterward). But make the effort to pay for the meal--it's not a big deal, it's not about what's "fair", it's not about feminism, or about keeping the man down. It's what gentlemen do.

(And people wonder where all the "men" are in this country ...)

And ladies should be proper, subservient, and cook and clean for their men?

[Swalload]

I remember the tv show "blind date" where they go trampolining and have dinners and go movies, my dates never ever looked like that.

Rofl these shows are crazy. Anyway the dates were planned by producers to make the show entertaining, if it was all normal dates it would have flopped big time.

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And ladies should be proper, subservient, and cook and clean for their men?

That's really not what he's saying lol, you're pushing it.

[Ashrynn]

I actually feel uncomfortable not paying on a first date. It's the way I was raised and I think if you ask someone out(which I always seem to be the one doing) you should be ready to actually treat that person. If the other person brings up going dutch then I'll concede the point of course, otherwise it's always been the respectful thing to do imo.

That said? This article was just o-o wtf...?

[Hilhen7]

Rofl these shows are crazy. Anyway the dates were planned by producers to make the show entertaining, if it was all normal dates it would have flopped big time.

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That's really not what he's saying lol, you're pushing it.

A gender role is gender role. Who decides what's proper and improper?

[IIamaKing]

I personally value loyalty and a degree of obedience and manageability in boyfriends or my husband now. The sex is good, he is easy to satisfy and he is loyal and largely does what he is told and we enjoy the same things and let one another have hobbies outside the other person.

Sounds more like you want a dog lol.

[Dwarfhamster]

Yet people make it a big deal if they don't.

I'm saying paying for the meal isn't a big deal for guys to moan and groan about.

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And ladies should be proper, subservient, and cook and clean for their men?

Straws--you're grasping at them.

[Swalload]

A gender role is gender role. Who decides what's proper and improper?

Social constructs come from what the vast majority of people enjoyed doing. It's not a proof of what's proper or improper, it's not decided by media or an evil mastermind, it's just a trend basically. Everyone is free to not be cool with that and do things their own way. We're all individual.

[lummiuster]

I truly believe that this is the main reason why men earn more than women. Even if we would start a movement where we would stop paying for women, some of us would still do it to show our superiority over the other men because this is what males do to reproduce.
Then our brain associate wealth with superiority and superiority with having women. We then get this strong desire of making good money as if there was no alternative to success in life. In life, most people get what they want when they work for it. And so I believe that on average men are more paid because their motivation is bounded to their nature that they can't escape from.

[Kumorii]

I'm saying paying for the meal isn't a big deal for guys to moan and groan about.

Yeah, and I'm saying people who moan and groan about them not paying is making a big deal out of it.

I find the entire thing as a non big deal, which means it goes for both involved.

[The One Percent]

If you agree to go on a date, you should expect to pay your share. The date is to test compatibility, not get a free meal.

[Hilhen7]

I truly believe that this is the main reason why men earn more than women. Even if we would start a movement where we would stop paying for women, some of us would still do it to show our superiority over the other men because this is what males do to reproduce.
Then our brain associate wealth with superiority and superiority with having women. We then get this strong desire of making good money as if there was no alternative to success in life. In life, most people get what they want when they work for it. And so I believe that on average men are more paid because their motivation is bounded to their nature that they can't escape from.

Honestly women are just as competitive when trying to obtain a desirable mate. People have just been programed by society to accept certain things without question.

(Certain gender roles / stereotypes)
Men should pay.
Men should be strong / aggressive.
Women should be gentle / kind.
Black men are well endowed.
Black women are less desirable.

[Mistame]

The biggest causes of divorce are still money and sexual problems. So, emotions alone don't work.

This biggest cause of divorce is marriage.

I personally value loyalty and a degree of obedience and manageability in boyfriends or my husband now. The sex is good, he is easy to satisfy and he is loyal and largely does what he is told and we enjoy the same things and let one another have hobbies outside the other person.

If that works for you and him, cheers. But the first time my partner decided to give me orders, they'd be flying ass-first out the front door. There are a lot of things some people would call petty that I've no tolerance for. The "bossy" type is one of them. A relationship is only as valid as it is convenient.

