Remember what the Orcs gained from the Siege?

[Self Inflicted Wounds]

My poor outlook? WoD was all about that warcraft 1 feeling about going back in time to slaughter some Orcs. The Lords of War videos were all a narrative of Varian dealing with his past. Just because they are Orcs does not mean they are Horde aligned.

Legion started off with the Legion trailer and again, Varian being the protagonist in the story. Varian heroically dying that both factions had to sit through. Anduin dealing with his father. The Kirin Tor and Khadgar which is still mainly a human faction. Turalyon and his waifu Alleria coming back into the fray.

Now with BfA, they get both old and new introduced characters. Kul Tiras, Jaina and Katherine proudmoore. Bolvar's daughter. Rebuilded Stromgarde.

Yeah poor humans barely get the focus in the storyline and have lost so much, you are right. /s

I never said they don't get any focus. Learn to read, please.

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Are you like for real? honestly? read again the comment above yours and mine and tell me again we have nothing to complaint

like i said, i dare any other race trade their development for what happen to the orcs, cause i would trade any day

You know you aren't an Orc, right? Orcs get the most development of any race in the game. Again, as I said in my larger post, it has been up and down but they are still a powerful force in the lore and in the game. Somehow the Horde/Orcs went through a massive civil war and came out without much an a scratch, outside of losing some lroe figures. But Alliance? Darnassus and most of the Night Elf stuff burned. Their NPCs useless. Gnomes, who don't even get development lost their leader.

I really don't know what some of you expect out of this narrative, or what you expect after a civil war in the Horde. Its like you want to pretend the Orcs/Horde are "brave, noble savage misfits" but then cry when consequences occur. Should the Horde/Orcs just win every battle, never lose a man, and conquer Azeroth? Would that be interesting to you?

[Overlordd]

I never said they don't get any focus. Learn to read, please.

No you said humans do not gain or win much and that their only focus or narrative was Anduin, which could be interpreted as "humans do not get much story focus".
Which they do. And I feel sorry for the other races of the Alliance. High King is a title akin to warchief. Except you can not challenge a high king and have to become on by birthright it seems.

What losses did the humans go through? They won the war against Garrosh. They won the war against the Iron Horde. They never lost territory. They even gained it with Stromgarde. Their only loss was Varian but the way he was praised and folliwed doesn't really make his dead as a loss because in the same patch he already has a follower set up.

Where is our Hellscream? Our Thrall? The Orcs are still leaderless, same as the Darkspear. We are never getting told how or who represents them. We can only guess because an orc or a troll popped up here and there. Meanwhile any small change within human lore is always tied in to the storyline and both ingame and in books, and is adressed and corrected instantly.

I think it is very easy to say that humans are now the most focused and developped race of world of warcraft.

[Syegfryed]

You know you aren't an Orc, right? Orcs get the most development of any race in the game.

yeah? i think its pretty obviou we are talking as players
Can you please explain, how their entire development from the books to cata being completely destroyed in mop and WOD its "most development of the game"? tell me how your entire narrative was throw in the toilet its something that we don't get to complain

there are any other races who suffer this? no, not a single one

Are you one of those who think wod is just a playground and an orc dream of development? cause being butfucked 2 expansion in a row with a villain batoits not getting development but getting their past development destroyed, and the only orc from the horde there was Thrall and what he did was get a crippling depression

Again, as I said in my larger post, it has been up and down but they are still a powerful force in the lore and in the game

having numbers to be meatshield, cannon folder and villains is something to be proud for now? cause its the only thing the "powerful force" can do, i would trade those numbers for their narrative back, or at least their characters, cause they only have 2, one is senile and the other - that they completely fuck up, its running god knows were

Somehow the Horde/Orcs went through a massive civil war and came out without much an a scratch, outside of losing some lroe figures

without much of a scratch? again, are you even reading? their narrative since the beginning was destroyed, their characters died, they get tagged as racists for years and get shifted away until Saurfang show up to do shit, they pass 2 entire expansion without a racial leader what other race face this?

But Alliance? Darnassus and most of the Night Elf stuff burned. Their NPCs useless.

