US passes law against lynching; evangelicals campaign against it

[Dellis0991]

This is insane.

[alzoron]

“(c) Conspiracy.—If 2 or more persons conspire to commit any offense under this section, and 1 or more of such persons do any act to effect the object of the conspiracy, each shall be subject to the same penalties as those prescribed for the offense the commission of which was the object of the conspiracy.

Conspiring to kidnap someone (in one of the protected classes) and scratch their finger (and at least one person follows through) and everyone involved in the conspiracy whether or not they followed through can be sent to prison for life.

[PosPosPos]

Uh, ok.

Are you SURE you're not two people sharing the same account?

No, but I noticed you went off the deep end a few months back when you said laws shouldn't exist because of parents.

2+ people hitting someone while robbing him - not lynching
2+ people hitting someone for being gay/x skin color/x sexual orientation/x disability/x nationality is lynching

Should be easy to tell the difference, provided your mind is still firmly in this dimension.

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My question for the liberal, anti-mass incarceration crowd is this? Do you think the two guys who punch the gay guy deserve federal prison? WHat about two guys who just punch a guy cuz they're assholes (well they're both assholes but you know what i mean)? If one but not the other, why is one victim more important then the other. If you're getting punched, your face doesn't feel any different due to the reason why. Are you guys going to STFU about people being incarcerated if the feds actually use this law and send MORE people to prison. Just wondering.

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Well Antifa tends to target white people so maybe they could.

Nazis aren't a protected class. You could try getting your republican representatives to push that into the lynching law if you are upset about it.

[Endus]

My question for the liberal, anti-mass incarceration crowd is this? Do you think the two guys who punch the gay guy deserve federal prison? WHat about two guys who just punch a guy cuz they're assholes (well they're both assholes but you know what i mean)? If one but not the other, why is one victim more important then the other. If you're getting punched, your face doesn't feel any different due to the reason why. Are you guys going to STFU about people being incarcerated if the feds actually use this law and send MORE people to prison. Just wondering.

In order;

1> Yes, especially if State courts aren't doing the job and giving them a slap on the wrist.
2> Also deserve prison time.
3> Hate crimes are worse because of their motive. Mens rea is a cornerstone of law; it isn't all actus reus.
4> It really depends on why people are being sent to prison. Nobody has a problem with violent racists being sent to prison for attacking people for racist reasons. They have a problem with thousands of people being sent to prison for personal pot use for longer sentences than said violent racists get.

[PosPosPos]

Yeah, I never said that, so nice try I guess?

I wasn't the only one who quoted you off when you decided to go on a fevered tirade saying laws shouldn't exist because parents do. So either everyone who participated in that discussion slipped off into another dimension....or you did.

Yeah, my mind "firmly in this dimension" is leaning toward the idea of NOT calling it "a lynching" if a gay guy gets punched.

Call it a hate crime, call it gay bashing, call it whatever. Using the term "lynching" so broadly is ridiculous.

Yeah, ridiculous to use words as they are defined in dictionaries and common use.....and you were saying you didn't fall off the deep end. Curious.

[triplesdsu]

No, but I noticed you went off the deep end a few months back when you said laws shouldn't exist because of parents.

2+ people hitting someone while robbing him - not lynching
2+ people hitting someone for being gay/x skin color/x sexual orientation/x disability/x nationality is lynching

Should be easy to tell the difference, provided your mind is still firmly in this dimension.

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Nazis aren't a protected class. You could try getting your republican representatives to push that into the lynching law if you are upset about it.

Shouldn't you be under your bridge looking at child porn or something? The adults here were having an actual discussion. Scurry off.

[Anoikis]

Lynching gay men is a common thing in most islamic countries so it can't be that wrong. /s

[Adam Jensen]

Pretty sure Islam would be just as on board with them if they weren't at each other's throats, but then again the left doesn't want to say that just like that racist wouldn't condemn the remarks that Farrakhan makes yet again.

Because it's so hard to understand that there are various interpretations of Islam and not all of them are violent.

But hey, be a bigot and pretend that Islam === ISIS.

[PosPosPos]

Shouldn't you be under your bridge looking at child porn or something? The adults here were having an actual discussion. Scurry off.

In recent history, I believe almost all the prominent pedophiles appearing on the news were all registered Republicans. Most of them held office, too.

So I guess I can take this as the usual alt-right psychological projection.

[JDL49]

It means, that Lynching is now officially by default a hate crime, and a federal crime. Which is not the case for murder asfar as I understand.

Bingo. By making it a Federal Crime a lot of thing change. It is illegal to lie to an FBI Agent but not to a local or State Cop and refusing to answer questions gets you obstruction problems.

[triplesdsu]

In order;

1> Yes, especially if State courts aren't doing the job and giving them a slap on the wrist.
2> Also deserve prison time.
3> Hate crimes are worse because of their motive. Mens rea is a cornerstone of law; it isn't all actus reus.
4> It really depends on why people are being sent to prison. Nobody has a problem with violent racists being sent to prison for attacking people for racist reasons. They have a problem with thousands of people being sent to prison for personal pot use for longer sentences than said violent racists get.

IF we adopted your standards the prison population would explode. Simple assault/batteries not resulting is significant injuries (hospitalization) is usually probation for first time (if not second/third time) offenders with perhaps a short stay in jail/community servuce at best. You really need to mess someone up to get prison. Like i said in a different thread, we have people shooting people in CA and only getting 3 years (with double time credit for their time in jails prior to their case resolving). Keep that in mind next time you want to complain about "mass incarceration" as you obviously feel we're too soft on crime. Mental state is important but it also depends on the severity of the crime. Planning/laying in wait is a bigger deal to me then you have biases. We've gotten off course if oen group of people suddenly becomes more important than another because of what they are.

