Is it normal to start hating most people when converting into a vegetarian?

[Halyon]

Eh, saying that nature is cruel is itself irresponsibly dismissive of bigger issues. Philosophically speaking, humans have been divorced from nature for a long time.

The underlying truth of the matter is humans don't need to eat meat anymore. At this point, arguing that nature is cruel is to say you're ok with yourself being cruel - which is pretty sad...

We don't strictly need a lot of things. We could still get by living in mudhuts. We don't need to eat plants only either. I don't endorse cruelty at all. I actually make a minimum effort to not support it whenever possible. I'm saying it's a bad argument.

There are ethical ways of buying meat, eggs, etc, thus no need to be vegan or vegetarian. Your reasons for doing what you're doing are yours. Of course you can share them, but don't beat people over the head with some superiority complex, because that is silly.

[The Stormbringer]

Nature is cruel full stop. Humans impose moral systems to protect ourselves, and thereby others, varying within different cultures and communities.

That your principles differ from someone else should not make you hate them. If you do, then it tells me that you're narrowminded and intolerant.

Here's a lovely example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PcnH_TOqi3I
Intentionally didn't embed the video. It makes me very uncomfortable, and I'm not a squemish person. But this is nature.

I could only watch a little bit of that, and holy shit. Guugghh. The baboon is so casual about it too.

[Celista]

I could only watch a little bit of that, and holy shit. Guugghh. The baboon is so casual about it too.

That's nature for you. That's also why certain people who keep talking about repopulating the earth with apex predators like big cats are fucking retarded.

[Cruor]

Might have something to do with cognitive thought... but, that might be a left wing conspiracy. /shrug

Are you saying animals that can think (humans) shouldn't eat meat? Meat provides needed nutrients, and it tastes good. Cows and chickens are food, that's all there is to it. Dolphins are whales can think and reason, go after them.

[Halyon]

I could only watch a little bit of that, and holy shit. Guugghh. The baboon is so casual about it too.

I know right, it's extremely uncomfortable to watch.

[LedZeppelin]

https://www.instagram.com/trojanmachine69/

tell that to this vegan, with steel tits the size of your head lol

he maybe vegan but hes on gear. Also probably gay

[Gurluas]

I have been educating myself to the cruelty of humankind toward animals and have been steadily changing my eating habits to only drink vegetable juice and tofu. Which puts me at odds with most of the world, I can't stand the sight of people eating meat or how meat is distributed anywhere and it is seriously making me furious almost all the time. And I know I can't convince any carnivores to change their ways, and how pointless it is to make some change when the world will never stop eating meat.

It's just all really making me extremely resentful and angry, and I'm wondering if it is normal.

You've discovered a massive injustice and basically the equivalent of enslaving species for the sole purpose of eating them.
The truth is, you have to do your part and accept you can't change all of humanity. Do your best to help, do your best to end it, but do not resent others or let dark emotions take over.

[Enfilade]

I hated people before becoming Vegan, now I hate them even more so.

[mickybrighteyes]

There's a difference between the comprehension of pain and reacting to external stimulus.

Plants do not feel pain though...at least not equivalent to a complex animal with a brain and a nervous system.

Do note who the OP is before you start to posture for any semblance of an intelligent discord concerning the concepts of understanding "pain" and the beings that may or may not be capable of understanding it.

[Daws]

I just accept the simple fact as a human for me to live something else must die, plant or animal. Why split hairs about what has to die, I didn't create this system and evolution decided I should eat both and who am I to argue with a system which managed to transform a chemical soup into the massive variety in life we have now. Seems egotistical to argue the very system that created us is wrong and we know better (after all aren't most of the biggest problems in the world basically us going against nature?).

[Video Games]

It's funny when you guys fall for tsugunais bait.

[Lawlhero]

Don't hate people, hate corporations. Easier excuse to not hate humans.

[Creotor]

That's nature for you. That's also why certain people who keep talking about repopulating the earth with apex predators like big cats are fucking retarded.

I'm not some fan of repopulating (unless it's helpful for balance), but do you think we're better? We can pretend to be, since our harvesting has been boxed in and isolated away through technology and infrastructure, but the sheer amount of pain and destruction (side effect of huge resource consumption) we put out just to keep up our numbers staggers anything a few extra millions of big cats and other predators could ever do. Even if everyone went full vegan, that would not change. The point is, there's nothing inherently 'retarded' about those ideas. Useless, maybe.

That video on the other hand, fuck.

[kasuke06]

To be fair, I think there is an argument to be made that there is a compunction for us to, if we do eat meat, ensure that the animals don't suffer. It's not a matter of nature being cruel and we are a part of nature, it's a matter of us having the capacity to know what it means to be cruel and cause suffering and that we should avoid doing so. This is why cruelty-free meat is such a big thing that people have been pushing for -- you will never be able to dissuade people from eating meat, but we can remove the need for it to involve the death of animals altogether. It's also why halal meat is so controversial, because it implicitly requires the suffering of an animal to be produced.

