The warmode and the people ruining it

[arboachg]

make warmode free for all and let the "if it red its dead" guys have meaningful pvp with themselves.

Why not just keep to your PVE Server/Non-warmode mentality and leave the rest of us alone? Isn't it ironic, considering people cry so much about being ganked and harassed? I know!

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Right, I don't think you understood at all what I meant.

The examples I posted earlier we're acceptable things for the time, until people spoke up and pushed for change. If no one did, things probably wouldn't have changed.

Blizzard has deemed it acceptable, and we need to try to change their mind and show why it's a negative thing for the game overall. Why should a tiny fraction of the population that causes trouble be allowed to remain? What good does griefing bring to the game? It's a detriment, it makes warmode more imbalanced and could lead to people just trying the game out to leave. They're bad for the overall population and hurt the game, while having no benefit to the game. Why should they remain? Hands off policies btw are more about saving money than anything. They don't want to deal with the extra support that PVP servers would need.

It doesn't matter how long it's been this way, if people don't push for change it'll never happen, and it may not happen either way, but that doesn't mean people shouldn't try.

Also, your player solution doesn't work so well when there aren't any high levels willing to rescue you, which is likely to happen given the fact that there are so few Alli in warmode. At least before with PVP servers some people hunted gankers, but with sharding and stuff that's all gone. Blizzard and the Imbalance have effectively removed the only "solution" low level players have.

Play with war mode turned off then. It really is just that simple.

[Jazzhands]

Why not just keep to your PVE Server/Non-warmode mentality and leave the rest of us alone? Isn't it ironic, considering people cry so much about being ganked and harassed? I know!

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Play with war mode turned off then. It really is just that simple.

I hope for your own sake you aren't this dense. If this is some weird attempt at trolling, all you're accomplishing is making yourself look really ignorant.

If you aren't this dense, want to actually counter my arguments and tell me why the current state of warmode is fine? Except, Blizzard is trying to fix it, because it's not. Blizzard has deemed warmodes imbalance as an issue, and your answer of "just leave" as wrong, seeing as they want people to do the opposite. You are part of the problem, when you should try to be part of the solution.

They won't be able to balance populations without removing a large amount of Horde, and the best option for that is to simply remove the buff. If you want to really PVP you should have no issues with it going away because it will make more actual pvp happen.

[SirCowdog]

To be fair, the last thing you want in war is a fight were your opponent has a chance of winning.

In a real war yea. But this is a videogame.

What happens when you don't give the other side even a fighting chance in a videogame is that they stop playing. This is what's happening right now in war mode, and what we're trying to solve.

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Play with war mode turned off then. It really is just that simple.

It's not that simple because blizzard has complicated it with adding pve talents and rewards for war mode.

[Anoikis]

Take warmode out of the game.
Make it a part of the charakter customization window.

Create a PvE Charakter:
There will be no PvP in the game. No more flagging by NPC's from the opposite fraction. No more flagging by areas. Just PvE.

Create a PvP Charakter:
No more PvE content. No levelling. Carakters are all at max level. Get rewards from PvP tasks.

Done!

[Vamandrac]

Take warmode out of the game.
Make it a part of the charakter customization window.

Create a PvE Charakter:
There will be no PvP in the game. No more flagging by NPC's from the opposite fraction. No more flagging by areas. Just PvE.

Create a PvP Charakter:
No more PvE content. No levelling. Carakters are all at max level. Get rewards from PvP tasks.

Done!

They aren't going to completely separate PvE/PvP content at this point as that would just require more resources to maintain.

[arboachg]

I hope for your own sake you aren't this dense. If this is some weird attempt at trolling, all you're accomplishing is making yourself look really ignorant.

If you aren't this dense, want to actually counter my arguments and tell me why the current state of warmode is fine? Except, Blizzard is trying to fix it, because it's not. Blizzard has deemed warmodes imbalance as an issue, and your answer of "just leave" as wrong, seeing as they want people to do the opposite. You are part of the problem, when you should try to be part of the solution.

They won't be able to balance populations without removing a large amount of Horde, and the best option for that is to simply remove the buff. If you want to really PVP you should have no issues with it going away because it will make more actual pvp happen.

There will never not be an imbalance and your suggestions will only neuter the concept of pvp further. You have no idea how glad I am that you weren't there to ruin WoW back in its golden years.

By the way, please, *please* stay away from WoW Classic. I don't need your incessant whining about fairness infecting that game.

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In a real war yea. But this is a videogame.