They still have hyjal and other areas, they still have their leader and most of their characters, they still have their narrative, and is improving making then go back to their roots from warcraft 3.

i would trade any day

Gnomes, who don't even get development lost their leader.

their narrative intact, the leader its not dead, they get development from bfa, and appear in every expansion as support, pretty solid for a comic relief race

I really don't know what some of you expect out of this narrative, or what you expect after a civil war in the Horde. Its like you want to pretend the Orcs/Horde are "brave, noble savage misfits" but then cry when consequences occur. Should the Horde/Orcs just win every battle, never lose a man, and conquer Azeroth? Would that be interesting to you?

You are not understanding

we are talking about the development and narrative of a race, they were a pacific race, living a hostile world, they were savage, brave whatever, but they were honorable, shamanistic. Then the legion came and corrupted the race, they did a lot of shit, and paid the price, they had the chance to restart after breaking from the Legion, they find other races and befriend then, they create bounds and are like brothers.

But then MOP happens, and shows that the once noble and savage race who befriend other different races are just warmongers with a bloodlust, racists who want to take the entire world, and we need to fight those villains, their own faction need to fight then, the good orcs? fuck then, cause the stigma was already created, everything before mean jack-shit.

And then comes WOD, and everything get worse, in truth they shows how orcs were just mongrel gorilas wanting to conquer te world, again, the villains who need to be purged, our orcs means jackshit again because they are exception, the stigma still there getting worse and worse, everything they create before? to the dumpster

All their old heroes? villain bat, dying like retards, their clans? same shit, the "good clans" its just one, an exception of the rule.

People get mad because its just crazy villains orcs on the screen, people get tired of orcs, the orcs who have nothing to do with pay the prince and get shifted away, characters die etc etc.

Like i said, they only have 2 characters ATM one is senile and the other is god know were after being butchered and hated by the fanbase of his own faction, the guy created by humans is having crippling depression with his family its not even worthy be mentioned.

And the orcs as a race, with no identity, no narrative, no characters, no leader, shifted away from their own faction and being replaced by the maghar, are in good spot because they have numbers to be cannon folder?

I would trade their fate with any other race, gnomes elves, everything is better.

[Self Inflicted Wounds]

No you said humans do not gain or win much and that their only focus or narrative was Anduin, which could be interpreted as "humans do not get much story focus".
Which they do. And I feel sorry for the other races of the Alliance. High King is a title akin to warchief. Except you can not challenge a high king and have to become on by birthright it seems.

What losses did the humans go through? They won the war against Garrosh. They won the war against the Iron Horde. They never lost territory. They even gained it with Stromgarde. Their only loss was Varian but the way he was praised and folliwed doesn't really make his dead as a loss because in the same patch he already has a follower set up.

Where is our Hellscream? Our Thrall? The Orcs are still leaderless, same as the Darkspear. We are never getting told how or who represents them. We can only guess because an orc or a troll popped up here and there. Meanwhile any small change within human lore is always tied in to the storyline and both ingame and in books, and is adressed and corrected instantly.

I think it is very easy to say that humans are now the most focused and developped race of world of warcraft.

In the context of land gains (a running theme in my post) no, the humans do not gain much. Unless you count the blighted UC?

Won the war against garrosh? Can we stop calling it that? The Alliance did not beat the Horde or sack Org. The Alliance purely assisted in the civil war, picking Thralls Horde to assist.

Stromgarde is a current warfront. Its not an Alliance territory. The Alliance lost almost everything in Kalimdor, and were pushed from Eastern Kindgoms.

Yes, Varian dying is a loss.

The main story is Alliance focused? Dude, in Cata, a main questline had Thralls wedding, the birth of his kid etc....

As for leaders go, Orcs have Saurfang (whether you like it or not) and Overlord Geya'rah. Finding a new Darkspear leader has probably been put off in BFA for story reasons involving Vol'Jin.

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there are any other races who suffer this? no, not a single one

I'm only going to address this part of your post; the answer is no, the Orcs do not suffer the most. They probably cause the most suffering though. Since WC3 the Orcs/Horde have routinely caused harm to everyone else around them, thats a fact. They have pushed further and further into Night Elf territory - and after SoO, Tyrande allowed Orcs to keep Azshara for food and lumber. But as of BFA the Horde destroyed every fort, house, city on Kalimdor belonging to them. Tie in the fact that Night Elves have done almost nothing and gained almost zero screen time in the game, yeah, I would say its an easy case that they have it worse than Orcs.

