How big is WoW classic going to be? Are the retail devs worried about their jobs?

[urasim]

How about a company with a market research department the size of a small town concluding that it's worth investing millions in development and infrastructure?

Retrogames are a growing market, and Blizzard is smart enough to see that.

The movie industry has a massive research department. They still make flop after flop after flop.

This isn't a typical retro game. It's a game that has a subscription. Most remakes or remasters are a flat fee upfront(some are free).

Still, though, I see no actual evidence it's going to be popular. At least... popular enough to be a lasting force on twitch. That and most of the people I've seen beg for this game are already playing WoW. We'll see a subscriber jump, but it will die in a few months(just like with every new expansion). With only a few servers with a few thousand people(like we see with the current illegal versions of classic).

[Zaktar]

We will never know and fanboys and theoreticians will argue endlessly about it.

[ESVarga]

I think anything over 1 million is a success.

[Doffen]

Lol yeah they must be so worried.

Classic will be mildly successfull at 200k-300k players. And those players will fund retail WoW. It's a winwin.

[Kithelle]

Yeah man people are in a real hurry to head back into BfA lmao

Yeah and I'm sure so many are in a hurry to head to a 10+ year old game that was built around a horrible class system that is worse than even BfA!

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no man you guys love stirring crap. another reason the classic community is toxic

I don't think it's that, it's that some are so delusional they actually think Blizzard is making vanilla to reboot WoW and they're going to abandon live...I think some of them actually believe their own foolish illusions.

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Lol yeah they must be so worried.

Classic will be mildly successfull at 200k-300k players. And those players will fund retail WoW. It's a winwin.

But but...that isn't true don't you know? They merged vanilla and live into one sub so they can hide that no one plays live and everyone plays vanilla!

[Doffen]

But but...that isn't true don't you know? They merged vanilla and live into one sub so they can hide that no one plays live and everyone plays vanilla!

The truth will be out there!!

Think how good this will be retail WoW. Millions of dollars extra each month to pay for more content for retail. Classic is saving WoW!

[Chaelexi]

Mythic+ and Mythic raiding are not the entire game however.
They make up less than 10% of the total content. And all the rest is in fact mindless and braindead bullshit

When your entire argument hinges on the premise that "well its more than 90% garbage, but the few percent that's left are really good!!", then what you are talking about is a garbage and brainless game. You might as well scrap everything, from the boring leveling, over the repetitive and uninspired quests up to the mindless monotony that is Warfronts and WQs and rename what's left to "Mythic WoW ... the Action MMO Simulator (soon on mobile!!")"




A lie, and an easily debunked one at that.

50% of classic was social interaction, something that is never braindead, no matter how simple the underlying game. The rest was an immersive MMO RPG, not a cheap Action MMO pretending to have RPG elements. People developed a connection with their characters. It had a functional economy, and tradeskill system. It had requirements to group up and interact with one another throughout the game. The gameworld itself was relevent, and not just something we fly over or get ported through all the time. Content outside of instances was engaging. And immersive gameplay happend all around you, because the game was nonlinear and not the overdesigned, overstreamlined mess it is today. I logged into Vanilla WoW in the middle of the night, because some guildmember wrote onto our guild-websites lifeticker that it was all out war in UnGoro. An alliance guild was blocking access to the fire-elementals in the center of the map, because they wanted to farm essences and elemental fire. So the horde players were called to battle, and before we knew what was happening, I played the night away defending our farmspots against the alliance scum.

Show me something like this happening in todays WoW, were people resembling farmbots travel the world, savely sharded away from those pesky other players, Warmode OFF, and no consumable requiring any resources you cannot savely farm by yourself in a couple of minutes.

The game was not hard mechanically. That much is true. And that would be a sad state of affairs for an Action game, but is perfectly okay for an RPG. WoW got very good in the mechanical department over the years...but forgot about literally every other aspect. There is barely any social interaction that matters or has consequences, the tradeskill system is nigh worthless fpr anything other than consumables, quests and entire zones are strictly linear and 90% of the gameworld don't even matter.