What happens when you don't give the other side even a fighting chance in a videogame is that they stop playing. This is what's happening right now in war mode, and what we're trying to solve.

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It's not that simple because blizzard has complicated it with adding pve talents and rewards for war mode.

Yeah, they never should have added war mode in the first place.

[SirCowdog]

Yeah, they never should have added war mode in the first place.

It's not so much that they never should have added it. It's that they shouldn't have halfassed it.

If they were going to make an entire conversion of the open world into a PVP environment, that would have been amazing! When you turn on War Mode, all the WQs convert to PVP only objectives. Have a completely separate progression path, with gear and azerite talents and the whole nine yards devoted specifically and totally to PVP. A FULLY fleshed out feature that could have incorporated elements of islands and warfronts and fit the theme of the faction war perfectly.

But taking what is otherwise 99.999% PVE content and just slapping PVP onto it is lazy, weak, and doomed to failure. No amount of PVE benefit or bonus will make it good.

[alturic]

I get it, it's "World PvP", but honestly the only thing I hated about World PvP in any game was the ganking. I don't mind 1-2 people attacking me, but 3+ it's pretty much run. Granted as disc it was more a nusance than anything running away watching them poor people try to kill me, but if I could enforce some sort of rules it would be +/-X levels can't attack, and some sort of limit of player limit attacking 1 person, outside of structured PvP.

[Donald Hellscream]

Blizzard should make it harder for players to camp quest hubs, not impossible but just more challenging so that there is less of a chance of them spending hours wasting their life doing something that doesn't progress their character in any way.

[WoWDontu]

Step 1: Hearthstone
Step 2: Turn off warmode
Step 3: ???
Step 4: Profit

[Witchblade77]

one of my favorite things about now defunct Warhammer online was the way it handled high level ganking. if you outleveled the area and came back to gank low level players in it? the moment you kill one, you were turned into a chicken. you had no fighting skills and you had 1 hit point. I thought this was absolutely brilliant. and warhammer btw was mostly pvp oriented game. so yes, I think high level players who go back to gank lowbies? are chickens and should be turned into one.

[Sansnom]

Right, I don't think you understood at all what I meant.

The examples I posted earlier we're acceptable things for the time, until people spoke up and pushed for change. If no one did, things probably wouldn't have changed.

Blizzard has deemed it acceptable, and we need to try to change their mind and show why it's a negative thing for the game overall.

You seriously comparing women suffrage and social injustice with a perceived problem in a video game? Because if you are, how much effort have you made to correct currect issue in real life as you spending for you own problem in a video game?

You knew what you signing up to. You were informed this would happen. Now you want to change to make it fair in a system that was never intended to be fair.

There is a different between a problem in the game and a personal problem with the game. The two are different.

Why should a tiny fraction of the population that causes trouble be allowed to remain? What good does griefing bring to the game? It's a detriment, it makes warmode more imbalanced and could lead to people just trying the game out to leave. They're bad for the overall population and hurt the game, while having no benefit to the game.

It doesn't matter how long it's been this way, if people don't push for change it'll never happen, and it may not happen either way, but that doesn't mean people shouldn't try.

So it is a tiny fraction of the population. So tell me. How many times have you been affected by ganking and camping? Just so we understand how much at least you personally have been affected. 1% of your playtime? 2%?

I have been camped twice in my early years when I was levelling. Ganked, a bit more times. Unlucky to be in the wrong place at the wrong time and crossed path with a high level toon. They one shotted me and continued their way.

Also, your player solution doesn't work so well when there aren't any high levels willing to rescue you, which is likely to happen given the fact that there are so few Alli in warmode. At least before with PVP servers some people hunted gankers, but with sharding and stuff that's all gone. Blizzard and the Imbalance have effectively removed the only "solution" low level players have.

It is not my solution. I do not work for Blizzard. I was never part of the designed. This is Blizzard's solution. This what they want to encourage world PvP.

[Torrasque]

Warmode is all about abusing other players. If anything, the winning team should get more out of it than the losing team.

Seriously, if you enable War Mode as a Alliance, you deserve to be griefed and camped. Alliance players play Alliance because they enjoy losing to Horde, that is why they play it. Consider that they have never been the seriously taken faction ever. Horde player ALWAYS get to rock Alliance from BOTH the narrative perspective AND the gameplay perspective. Blizzard Devs almost always main Horde. Horde quests have more agency and far more interesting narratives.