And like my first post said, Orcs get more screen time than any other race. The reason they are killed more, and have lost more NPCs is due to this fact.

[Syegfryed]

Won the war against garrosh? Can we stop calling it that? The Alliance did not beat the Horde or sack Org

The alliance did sacked orgrimmar, and Varian had the last word that we only get away because of his mercy, the horde shit, the alliance became the superpotency in the world

Stromgarde is a current warfront. Its not an Alliance territory. The Alliance lost almost everything in Kalimdor, and were pushed from Eastern Kindgoms.

no? they just lost teldrassil in kalindor, and they are attacking even durotar, they gain mush more territory in Easter kingdoms, and are winning the war.

Yes, Varian dying is a loss.

One, was a well done death, an arc finished for his son to raise

The main story is Alliance focused? Dude, in Cata, a main questline had Thralls wedding, the birth of his kid etc....

And in Legion we have to hEar 'TYRANDE I NEEEED U"

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I'm only going to address this part of your post; the answer is no, the Orcs do not suffer the most.

i didn't said the orcs suffer the most, i ask you, what races suffer the same things orcs suffered IN A NARRATIVE AND DEVELOPMENT VIEW, im not talking about ingame loss like teldrassil.

What race got their entire narrative and development destroyed after years of building? what race get shifted away from their own faction? what race got their characters hit by the villain bat so much that just left 2 old ones? what race got tagged as warmonger racist gorilas for years going against their lore?

And like my first post said, Orcs get more screen time than any other race. The reason they are killed more, and have lost more NPCs is due to this fact.

Repeat after me: just because an orc show up it don't mean the horde orcs get a screen time, bad screen time that we didn't ask for we not a good thing and only do harm for both playerbase

Since WC3 the Orcs/Horde have routinely caused harm to everyone else around them, thats a fact.

Same thing as the alliance, the humans and the elves.

Tie in the fact that Night Elves have done almost nothing and gained almost zero screen time in the game, yeah, I would say its an easy case that they have it worse than Orcs.

lets see:
Narrative intact: check
characters alive: check
development going forward: check
blizzard not fucking up their lore: half check
Having screen time: check (cause hey, cata, Legion and BfA happened)
Holding territory: not check

Still better than orcs in my view, i would trade orgrimmar for their identity, integrity and narrative back thank you

[Makabreska]

Guess it all shows that Thrall's idealistic view of Horde and Orcs in particular was just a dream. Looks like Metzen's "true Warchief return" wont happen, unless Thrall would go full nasty.

[Grazrug]

I never said they don't get any focus. Learn to read, please.

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You know you aren't an Orc, right? Orcs get the most development of any race in the game. Again, as I said in my larger post, it has been up and down but they are still a powerful force in the lore and in the game. Somehow the Horde/Orcs went through a massive civil war and came out without much an a scratch, outside of losing some lroe figures. But Alliance? Darnassus and most of the Night Elf stuff burned. Their NPCs useless. Gnomes, who don't even get development lost their leader.

I really don't know what some of you expect out of this narrative, or what you expect after a civil war in the Horde. Its like you want to pretend the Orcs/Horde are "brave, noble savage misfits" but then cry when consequences occur. Should the Horde/Orcs just win every battle, never lose a man, and conquer Azeroth? Would that be interesting to you?

Places don't define your identity. If that was the case orcs would have died the minute draenor was blown up. Hyjal is the actual place that matters for Kaldorei. They lost teldrassil? Cry ne a river. Doesn't stop blizzard for throwing screen time on them since cataclysm nonstop. They aren't half as bad as the orc story is, which effectively died with mop.

[Syegfryed]

Guess it all shows that Thrall's idealistic view of Horde and Orcs in particular was just a dream. Looks like Metzen's "true Warchief return" wont happen, unless Thrall would go full nasty.

it was not a dream, it was solid, until they decide to buttfuck their narrative and development, retconing and changing all the past shit

[Xath]

I already mentioned how Rise of the Horde painted orcs as a violent race that nevertheless lived in peace with the Draenei until the Burning Legion.

