Academics unite against ‘eugenicist’ given Cambridge fellowship

[derpkitteh]

https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/racism

yes, i know that.

but recognition of those things itself isn't racist or sexist, hating someone for those things is. recognition of those things is also not saying every member of that race/gender will like those things, too.

you must be able to recognize reality, and the truths of reality. otherwise you're a child holding their ears and hiding their eyes from what makes you uncomfortable.

[Underverse]

>Social science

>Pseudo science

I can see how some people can get confused here.

[zorkuus]

yes, i know that.

but recognition of those things itself isn't racist or sexist, hating someone for those things is. recognition of those things is also not saying every member of that race/gender will like those things, too.

you must be able to recognize reality, and the truths of reality. otherwise you're a child holding their ears and hiding their eyes from what makes you uncomfortable.

The thing is, you haven't recognized anything. All you did was say there's genetic differences between sexes that attribute to behavior = that must apply to race too. Not very scientific.

[PaladinBash]

Man says obvious facts like "people living in a shitty area that 'migrants' live in and get robbed or attacked by them routinely think that 'migrants' are a bad thing for them" is accused of racism. It does not get more blatant than this. That's not hyperbole, that's not exaggeration, that's exactly the level of bullshit they are spewing at this guy. That is what they are absolutely 100% straight out saying. There is no mask, no hidden agenda, no sneaky scheme. They are saying exactly that and people are defending it.

Is shit like this going to be used against people once the right gets power? Oh you better believe it is. You better believe that after decades of this nonsense being pushed on a generation of people that the backlash is going to be absolutely savage and nobody is going to give a flying fuck.

[PC2]

i do know that it is a fact that at least for men and women, our brains work differently.

The difference is just a residual effect passed to us from our pre-human ancestors. After humans evolved computation and culture it necessarily means that all human brains universally work the same.

[Mormolyce]

"200 people can't be wrong!"

200 academics vs one dummy on an internet forum.

Yeah, I'm going to go with them.

[Magical Mudcrab]

"The left" is the party of science.

"The right" is the party of "climate change isn't real/isn't caused by humans/maybe it is caused by humans but there's nothing we can do about it" narrative fueled by the whims of petro dollars. And let's not forget the "evolution is a myth" and "teach the controversy" crowds. THAT is anti-science. Anti hard, quantifiable, science.

I've never really gotten the whole "The left is the party of science" thing. Sure, I think it's undeniable that Republicans in the US are the ones most likely to try and portray climate change as being a myth. However, it's liberals that are more likely to push things like the vaccine denial, homeopathic and alternative medicine, etc. It has always come across as a little silly, at least to me, when people state that Liberals or Conservatives are more scientific than the other, when both sides have people who deny science to benefit themselves or to fit their beliefs.

[Kudos]

Quillette did a write up on this, with some responses from other academics.

https://quillette.com/2018/12/07/aca...-be-denounced/

[Mormolyce]

I've never really gotten the whole "The left is the party of science" thing. Sure, I think it's undeniable that Republicans in the US are the ones most likely to try and portray climate change as being a myth. However, it's liberals that are more likely to push things like the vaccine denial, homeopathic and alternative medicine, etc.

Anti-vaxx isn't left wing. Shit, Trump is an anti-vaxxer.

Apparently it's just related to how crazy you are:

When relating the answers to these questions in the Pew surveys to people’s political views, I find an interesting divergence. The more conservative and also the more liberal someone is, the more likely he or she is to believe that vaccination is unsafe.

https://theconversation.com/anti-vac...rization-81001

Homeopathy and alternative medicine are hippy stuff, and hippies are typically left wing, but they've never been actual left wing policies.

- - - Updated - - -

Quillette did a write up on this, with some responses from other academics.

https://quillette.com/2018/12/07/aca...-be-denounced/

Quillette is a site for quacks, loons and shitlords. Basically, a front for the alt right that attempts to give their nonsense a veneer of intellectualism.

[pfbe]

"Academics"

Was this an attempt at an appeal to authority? kinda sad. It might have worked, say, 20 years ago, but nowadays everyone and their dog goes through college, and so we all know first hand that "Academic" can mean anything from a Nobel laureate to a run-of-the-mill dipshit who publishes papers analyzing patriarchal subtext in children's coloring books. It no longer packs the punch it used to.

[Ysho]

"The left" is the party of science.

"The right" is the party of "climate change isn't real/isn't caused by humans/maybe it is caused by humans but there's nothing we can do about it" narrative fueled by the whims of petro dollars. And let's not forget the "evolution is a myth" and "teach the controversy" crowds. THAT is anti-science. Anti hard, quantifiable, science.