Being Alliance is about being the submissive player that enjoys getting bent over by the Horde player. It's literally always been that way. Why should something that works be fixed?

[Sansnom]

It's a problem with the game when the design of it, followed by neglect from the devs, causes players to stop playing.

You probably do not about what used to happen in PvP before WoW. Before, it was called PK, player kill. Before, players can loot your corpse in some games. So you think there is a problem with Blizzard's design? Blizzard removed all the penalties that existed with earlier PK concepts. They also removed PvP as mandatory for those who do not wish to participate in it.

Which is working so well in War Mode right now?

The reason they prefer a user solution is because it saves them dev time. The problem with this is that Blizzard created the problem with the poor design and implementation in the first place, but are putting it on the players to fix it.

What a load of garbage THAT is.

You have the option not to go in with warmode. You want a fair fight PvP, you do that with BG or arena. If it was not the bonus, I doubt many would even touch it. At least now, people are not stuck with PvP in a PvP server that they joined simply due to their friends being on that server.

[Ssateneth]

PVE babies upset that a feature that encourages world PVP causes world PVP, which is not intended to be balanced anyways. Nobody is forcing you to turn on war mode. If you don't like world PVP, which by nature has always been unbalanced, don't turn on features that encourages PVP. /thread

[Roarocz]

If you dont like it while leveling then stop using it.

Clearly this is about someone wanting to use warmode cause of the XP bonus but doesnt want the draw backs like being ganked.

Agreed here, know your risks and rewards. Rules of it are clear.

[Ssateneth]

Take warmode out of the game.
Make it a part of the charakter customization window.

Create a PvE Charakter:
There will be no PvP in the game. No more flagging by NPC's from the opposite fraction. No more flagging by areas. Just PvE.

Create a PvP Charakter:
No more PvE content. No levelling. Carakters are all at max level. Get rewards from PvP tasks.

Done!

Bad solution. Whats preventing me from griefing opposite faction by killing critical quest NPCs that they need in order to progress?

[seleri]

14 years later people are still complaining about this like it's going to do change something. Now that you can easily opt out of it even if you were on a PvP server, there's even less reason for Blizzard to change the status quo. Other than extreme circumstances (like camping certain players/NPCs for days on end) Blizzard has always been fine with ganking, be it 40v1 or a level 60 vs a level 20. This is one of the things where Blizzard is obviously not going to change their mind and complaining about it on forums is only useful for venting.

If you want to try to get them to change something about all of this, try to get them to let you use your hearthstone as a ghost so you can safely get back to your capital to turn off war mode instead of having to wait for the ganker(s) to leave.

[InfiniteCharger]

A 120 decimating a 35 or whatever isn't fighting. It's just one sided slaughter.

This has always been the problem with the way Blizzard manages PVP. In a game where levels determine power, letting high level players one shot low level players will always be unfair to the low level players.

The problem with this is that if someone is actually looking to take the risk of PVPing with people in their level range they ALSO have to deal with gankers.

That means someone who'd like to PVP at their level (or close to it) has two choices:

1) Leave WM on and deal with being ganked. Sometimes repeatedly, disrupting their game play. Oddly, this values the rights and enjoyment of the ganker over that of the lower level player.

2) Turn off WM, lose the chance of PVP at level but also avoid ganking. This is a valid choice but how many of those people will reenable WM at 120 when their experience has been that WM is a pain in the ass?

Yes Blizzard has mismanaged PVP in the game. However, how many folks are actually out in the world leveling alts at 20, 30, 40? It is far fewer than those playing at max level. Trying to "fix" the game so that the relative minority of folks who are out there at low levels don't get ganked is a waste of time and effort. And lets be honest, most of these people are leveling alts for the nth time. So why do they have war mode on in the first place? If they want to level as fast as possible just turn off war mode and b done with it. Now if there were a whole bunch of brand new players "stuck" in war mode getting ganked that would be one thing but we know this isn't the case and a lot of people crying so hard about it were warned when Blizzard first announced war mode that it wouldn't stop ganking. And really now that you have the toggle then just turn it off if you don't want to be bothered when leveling.

[Mysterymask]

It's not that simple because blizzard has complicated it with adding pve talents and rewards for war mode.

10% extra stuff..and some talents that you wouldn't of missed if you never turned it on...

I mean is the extra buff from the PVP talents going to make or break your questing? You can't take them to dungeons, raids, or island expeditions and I don't imagine anyone cares if you do a little more damage on a world boss real question is....are those talents really worth the risk of being murdered randomly?