So have fun with your Action MMO. BfA is a good one, no doubt about that.

But don't delude yourself into thinking that you play an MMO RPG. In that regard, BfA is mindless, braindead and an embarrassment to its predecessor.

If you think Classic is gonig to bring back vanilla community I highly doubt it. People will develop addons that do everything that is currently in BFA. Honestly I did not do a whole lot outside some RL friends and a guild I was part of in Vanilla, sounds like current game. I was able to run the AH from a group of us within the guild. We PVPed within the guild and a hand full of guild friends......But hey that is what happens when you are in a world top 10 guild. People want to play with you and you did not have to socialize with plebs very often. We had all the world bosses on lock down, As for farming, we had chinese gold farmers for that, since we bought everything they farmed they gave us a good price and we made gold as the reseller...... By the end of Vanilla I had 3 characters at max gold and if we were short on a certain mat we could reset the price very easily with the gold we had.

As for today's wow with something like that.....we just had it a couple nights ago, there were horde farming 3 guildies in warmode at an incursion. we formed up in 3 separate parties and rolled around doing world quests and farming the horde for 2 hours. Had 2 bounties rolling the whole time and got close to 250 kills. Good times had by all. Oh we also got all our world quests done at the same time.

I will restate that you could be brain dead in Vanilla as long as you found a guild that accepted you. It is the same in current WoW except if you want to move up in actual raiding it takes skill. The only thing Vanilla took was time........you had to have time and that is it......... I know we had a raider that raided with one arm and a foot petals for skills because he only had one arm and he killed 7 bosses in Naxx as an offtank.

[Doffen]

I know we had a raider that raided with one arm and a foot petals for skills because he only had one arm and he killed 7 bosses in Naxx as an offtank.

Sunder Armor bind to the foot petal?

Skills!

[Deletedaccount1]

Yeah and I'm sure so many are in a hurry to head to a 10+ year old game that was built around a horrible class system that is worse than even BfA!

Well, they are. Who cares about class balance if the game is fun, rewarding, and engaging which WoW hasn't managed to be in years. BfA has bad classes because they play like shit, vanilla classes play well they are just not well balanced among each other.

I can't believe we've gotten to the point where WoW fanboys are willing to shit on the vanilla game just because they're insecure about retail. Pretty fucking pathetic.

[Kithelle]

Well, they are. Who cares about class balance if the game is fun, rewarding, and engaging which WoW hasn't managed to be in years. BfA has bad classes because they play like shit, vanilla classes play well they are just not well balanced among each other.

I can't believe we've gotten to the point where WoW fanboys are willing to shit on the vanilla game just because they're insecure about retail. Pretty fucking pathetic.

As does live have classes that play well...both have classes that play well and both have classes that play like shit.

Can't be more pathetic than pretending that vanilla classes are so great when they obviously weren't. Pretending that so many specs that were broken in the game are awesome!

But yes I know, you need to resort to name calling because you don't have a leg to stand on.

[Doffen]

Well, they are. Who cares about class balance if the game is fun, rewarding, and engaging which WoW hasn't managed to be in years. BfA has bad classes because they play like shit, vanilla classes play well they are just not well balanced among each other.

I can't believe we've gotten to the point where WoW fanboys are willing to shit on the vanilla game just because they're insecure about retail. Pretty fucking pathetic.

Vanilla classes played well. Lol. Next thing we'll hear is that leveling in Vanilla was fast.

Why are you saying WoW fanboys? So people who love Vanilla WoW is not a WoW fanboy? Unheard of.

[Chaelexi]

the foot petals were shift, control and alt to give him multiple options with his mouse buttons

[Deletedaccount1]

As does live have classes that play well...both have classes that play well and both have classes that play like shit.