So pitch that crap elsewhere. A few "leftists" quibbling on Tumblr about gender pronouns is not equal to the institutionalized science denial that has become a major part of the conservative platform.

The smug pseudo-intellectualism of people on "the left" makes me want to vomit into a garbage can. So you think you're smarter than others, that your ideas are the only ideas worth considering, are smug and pompous, talk down to those who oppose your ideas. Which Republican current US president does this sound EXACTLY like??

Oh the irony. You are exactly who you hate.

[Kuntantee]

There is a reason these genes IQ bla bla is considered with extreme cynicism because there is no concrete proof supporting it. If one of professors publish such horsecrap, he shouldn't stand before the students. He should be fired.

[floppydk]

The smug pseudo-intellectualism of people on "the left" makes me want to vomit into a garbage can. So you think you're smarter than others, that your ideas are the only ideas worth considering, are smug and pompous, talk down to those who oppose your ideas. Which Republican current US president does this sound EXACTLY like??

Oh the irony. You are exactly who you hate.

Holy shit, thank you for that post. I keep finding myself reading these "echo chamber" threads where it's just post after post of self absorbed, "academic" man-children dribbling on at hilarious levels of hypocrisy. It's nice to see not everyone who uses these websites is a brain dead pussy.

[Fojos]

This is disgusting. The ideological left yet again shamelessly committing libel.

There is a reason these genes IQ bla bla is considered with extreme cynicism because there is no concrete proof supporting it. If one of professors publish such horsecrap, he shouldn't stand before the students. He should be fired.

That's why you study everything you absolute donkey. Do you not realize that studies are there to look for evidence? Are you really that behind?


I can't fucking wait for the real extreme right to take over again to crush the regressive left and maybe balance the scales so eventually we can have a society based on the views on the enlightenment again.

The idiot left has been against nuclear power for ages now, I wonder what they will say now that IPCC says we need much more of it.

[d00mGuArD]

Racism and sexism is about discrimination in either direction. It's not sexist to say men and women are different. It's not racist to say that races are different.

As for races, look at the Olympics, and keep track of what race of people generally win what things. This is hard proof that at physical levels there's a difference in races, which mean that there are differences in the genes. Then it's also safe to state that there's probably differences in cognative performance as well.

So to state that you feel it's discriminatory to look into this, that's where I say, let the research speak for itself, I don't care about your feelings.

Of course there are differences. It is called Diversity!
Anyone saying there are no differences is Diversity-denier!

[Grimbold21]

I've not read Noah Carl's papers, but the accusations are potentially career ending if true and I've not seen a specific citation of his work given as a reference to prove the allegations. The only thing that seems to be a problem is that outlets like Infowars and other far-right organizations have mentioned his work, but knowing the integrity of those outlets it's more likely than not that Carl's work is being misrepresented. That said, I lean a little against the allegations if only because I put trust in Cambridge's selection process when granting people fellowship, as it's essentially an endorsement of the person's work. If Carl was regularly publishing racist pseudoscience as the complaint alleges, I don't think he would have been offered the fellowship in the first place.

It's not a hill I'm willing to die on, but the allegations seem frivolous.

You've not read any of his papers. Guess what his accusers are being accused of too.

https://quillette.com/2018/12/07/aca...-be-denounced/

- - - Updated - - -

Anti-vaxx isn't left wing. Shit, Trump is an anti-vaxxer.

Apparently it's just related to how crazy you are:


https://theconversation.com/anti-vac...rization-81001

Homeopathy and alternative medicine are hippy stuff, and hippies are typically left wing, but they've never been actual left wing policies.

- - - Updated - - -



Quillette is a site for quacks, loons and shitlords. Basically, a front for the alt right that attempts to give their nonsense a veneer of intellectualism.

So within your logical frame, Quillete is the alt right version of The Guardian

[Techno-Druid]

this is the case for men and women, i don't see why it wouldn't be the case for other races.

To most modern anthropologists, race (at least our societal constructs of it based entirely on appearance and not genetics) is mostly looked at as folk science.

Think about this, for 300,000 years anatomically modern humans have existed, but as far as we know, the vast majority of that time was spent with us in Africa and as a result, Africa is the most genetically and ethnically diverse continent in the world, with the Indian Subcontinent being the close second.

YouTuber c0nc0rdance did a good video covering the subject and the science of human diversity, better than I could.