Come on, gentlemen, grow a pair of balls and just pitch for the first date. Doesn't matter who asked who out, if she insists on paying half, or whatever. (If she is legit getting pissed that you won't let her cover half the meal, she has deeper issues and you'd want to avoid her anyway.) If you're tight on funds, get lunch or coffee or dessert and not a dinner date. If you're doing a meal/movie combo, then let her pay for the movies (or whatever you do afterward). But make the effort to pay for the meal--it's not a big deal, it's not about what's "fair", it's not about feminism, or about keeping the man down. It's what gentlemen do.

Why should someone fork out good money for a date who may turn out to be a psycho? A date is a mutual meeting to get to know one another. You're not even friends yet. When I go to dinner with friends, I expect them to pay for their meal. A date is no different and the experience shouldn't have to be a net loss for "reasons".

(And people wonder where all the "men" are in this country ...)

There is no standard on what makes a "man". This type of drivel is why we have "incels".

[Fitsu]

I enjoy how she initiates the post with sense before going full crazy-feminist on us spouting untrue and repeatedly debunked facts. "Women on average earn less than men" Yes, women also on average DECIDE to have less demanding/lower pay jobs, if a man and a woman are both equally capable and correct for a job role then there is no company in a 1st world country that would hire a man over a women if they could pay the women 1/3 less and get the exact same out of them. In a world so full of huge and real societal problems for all people it angers me when the ones front and centre are always the ones that simply are not true... Media doing it's job again I guess, keeping the masses distracted with lies to hide the truth.

The notion that because they choose to spend ludicrous amounts on appearance should also get them a free meal? Or that somehow there "expected to be calmer" than men? I mean for one the fact that you choose to spend a lot on cloths holds no argument in this situation and the notion that Men have no appearance/social requirements in this society is again ludicrous... In fact there seems to be a whole lot about how it's so hard to be a women on this post while 0 comment about the difficulties of being a man in current society.

The majority of complaints she makes are purely decisions she chooses to make and both genders have there own set of societal problems at the moment to deal with. From the Rape/Men can't cry culture that has caused people to be afraid to even engage with each other out of fear that it might lead to prison (this is just insane btw, we're a society afraid to socialise) to not being able to show emotions in fear of being looked at as weak. Women also ofcourse have socialite problems with being able to express themselves , being undermined and potential viewed as a sex object. There are many more on both sides, point is both genders have there issues at the moment none of which constitutes to getting a free meal.

Anyway.... Rant over and on topic, I think it comes down to circumstance. I do not think income should dictate who pays, but I do think it largely comes down to who invites who. If I ask a girl out, I would pay because I invited them out... If a girl asked me out, I would probably expect them to pay. If things go on further than that it would usually come down to taking turns. Also, if one were far more wealthy than the other and took them out to a place way behind the others price range then naturally they should pay. Then there is the situation of people who are friends that eventually evolves into dating and that's much easier because you know each other and can simply discuss it.

[Xar226]

I'm a bit old fashioned, so my inclination is always to pay even though I'm not sure that dynamic really exists in gay communities the way it does (or did) in straight ones. If somebody wants to stop me and split the bill or pay it I'm certainly not going to stop them, but I go in with the expectation that I will be reaching for the bill.

I don't really care if that is how it "should" be or if it's "fair" to me or the other person. I just consider that the cost of pursuing a relationship. If the relationship is progressing the way I want it to, then it's money well spent. If not, it needs to end to free both of us to look for partners who want the same things at the same pace. It's really not something I get worked up over, and if I was ever with somebody who legitimately made me feel used that would be the end of it -- which is exactly as it should be, because something about that relationship is obviously toxic.

[Hilhen7]

Why should someone fork out good money for a date who may turn out to be a psycho? A date is a mutual meeting to get to know one another. You're not even friends yet. When I go to dinner with friends, I expect them to pay for their meal. A date is no different and the experience shouldn't have to be a net loss for "reasons".

Exactly, why does the social norm suddenly change when going out with friends and going out with a female?

Logically I would have to make the assumption that females can't afford to pay, or that the female is offering something the male isn't or is more desirable then her counterpart. (Unless provided with another reasonable assertion)

Otherwise people should pay for the food that they consume as usual.