Can't be more pathetic than pretending that vanilla classes are so great when they obviously weren't. Pretending that so many specs that were broken in the game are awesome!

But yes I know, you need to resort to name calling because you don't have a leg to stand on.

I don't have to resort to anything. Acting like vanilla and BfA are even remotely comparable in quality is pure delusion. There is a reason why the community is so irate and Blizzard is doing so poorly financially. This game has less than 10% of the players it had at its peak. A lot of those don't even pay a sub so Blizzard has to sell hats and enact ridiculous pricing schemes to keep the game afloat.

Most people who have ever played WoW won't even have the discussion on the quality of retail because they rightly dismiss it as pure shit.

[Deleted]

If you think Classic is gonig to bring back vanilla community I highly doubt it. People will develop addons that do everything that is currently in BFA.

How is this gonna work? Are you saying Addon developers will hack Blizzards Servers and take control of the game?

Because, if not, I highly doubt that they will be able to inject an LFR/LFD system, teleport players to/from dungeons, change tradeskills to be irrelevant and allow cross realm groups.

What people could, in theory, come up with, is a queuing addon, aka. an Addon that would find a group automatically, and that doesn't work, because people would not use it. How do I know that? Because Blizzard introduced such a mechanic way before LFD, in the form of the "Innkeeper Rumor System". People didn't use it, because surprise surprise, they don't want to be put in a group with strangers. The only reason why LFD works, is because:

* It ports you to/from the dungeon
* It hands out rewards in the form of bonus xp/gold/ap
* It gives you a tremendous buff that makes it impossible to fail the dungeon

Neither of those will be in there with some cobbled together addon, neither of that was in there with the Innkeeper-Rumor-System. So people will not use it, simple as that.

As for today's wow with something like that.....we just had it a couple nights ago there were horde farming 3 guildies in warmode at an incursion. we formed up in 3 separate parties and rolled around doing world quests and farming the horde for 2 hours. Had 2 bounties rolling the whole time and got close to 250 kills. Good times had by all. Oh we also got all our world quests done at the same time.

So what you are saying is, there was no reason, the entire event was you ganking a couple of lonely gankers twice, and then proceeding to kill lonely questers. Nothing mattered, everyone could have pulled out any second if they wanted to and no one would have said a word. The people you fought were unknown to you, and you will likely never see them again. There was no one you recognized, no guild names you cared about other then your own. Most importantly: Most people on your own server never knew this happened, nor cared if they did. And most people who happened to chance upon you simply sharded out to avoid it anway.

How you think you can compare such a sad display that to what happened in Vanilla where entire raiding guilds were fighting over access to valueable resources, not once or twice a month but several times a week, is a mystery.

I will restate that you could be brain dead in Vanilla as long as you found a guild that accepted you. It is the same in current WoW except if you want to move up in actual raiding it takes skill.

The difference: Vanilla WoW had simple mechanics in raiding, and a metric ton of actual gameplay around it.

Nowadays WoW has cool raidmechanics, and zero gameplay around them. That leads to the kind of player I see in my guild today: Mechanically skilled, but with zero commitment, socially inept. The people who log on for raids, play a few hours and then they are gone, or in their xrealm mythic+ groups, talking to no one else. No gameplay around raids is necessary, no committment to the guild is necessary. You are not identified with your character since they all can do similar things anyway.

I prefer a game that is mechanically simple but offers me immersion, and values preparation for raids as much as it values raiding itself. If I want mechanics, I play Overwatch. If I want Action without buildup, I play Starcraft II.

Raiding for me, is about the journey to, and through, the raids, with a team of adventurers. The mechanical execution of fights is a nice gimmick, but when it goes center stage and becomes all that matters, I get bored.

In a nutshell: When I am doing PvE, I want to feel like Frodo in Smaugs Vault, not like Super Mario in World 3-2.