[derpkitteh]

To most modern anthropologists, race (at least our societal constructs of it based entirely on appearance and not genetics) is mostly looked at as folk science.

Think about this, for 300,000 years anatomically modern humans have existed, but as far as we know, the vast majority of that time was spent with us in Africa and as a result, Africa is the most genetically and ethnically diverse continent in the world, with the Indian Subcontinent being the close second.
[video=youtube;teyvcs2S4mI]https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=youtu.be&v=teyvcs2S4mI[video]
YouTuber c0nc0rdance did a good video covering the subject and the science of human diversity, better than I could.

i mean, i'm not saying i personally believe anything really. if i'm shown evidence either way, i'll believe what i'm shown. i don't ultimately care anyway, it's not like i'm gonna treat anyone different from how i normally do.

in my mind, races aren't the problem with some people, it's cultures. some cultures are just inferior to others.

but denial of reality is becoming much more widespread lately. it's mostly in left leaning people from what i see. then you've got right leaning people and they have issues with denying reality as well. my main problem with the banning of this guy is that if there are ultimately differences in people, and it's suppressed, that's scary to me. the suppression of knowledge is a terrifying thing.

imagine never knowing that the persians ever existed, because rome wiped out all evidence and never allowed anyone to speak of it again. that would have been a factual people that existed, gone entirely because some people had a problem with it and thought you shouldn't know.

[Deleted]

There is a reason these genes IQ bla bla is considered with extreme cynicism because there is no concrete proof supporting it. If one of professors publish such horsecrap, he shouldn't stand before the students. He should be fired.

What has no support? The validity of IQ and the general factor of intelligence, g, is the most empirically supported concept in all of psychology.

[Kaleredar]

The smug pseudo-intellectualism of people on "the left" makes me want to vomit into a garbage can. So you think you're smarter than others, that your ideas are the only ideas worth considering, are smug and pompous, talk down to those who oppose your ideas. Which Republican current US president does this sound EXACTLY like??

Oh the irony. You are exactly who you hate.

No.

We have data to back us up.

The weight of data and statistics is not "an opinion" you are free to have, especially when one is completely incapable of formulating an educated opinion on the matter.

The fact that it snows, and that snow can be seen by some bumpkin in a flyover state, does not hold equal merit to decades of climate research done by researchers the world over.

You in no way, shape, or form hold the "superior science."

I've never really gotten the whole "The left is the party of science" thing. Sure, I think it's undeniable that Republicans in the US are the ones most likely to try and portray climate change as being a myth. However, it's liberals that are more likely to push things like the vaccine denial, homeopathic and alternative medicine, etc. It has always come across as a little silly, at least to me, when people state that Liberals or Conservatives are more scientific than the other, when both sides have people who deny science to benefit themselves or to fit their beliefs.

You will find very few liberal politicians pitching "anti-vaxxine" rhetoric.

Meanwhile, anti-climate change rhetoric can be seen from numerous conservative politicians, including the sitting president.

As a decidedly "left" person, I strongly object to any claim to either side being a "party of science." The "left" denies science all the time. Whether playing ostrich with controversial social research they don't like or being anti-vaccination or anti-GMO or whatever.

Yes climate is a potentially catastrophic science denial on the right. But don't pretend the left isn't willing to stunt social progress, endanger the weak, young and old, and waste time masturbating about frankenfood. Science is the party of science. We don't have a right or left bias. We have a reality bias.

If you'd like to pitch it that way, then the institutions of science and the promotion of things like education fall more squarely into the purview of the left, and certainly not the right.

Except now "the left" denies biological essentialism regarding biological differences between men and women. And this is coming out of universities, so yes, it is party institutionalised science denial is as much a part of the left as it is on the right.

Saying that a study is unfounded or needs more research to be substantiated is not the same thing as plugging one's ears and saying that because snow falls climate change must not exist.

And extrapolating those findings, were they to have some merit, as some derivative "women folk obviously belong in the kitchen" or "black people are predisposed to be more violent" is not science; that's narrative spin passing under the guise of data.

Which is why eugenics and phrenology was dismissed as quackery decades ago.

As for the whole denying climate change, well yeah regressive taxation is working pretty well to reduce the burden. Just ask France

I'm sure this was meant to prove some sort of point but I couldn't tell what it was through the petty sarcasm.

The Left and the Right aren't political parties.

I was defining it in terms outlined by the person I quoted.

The left is the political wing based on equality/egalitarianism. Science however is neutral and does not favor left, right, or libertarian political values.

Science may not favor one party, but one party sure favors science, and that certainly isn't "the right."