Horde ends up losing everything they gained through their war campaign

[Kwento]

At least Jaina offered him the choice to end the conflict peacefully. Jaina was not given that choice when Garrosh vowed to conquer all of Kalimdor. The Kaldorei were not given that choice when Sylvanas marched on their lands.

If Aethas didn't want a problem with his superior, then perhaps he should have put a leash on his Sunreaver dogs.

These situations are exactly the same. I cannot believe just how symmetrical they are. Apart from the fact that Jaina *was* given a choice, when Garrosh allowed Baine (secretly, obviously) to inform her of an incoming siege. And the fact that the night elves have been an enemy of the Horde (also the initial aggressors in the current conflict) for years now.

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Their victory was pretty much guaranteed the moment we've learned what our warchief's end goal is. But now you and Super Dickmann made me imagine Baine giving Varian's soo speech to Genn, Rogers, Tyrande and co and I'm in love with the idea!

Baine though? I can only see him starting that speech and then getting cut off by some random Alliance footsoldier.

[Stormdash]

The scepter of the tides returned to Kul Tiras
Jaina's brother is given back to her
Zandalari Navy half destroyed

And what did the Alliance gain out of their war campaign?
They succesfully defeated the San'layn
They killed some blood trolls
They succesfully destroyed the troll navy

And the Horde loses Rastakhan while the Alliance loses... no one.
As a Horde you literally are an NPC in this storyline if you don't support Glugfang and the Alliance over Sylvanas.

How isn't the story bias? Yeah Horde can choose 2 shitty options instead of getting the baseline shitty one. Woo hoo.

The beauty of it is that there are waves of people who will tell you this is all proof of Blizzard's horde bias.

[Kwento]

The beauty of it is that there are waves of people who will tell you this is all proof of Blizzard's horde bias.

Because if the Horde is winning, it is Horde bias because Alliance is loosing. But if the Horde is loosing, it is Horde bias because their story is better!
You just can’t win...

[Varodoc]

These situations are exactly the same. I cannot believe just how symmetrical they are. Apart from the fact that Jaina *was* given a choice, when Garrosh allowed Baine (secretly, obviously) to inform her of an incoming siege. And the fact that the night elves have been an enemy of the Horde (also the initial aggressors in the current conflict) for years now.

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Baine though? I can only see him starting that speech and then getting cut off by some random Alliance footsoldier.

Jaina wasn't given a choice because Garrosh always planned to conquer all of Kalimdor, so she had no other choice but to try to defeat the warmonger before it was too late. And anyway Jaina is now at the apex of her power while Garrosh is a despised rotting corpse. That must sting a bit.

The Kaldorei obviously weren't given a choice because Sylvanas showed up one day and decided to attack them. Also, how are they the initial aggressors in the current conflict? And yes, they have been enemies of the Horde for years because for some reason Thrall decidd to attack them in Warsong Gulch after the Third War.

[Kwento]

Jaina wasn't given a choice because Garrosh always planned to conquer all of Kalimdor, so she had no other choice but to try to defeat the warmonger before it was too late. And anyway Jaina is now at the apex of her power while Garrosh is a despised rotting corpse. That must sting a bit.

The Kaldorei obviously weren't given a choice because Sylvanas showed up one day and decided to attack them. Also, how are they the initial aggressors in the current conflict? And yes, they have been enemies of the Horde for years because for some reason Thrall decidd to attack them in Warsong Gulch after the Third War.

Wait, Garrosh never really had much of a rivalry with Jaina, did he? He was her murder fetish, not the other way around.
And Garrosh decided to “delete” the Alliance from Kalimdor only after Theramor. Before that he wished to push them out of the continent. This situation has nothing to do with Jaina/Sunreavers.

I didn’t say that they were given a choice. I said that kaldorei were the first to attack the Horde back in the Third War. Later they doomed Orgrimmar to starvation because of a traitor’s actions within the Horde. They have as much to do with Jaina/Sunreavers situation as Void Lords have to do with Jin’jo the Fishermon.

[Varodoc]

Wait, Garrosh never really had much of a rivalry with Jaina, did he?

Except that he did, since he vowed to conquer all of Kalimdor for the Horde, and Jaina was in Kalimdor.

Before that he wished to push them out of the continent

A fancy way of saying that he planned to delete them.

I said that kaldorei were the first to attack the Horde back in the Third War.

No, that was Thrall who ordered Grommash Hellscream, infamous war criminal, to trenspass into Kaldorei territory without first having asked for military access through their lands, and even started chopping down their sacred trees as a sign of utter disrespect towardss nature.