[Kithelle]

I don't have to resort to anything. Acting like vanilla and BfA are even remotely comparable in quality is pure delusion. There is a reason why the community is so irate and Blizzard is doing so poorly financially. This game has less than 10% of the players it had at its peak. A lot of those don't even pay a sub so Blizzard has to sell hats and enact ridiculous pricing schemes to keep the game afloat.

Most people who have ever played WoW won't even have the discussion on the quality of retail because they rightly dismiss it as pure shit.

So you have to make up numbers to try and prove your point, typical vanilla zealot and their imaginary numbers!

Sad that you need make up fake news in order to try and promote vanilla.

[Deleted]

So you have to make up numbers to try and prove your point, typical vanilla zealot and their imaginary numbers!

Sad that you need make up fake news in order to try and promote vanilla.

He may make up fake numbers, but Activisions market research isn't.

I don't know how successful Vanilla will be. Neither do you, or anyone else here.

But what I do know, is: a multibillion dollar company with decades of experience in the field, that hasn't released even a single financially unsuccessful product in their entire history, saw fit, for some reason, to throw millions in cash at developing and setting up infrastructure for a retro game, and announce it proudly at one of the biggest conventions in the industry.

And the naysayers may try to spin this any way they want, but I believe Blizzard is on to something here.

[Kithelle]

He may make up fake numbers, but Activisions market research isn't.

I don't know how successful Vanilla will be. Neither do you, or anyone else here.

But what I do know, is: a multibillion dollar company with decades of experience in the field, that hasn't released even a single financially unsuccessful product in their entire history, saw fit, for some reason, to throw millions in cash at developing and setting up infrastructure for a retro game, and announce it proudly at one of the biggest conventions in the industry.

And the naysayers may try to spin this any way they want, but I believe Blizzard is on to something here.

I never once said vanilla is a waste of money, I've just been saying that they aren't going to reboot the game with vanilla...just some vanilla zealots who think vanilla is gonna completely destroy live think that.

I don't think vanilla is a waste, I just think a lot of people didn't want vanilla they just wanted their own version of WoW....or the few people who think vanilla is the end all be all of WoW...and it isn't.

[Deleted]

He may make up fake numbers, but Activisions market research isn't.

I don't know how successful Vanilla will be. Neither do you, or anyone else here.

But what I do know, is: a multibillion dollar company with decades of experience in the field, that hasn't released even a single financially unsuccessful product in their entire history, saw fit, for some reason, to throw millions in cash at developing and setting up infrastructure for a retro game, and announce it proudly at one of the biggest conventions in the industry.

And the naysayers may try to spin this any way they want, but I believe Blizzard is on to something here.

i believe is at least 50% a passion project...the first one in many years by Blizzard

[Deleted]

I never once said vanilla is a waste of money, I've just been saying that they aren't going to reboot the game with vanilla...just some vanilla zealots who think vanilla is gonna completely destroy live think that.

I don't think vanilla is a waste, I just think a lot of people didn't want vanilla they just wanted their own version of WoW....or the few people who think vanilla is the end all be all of WoW...and it isn't.

I am impressed and delighted to find a fellow intelligent being in a discussion about a topic, where arguments usually devolve rapidly into nothing more than childish tit-for-tats and "whos story sounds better" competitions.

Good job sir, consider my hat tipped in respect.

[deniter]

Vanilla classes played well. Lol. Next thing we'll hear is that leveling in Vanilla was fast.

Why are you saying WoW fanboys? So people who love Vanilla WoW is not a WoW fanboy? Unheard of.

Excluding balance druids every single talent tree worked just fine in vanilla. Classes had different specs for different kind of content, whereas in modern WoW specs are more like sub-classes and every singe one is able to do whatever content they want.

And i can honestly say leveling in vanilla was fast. It only took few weeks to level up to 60, which kind of makes the game short for non-raiders. I really wish we would talk about months instead of weeks here. RPGs are all about building your character. Everything else come second including combat and story.