The fun story about Master Looter being gone:
The people who HEAVILY advocated for it to be removed, where the people not playing in any guild that used it anyway.
So for the "staunch defenders of fairness", nothing got better by removing master looter from the game, and they are now long gone, likely directing their irrational rage at some other game element that doesn't affect them at all.
It's not gone for me
;-)
That's not how some guilds work, and I don't disagree that it feels bad to have something just to give it away (similar to paying bills, if you auto-deduct from your paycheck it's like you never had it, but if the cash was in your hand and you forked it over, that feels different ).
Part of the issue is that only the ones who push progression hard do all the things to figure out who benefits the most, then sends it out to whomever they deem appropriate, while most of the 'casual guilds' (which make up the majority of the playerbase) would just simply do a roll-off and best roll wins.
You gotta remember, the Mythic scene is the small scene, but that's also the scene that benefits from full agency that ML gives.
This is most likely why Blizz did away with it and will probably stand firm on it until such a time (if ever) that the pressure from the players forces their hand.
I've been a part of guilds who used EPGP, loot council with officers (I was RL but not GL for this, so that was extra boring), SKS, you name it, I've been through it.
I can honestly say in my experience that PL is perfectly fine.
But.
I get it, PL hurts you and your group, and it makes sense why (feels bad, can't trade, etc), which is why I want ML back in some fashion; to alleviate the stress you and yours feel, even though I probably won't use it myself.
Maybe some of the more casual guilds would use ML again, maybe not, but it's definitely worth re-enabling in some way to let players figure it out themselves.
Did LFR ever have Master Loot? Because otherwise I don't understand why all these LFR heroes comment on a forum about ML.
Accurate which is why I would never want someone who actually wants personal loot on a raid team I was on because they only care about themselves not about downing bosses except for more gear for themselves.
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You don't need a guild to raid heroic lols
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sure you were bud and when's the last time you raided in an actual guild?
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You ever think that your history of guild hopping multiple times over a single xpac might be why you didn't get gear as a trial or I'm guessing pass your trial. It's a massive red flag to gms unless a guild straight up dies. Also trials usually don't get gear except tier or if nobody needs it or if they are in for prog. Once they pass trial they get showered in loot to catch them up but there is no point in wasting gear on someone who isn't in for prog and could just leave or use you as a stepping stone.
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You mean exactly what it was in legion?????????
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Officers tend to be prio for legendary because they have been with the guild for years and aren't as likely to get poached for that orange staff to kill spine as the mage who joined a month ago and just passed trial. Mounts are usually rolled on by all raiders with occasionally a guild specifically choosing to give the first one to the gm, rl or just a standout player who stopped the kill from wiping but usually just rolled. Loot prio is usually highest dps who will be there for every prog fight since tanks should get enough eh from full heroic gear which is fairly easy to achieve in two weeks. Sometimes a healer set bonus will be prioritized if it's broken but usually it's damage > all til farm once eh and healing requirements are met.
It's true it's not universal. But there are ways to reduce the possibility of getting into such a guild. Carefully researching it, for one, checking their /gquit history. If there seems to be a lot of people leaving regularly and they have a large turnover rate, it's pretty clear there is something wrong with it. And in any case, I'm guessing no guild that remotely cares about their progress will do that, simply because they can't progress if they keep gearing up a few people that are in good standings with the leadership and ignoring everyone else. Of course there will still be a possibility.
But, as many posters here have already stated many times, despite the official explanation, the introduction of PL was by no means a way of reducing the chance of ML being abused, if that was the case, they would have left ML a choice for guild raids. The reason is clearly that they wanted to slow down the gearing process, so that players would stay subbed for a longer time. Apparently they didn't predict that players aren't going to just swallow the RNG system thrown at them and quit even faster (and in many cases, probably for good) instead of just taking a break between tiers, as many did.
Well, yeah, it's like those Korean MMOs with their upgrade systems. Blow money on an item (or get a drop), then blow money on the upgrade lottery that gets harder with every level. Except there, assuming you had enough gold, you could be relatively sure that you will get those upgrades in place eventually, and you can do it repeatedly until you do. In WoW, you can't blow gold, it's pure lottery that you only get one shot a week at.
I always assumed blizzard removed master looter as it simplified the game for developers and it had little to do with what was best for the players. I base the conclusion essentially on you could argue in favor of either system, so for best player experience you could just leave both in place so the only real reason not to is because it simplifies the game from a technical point of view.
Cuts down on CS tickets as well. Yes, there were ML-related tickets from guild groups. Many positives.
The positive for us is that there are so many threads as this one which are extremely entertaining.
I wonder how long will "I want my ML back" threads pop up on MMO-C? Will we get manned flight to Mars before the ML-dream dies for good?
I still disagree with their reasoning for removing ML. While I do support ML returning I can see the merits behind both sides of the argument. Because of that though it just seems like the most logical thing to do would leave the choice of whether to use it in players' hands.
ML will be back in 9.0 when they revert all their shitty bfa designs due to sub loss.
Being in a guild group right now doesn't mean that you'll never pug.
And there are actual game mechanics based around ilvl, it's not just related to PUGging.
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Nothing got better for you maybe. Blizzard wouldn't have gone to all this trouble if people submitting tickets about master loot wasn't a significant issue.
ML with EPGP was by far the most equitable and reasonable way for guilds to distribute loot fairly. I ran my team on EPGP since cata with 0 loot disputes because the system was so transparently fair. Like most things the dev team has gone after, eliminating ML was a fix to a non existent problem. Sure, if you were 12 years old and couldn't find a group of sane adults to raid with, you might have problems, but that isn't a majority issue. Most of us were chilling in our guilds calmly distributing loot equitably for years. But Ion et al saw a windmill they needed to tilt at. Just like ability pruning. Just like GCD fuckery. Just like cmode removal for whatever half-baked esports ploy m+ is. Just like the removal of 10H. The list goes on. They will keep hamstringing their loyal players until the game is unrecognizable and we all retire to raise our children or go outside or something. Such is life.
Honestly this deep into mythic raiding, no one is complaining about Personal Loot.
Everyone is gearing up. Sure there are some bad streaks but... if you're 380+ you're doing just fine, kid.
I recall in a blue post they explained it.
ML allows for gear funnel and allocation, meaning gear wont be wasted. But the downside is people participating the raid do not feel directly rewarded, they are playing to gear for them and other players, following an artifical rule set my the leader. By using personal loot, there is little allocation within the raid, so less politics problems. Any player in the raid can get upgrade for their main/off spec easily just by playing the game, none will take the loot away if the person likes; no favourism at all. This has problem as well, as some items get wasted. The solution is simply boosting the drop rate to compensate.
So the ML problem was solved by PL, and the PL problem was solved by increasing the drop rate. In other word, Blizzard has won