Later they doomed Orgrimmar to starvation because of a traitor’s actions within the Horde.

So what, they doomed Orgrimmar to starvation? Too bad. Next time, the dumbass greenskins shouldn't have settled in the middle of the arid desert. Besides, Sylvanas ordered the Wrathgate, so it was her fault that the Kaldorei decided that the time had come to end the treaty.

[Queen of Hamsters]

As a Horde player: Meh.

Who the hell cares. Is the gameplay still the same on both factions? Yeah? Good.
Just do away with the factions on gameplay levels already.

[Dalheim]

No, that was Thrall who ordered Grommash Hellscream, infamous war criminal, to trenspass into Kaldorei territory without first having asked for military access through their lands, and even started chopping down their sacred trees as a sign of utter disrespect towardss nature..

Are you... are you serious?

How in the flying buttfuck would Thrall have known about the night elves existence!? Nobody knew about the night elves or their sacred trees.

All credibility you might've had has literally been thrown out the fucking window.

[Kwento]

Except that he did, since he vowed to conquer all of Kalimdor for the Horde, and Jaina was in Kalimdor.



A fancy way of saying that he planned to delete them.



No, that was Thrall who ordered Grommash Hellscream, infamous war criminal, to trenspass into Kaldorei territory without first having asked for military access through their lands, and even started chopping down their sacred trees as a sign of utter disrespect towardss nature.

So what, they doomed Orgrimmar to starvation? Too bad. Next time, the dumbass greenskins shouldn't have settled in the middle of the arid desert. Besides, Sylvanas ordered the Wrathgate, so it was her fault that the Kaldorei decided that the time had come to end the treaty.

Apart from the personal need to correct you regarding Sylvanas, I have to point out that you are deriving from the main point I was trying to make.
Sylvanas being “behind Wrathgate” was never elaborated upon. We already know that she was developing the Plague, but what was the actual part she played in this tragedy is still yet to be seen.

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Are you... are you serious?

How in the flying buttfuck would Thrall have known about the night elves existence!? Nobody knew about the night elves or their sacred trees.

All credibility you might've had has literally been thrown out the fucking window.

Shhh... I usually try to ignore these completely. It saves a lot of energy when you read about Alleria being the strongest mortal on Azeroth.

[Varodoc]

Are you... are you serious?

How in the flying buttfuck would Thrall have known about the night elves existence!? Nobody knew about the night elves or their sacred trees.

All credibility you might've had has literally been thrown out the fucking window.

If he were smart, he would have realized that a forest perfect for life as Ashenvale would most likely be inhabited.

This is called TRENSPASSING UPON NEUTRAL TERRITORY. The orcs reap what they sow, as usual, because their thick greenskin brains are too primitive to think beyond the usual "ME ORC, ME STRONG, RAWR".

Apart from the personal need to correct you regarding Sylvanas, I have to point out that you are deriving from the main point I was trying to make.
Sylvanas being “behind Wrathgate” was never elaborated upon. We already know that she was developing the Plague, but what was the actual part she played in this tragedy is still yet to be seen.

No, lead creative director Afrasiabi literally stated that she ordered the Wrathgate.

Shhh... I usually try to ignore these completely. It saves a lot of energy when you read about Alleria being the strongest mortal on Azeroth.

So rude, It appears that the multiple suspensions you received weren't enough to fix that attitude. And which other mortal managed to successfully defy the whispers of the most ancient and greatest evil of the cosmos?

[Kwento]

No, lead creative director Afrasiabi literally stated that she ordered the Wrathgate.

So rude, It appears that the multiple suspensions you received weren't enough to fix that attitude.

Ordered Wrathgate can mean all sorts of things...

I was never suspended.

[Syegfryed]

At least Jaina offered him the choice to end the conflict peacefully. Jaina was not given that choice when Garrosh vowed to conquer all of Kalimdor.

Se had a choice, surrender, leave or fight, she chose fight.

No, that was Thrall who ordered Grommash Hellscream, infamous war criminal, to trenspass into Kaldorei territory without first having asked for military access through their lands, and even started chopping down their sacred trees as a sign of utter disrespect towardss nature.

bullshit, he was not a infamous war criminal and thrall didn't send him to trespass cause no one knew there was people living there

if the elves didn't shot first, and instead, a diplomatic approach, cause they didn't fucking now trees were supposed to be sacred, things could be different

and "cutting trees" is not a signal of disrespect of nature.