[Adam Jensen]

I'm never going to understand why people have such a problem who other people are sexually attracted to.

If it is between two consenting adults, its NONYA BUSINESS. Get over it.

[PosPosPos]

I never once said, "Laws shouldn't exist because parents exist!"

Either talk about the specific topic in question or shut up. Trying to make it seem like I said something broad and ridiculous is nonsense.

Sure you didn't. Trump-era denialism and selective memory is so predictable from you here.

Really?

Find me in or "dictionaries" where it says "Lynching" is defined as, "Two people punch someone". And it sure as hell is NOT "common usage".

I mean, who is "off the deep end" here?

I didn't say "punch", you did. Yet another piece of evidence you are clearly addled, seeing things which aren't there, not seeing things which are there.

[triplesdsu]

In recent history, I believe almost all the prominent pedophiles appearing on the news were all registered Republicans. Most of them held office, too.

So I guess I can take this as the usual alt-right psychological projection.

You'd be wrong on all accounts. Considering you're disagreeing with someone born with brown skin and a muslim, i'm pretty sure your antifa circle jerk buddies would label you as a nazi now.

[pathora44]

IF we adopted your standards the prison population would explode. Simple assault/batteries not resulting is significant injuries (hospitalization) is usually probation for first time (if not second/third time) offenders with perhaps a short stay in jail/community servuce at best. You really need to mess someone up to get prison. Like i said in a different thread, we have people shooting people in CA and only getting 3 years (with double time credit for their time in jails prior to their case resolving). Keep that in mind next time you want to complain about "mass incarceration" as you obviously feel we're too soft on crime. Mental state is important but it also depends on the severity of the crime. Planning/laying in wait is a bigger deal to me then you have biases. We've gotten off course if oen group of people suddenly becomes more important than another because of what they are.

Rather have the violent racists and homophobes in prisons then the millions that are in jail because they got caught with a single joint of weed/other drugs and got sentenced to years in prison. Prison is meant for violent felons not non violent drug offenders.

[Appelgren]

It's murder, why do you need a new law.

You can get the death penalty for lynching someone, or shooting someone, or running over someone in your car.

This! Such a cheap way to build political points when everyone with half of an IQ point understands that such laws are pointless since murder is already punishable.
But hey... need to keep that left VS right fight going, amirite?

[Endus]

IF we adopted your standards the prison population would explode. Simple assault/batteries not resulting is significant injuries (hospitalization) is usually probation for first time (if not second/third time) offenders with perhaps a short stay in jail/community servuce at best. You really need to mess someone up to get prison. Like i said in a different thread, we have people shooting people in CA and only getting 3 years (with double time credit for their time in jails prior to their case resolving). Keep that in mind next time you want to complain about "mass incarceration" as you obviously feel we're too soft on crime.

Really not going to apologize for thinking violent offenders should be facing prison time, and non-violent personal-use drug offenders shouldn't, no matter how you try and twist that.

Mental state is important but it also depends on the severity of the crime.

Mens rea is not "mental state". This is a basic legal concept, and not one unique to American law.

[PosPosPos]

You'd be wrong on all accounts.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...=.bbb1ed0141da

Just one of many, like Trump and Roy Moore.

But do tell me of even a single Democrat pedophile still holding office without it being condemned and ousted by the rest of the party.

Considering you're disagreeing with someone born with brown skin and a muslim, i'm pretty sure your antifa circle jerk buddies would label you as a nazi now.

Yeah, this same tired argument of "I am X or have X friends, so I can't be bigoted to X".

If this argument was ever valid at any point in history, the Holocaust would never have been classified as antisemitic, by virtue of having Jewish Nazis in the ruling party.

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Yeah, ok.

You're not even trying to hide your true intentions now. Goodbye.

It's quite hilarious how you aren't even factually consistent in your replies. I didn't even say punch, but somehow, you insist I defend an argument you made for me.

[Logwyn]

Above and beyond the federal/state thing mentioned,

1> This covers injury, not just death
2> This covers everyone involved; if you and your buddies chase down a gay guy and you each get a kick in, and then Frank starts curbstomping the guy until he dies, Frank's going down for murder, but you're all going down for lynching (and possibly accessory to murder).
3> The new law specifically states that State courts have precedence, unless the Federal courts think the State courts fucked up or are too biased to enact justice. So it basically lets the federal courts say "yeah, your State is letting these fucks get away with it, and we're saying no to that bullshit", which makes sense given the history of unbalanced legislating between States. So it's not just making it a Federal crime; it's enshrining that ability for the Feds to say "your State courts are racist as fuck, we're taking over".

All of the above are illegal with current laws on the books. Race is also a protected class already as well. There really isn't a need to have a law for ever type of murder. If we go down that route someone will get off beause they can say that killing someone with a blue candle stick that is covered in wax isn't covered by a law. A blanket law covering murder covers lynching.

Continuing to clog up the law books with unneeded law creates a situation for loopholes and mistakes. But I guess this is what keeps lawyers in business. The new latin of the modern world is the huge codified law books of the land written in a language of legalise that the average citizen can't understand.

[Endus]

All of the above are illegal with current laws on the books. Race is also a protected class already as well. There really isn't a need to have a law for ever type of murder. If we go down that route someone will get off beause they can say that killing someone with a blue candle stick that is covered in wax isn't covered by a law. A blanket law covering murder covers lynching.

Why is it that people, like yourself, jump into the thread to express an opinion like this while clearly not even looking at the actual bill in question?

I'm not even going to respond to the particulars, here, because you're way outside reality and arguing based on stuff you made up in your own head.