Yeah not like the roads in hellfire were literally paved with draenei bones or anything.

[Syegfryed]

Yeah not like the roads in hellfire were literally paved with draenei bones or anything.

its not like after the corruption of the Legion, it was totally before

[schwank05]

Besides Garrosh They lost:


The Kor'kron, Evil and gone forever

Warsong Clan, Evil and gone forever

Dragonmaw Clan, Evil and gone forever

Zaela, Evil and gone forever

Shokia, Evil and gone forever

Nazgrim, Sided with Garrosh and gone from the Horde forever

The idea of Orcs moving on from the past, gone forever

The idea of Orcs being family with Tauren and Trolls, gone Forever

Orcs having a racial leader, gone forever

Orcs being anything but evil cannon fodder, gone forever.


Now with Battle for Azeroth, more races of the Horde can join orcs on the evil cannon fodder team.

But now Nazgrim is even cooler and more bad ass since he is a Horseman. Way more badass being Undead.

[Jastall]

Places don't define your identity. If that was the case orcs would have died the minute draenor was blown up. Hyjal is the actual place that matters for Kaldorei. They lost teldrassil? Cry ne a river. Doesn't stop blizzard for throwing screen time on them since cataclysm nonstop. They aren't half as bad as the orc story is, which effectively died with mop.

That's kind of like saying Orgrimmar being razed wouldn't count as an Orc loss because Outland still exists.

No, in term of silly victim Olympics (which is really what this thread boils down to), NEs win and it's not even close. And at least they don't tend to go looking for a fight then cry about how hard they have it when they lose.

[Xath]

its not like after the corruption of the Legion, it was totally before

The orcs were still red skinned so yeah it was

Also horde should actually enjoy Tyrande I need you since it's Xavius mocking her and Malf.

[Lumineus]

What orcs besides Saurfang, oh and the 90 year old Eitrigg ever do anything anymore?

Cromush? Eyegouge? Rule 63 Thrall?

[Grazrug]

Dear God,
People actually genuinely believe this whole "bias" is a real thing, and that there is some slight against you because you arbitratily play X faction in a game?

Man, you *really* need some perspectives in your lives.

Was the alliance ever shafted around villain batted and then cannibalized itself? No? Thought so.

[Overlordd]

The orcs were still red skinned so yeah it was

Also horde should actually enjoy Tyrande I need you since it's Xavius mocking her and Malf.

You know it doesn't work like that where you, as an Alliance player, tell Horde to enjoy questing with an Alliance character because of reason X

[Makabreska]

Is it in absolutely any way, shape or form important to anything whatsoever?
Or just people trying to make drama for the sake of making drama?

I suspect the latter.


It's a game, try and see it for what it is. You're not an Orc, or an Undead, Tauren, Gnome or High Eld. You're not an honorable warrior feeling distraught at the destruction of his people (Alliance/Horde).

You're a guy/gal sat behind a keyboard reading *far* too much into something.

Oh hey! It's one of those internet users, coming to a site devoted to a certain video game, saying "Lol guys! It's just a game! Why do you care?".

[Super Dickmann]

Because it ultimately is irrelevant, and utterly pointless to ramble about. Stop trying to find conspiracies or such against X thing when there isn't one.
I care about the lore, heck, probably more than you do, I just don't see it as a personal attack and go on a pointless diatribe when something I don't like happens.

God knows where we'd be if you hadn't told us what's okay to talk about and not as regards the story of a children's video game in a sub-forum exclusively about such. You do good work.

[Syegfryed]

The orcs were still red skinned so yeah it was

Upon closer inspection, the Path of Glory appears to be completely paved with trampled bones - the bones of the draenei victims of the Horde's demon-crazed genocidal rampage shortly before the opening of the Dark Portal.

im sorry what are saying again? that the orcs did that before the corruption? bs

And the only red skinned orcs were the ones who drink the blood twice, chaos orcs or fel orcs, like the ones in TBC around maghterion and in hellfire peninsula, you are confusing red with brown

Also horde should actually enjoy Tyrande I need you since it's Xavius mocking her and Malf.

And you should enjoy the thrall questline, cause they remove his balls and made him a joke

[TheFirstOnes]

The Kor'kron never really crossed my mind until 4.0+, @Overlordd