So what, they doomed Orgrimmar to starvation? Too bad. Next time, the dumbass greenskins shouldn't have settled in the middle of the arid desert. Besides, Sylvanas ordered the Wrathgate, so it was her fault that the Kaldorei decided that the time had come to end the treaty.

too much for a nature lover elves hum? because of the dumbass knife ears they got almost annihilated by the dumbass greenskins, too bad, next time try a better diplomatic approach and not a self-righteous egocentric tatic

Wrathgate was not the orcs fault, it was a retarded move and cost they greatly.

[Varodoc]

Ordered Wrathgate can mean all sorts of things...

I was never suspended.

Not really, It's a very straightforward statement further supported by the Chronicles. You just want it to be vague because you don't want your already evil waifu to be even more evil. But don't worry, she won't die; She is way too popular with the emo teens who play this game, so she'll probably be redeemed because she is the messiah for some reason.

[Kwento]

Not really, It's a very straightforward statement further supported by the Chronicles. You just want it to be vague because you don't want your already evil waifu to be even more evil.

You presume too much. Sylvanas is evil and she does deserve a terrible end. There is no need to imply that I’m bending the given lore to fit into my personal preferences. I take the established lore as it is and there are many things that people accuse Sylvanas of, which she never did. Wrathgate is still an open question in these debates and before we get straight answers, we cannot know for sure weather she orchestrated the entire thing.

[Varodoc]

By the way, before the thread was derailed into a Jaina discussion, what I meant to say is that this thread doesn't make sense, because the Alliance also eventually ended up losing everything they gained in Mists of Pandaria. So it's only fair that now it is the Horde's turn to lose something, No?

[Hekazi]

This game has a Horde bias!

*2 months later*

Obvious Alliance bias!

*2 months later*

Omfg this game and their Horde bias. CAN IT STOP

*2 months later*

Blizzard clearly has an alliance bias.


STAPH

Alliance cried for early horde content though and exclusive mounts, but i assumed they spoiled the horde so they could handle another faction loss. The alliance were crying at the time though.

[LuminaL]

All of you "The Horde palyers are literally Nazis" people will never stop right? Reported for insultig players who are Horde mostly, as nazis.

wow that thing down there must be burning! you report someone because they talk about fictional lore of a fictional game and compare it to real world? "that is surely something new in MMO-C."

so will you report me if I compare sylvanas attacks on teldrasil to some IRL genocide ?

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Not really, It's a very straightforward statement further supported by the Chronicles. You just want it to be vague because you don't want your already evil waifu to be even more evil. But don't worry, she won't die; She is way too popular with the emo teens who play this game, so she'll probably be redeemed because she is the messiah for some reason.

Night elves in pandaria: even tho we can take it back and our lands are sacred to us we give horde a whole zone to use for its resources and to live in.

horde in pre-patch: night elves are dangerous they might invade us lets burn them.

and thats the story of how night elves got kicked in the stomach.

[Magnagarde]

Derek is being taked to see Calia as was indicated in the datamined dialogues and he is gonna be light brainwashed cured from whatever the screecher did to him and the start of the light undead allied race.

That kinda goes hand in hand with the suspicion laid out earlier. Where Calia is there's probably also Anduin and either of them are more than likely to be in or around an Alliance court when it possibly goes down.

[Syegfryed]

Night elves in pandaria: even tho we can take it back and our lands are sacred to us we give horde a whole zone to use for its resources and to live in.

its not like the zone was almost full horde already

horde in pre-patch: night elves are dangerous they might invade us lets burn them.

and thats the story of how night elves got kicked in the stomach.

Thats was not the reason for the attack, neither "horde", it was sylvanas paranoia

[Joti]

You mean...

-Dalaran: Gained when Jaina committed genocide against the Sunreavers. Lost one expansion later when Jaina threw a temper tantrum over the Kirin Tor understanding there was a larger threat to Azeroth than a petty quest for revenge.

Jaina was justified in kicking Aethas off the council and telling them all to get bent when they allowed him back in. It's a matter of trust. Just in the same way you can't trust someone convicted of embezzlement to be employed at a bank, you could never trust Aethas again after the events in MoP. Aethas betrayed the Kirin Tor when he covered up that his Sunreavers violated the neutrality. Any reasonable person would assume he would be a liability to do so again, like the Legion agreeing to spare the Sunreavers/BElves in exchange for him betraying them. Calling Jaina's refusal to accept Aethas' reinstatement "a petty quest for revenge" is laughable. He didn't betray Jaina. He betrayed the Kirin Tor's calling.