- - - Updated - - -



There's a difference between the comprehension of pain and reacting to external stimulus.

As I understand it, suffering causes the meat to taste worse as any bruisings or extra injuries ruins it.

Though I am looking forward to the not to distant future when factory-cloned meat is fully viable and accepted, as it will be truly cruelty free(it's literally just a grown lump of muscle and fat cells, no brain or nerve endings) and once it's economically feasible on a large scale, it also gets rid of a significant amount of greenhouse gas emmisions and water use, and frees up land for other purposes.

[Celista]

I'm not some fan of repopulating (unless it's helpful for some sort of balance), but do you think we're better? We can pretend to be, since our harvesting has been boxed in and isolated away through technology and infrastructure, but the sheer amount of pain and destruction (side effect of huge resource consumption) we put out just to keep up our numbers staggers anything a few extra millions of big cats and other predators could ever do. Even if everyone went full vegan, that would not change. The point is, there's nothing inherently 'retarded' about those ideas. Useless, maybe.

That video on the other hand, fuck.

I think we have the potential to be a very benevolent species. Apex predators typically do not show that same benevolence and they would eat you alive without a second thought. To predators like tigers and polar bears, we are simply food. I definitely think that interest in the welfare of fellow animals is something that we should promote, but putting the value of our own lives below that of an animal is folly.

That video is nothing unusual, animals eat other animals alive on a regular basis. Some animals like cats torture their food and play with them before eating it.

What do you think bears do with humans when eating them? Do you think you're dead before they start eating you? Only if you're lucky.

I swear, some of you people need more experience in nature.

[Zaktar]

I have been educating myself to the cruelty of humankind toward animals and have been steadily changing my eating habits to only drink vegetable juice and tofu. Which puts me at odds with most of the world, I can't stand the sight of people eating meat or how meat is distributed anywhere and it is seriously making me furious almost all the time. And I know I can't convince any carnivores to change their ways, and how pointless it is to make some change when the world will never stop eating meat.

It's just all really making me extremely resentful and angry, and I'm wondering if it is normal.

It's actually much worse than you think.

Many animals are slaughtered for their value to humans, but at this point in history they only live because we breed them to be eaten, milked, used for materials etc. Far worse are all of the free animals which are slaughtered for human purposes. Every time a human builds something, the materials have to come from somewhere, and that somewhere used to be something's home. The animals aren't given eviction notices, they are slaughtered left and right so that we can have wood, precious minerals, quarried rock, and other basic materials. It still gets worse though, because all the equipment used to build the item had to come from factories, which are built on what used to be some animal family's land which almost certainly died cruel, horrific deaths. Heck, your house/apartment/whatever is occupying what used to belong to our animal brethren. On top of that, the goods have to be transported places, which means traveling on roads which, quite apart from displacing/butchering families as they were built, cause millions of animal deaths each year as the poor little creatures try to cross them. (An estimated million deaths per day so you can get from A -> B faster, or get that cruelty free shirt shipped to your door). We can go deeper still, but it would be miraculous if you had the attention span to have read this far.

Your home, your phone, every object you own is drenched in the metaphorical blood of animals, and there is nothing you can do to change that. If you're going to think about it, you may as well think it all the way through.

This is making me hungry, time to grab a steak!

[Deleted]

It's just all really making me extremely resentful and angry, and I'm wondering if it is normal.

Based on my experience with vegans, yes, it's COMPLETELY normal.

[Burgerberg]

It's not hard to hate people when there's lots of cunts out there, but you need to balance this with the fact there are good people out there.

[Creotor]

I think we have the potential to be a very benevolent species. Apex predators typically do not show that same benevolence and they would eat you alive without a second thought. To predators like tigers and polar bears, we are simply food. I definitely think that interest in the welfare of fellow animals is something that we should promote, but putting the value of our own lives below that of an animal is folly.

That video is nothing unusual, animals eat other animals alive on a regular basis. Some animals like cats torture their food and play with them before eating it.

What do you think bears do with humans when eating them? Do you think you're dead before they start eating you? Only if you're lucky.

I swear, some of you people need more experience in nature.

I'll head out to get a bite taken out of me by a bear then... get some of that first-hand experience.

We're not always simply food to predators, but that's neither here nor there.
I've never put animal value above ours. My only claim was that us being better than animals is a facade, we consume and destroy a lot more (and that won't change unless maybe there's some fundamental shift, like reaching a whole other level of intellect). There's nothing wrong with that, it's how the world is, but it's a fact. We do it more selectively, to an extent, but the scale makes that irrelevant.
That video is quite unusual, since it's rare, compared to those of a typical predator eating someone that's still alive.

Also, as far as benevolence goes, humans swing in the other direction much better than animals, too.

[Underverse]

You know, you don't need to stop eating meat in order to promote animal welfare.