Baine's impotent rage

[KainneAbsolute]

In the End of Time dungeon, we got a view of what might happen to Baine. The description of the fight says:

"Enraged by his failure to protect the world and, most importantly, the Horde, this time-ravaged shade of Baine Bloodhoof lingers within the ruins of the Obsidian Dragonshrine. Although he's still as powerful as the tauren high chieftain from the present, within this shattered future Azeroth, this guilt-ridden echo is little more than a discordant vessel of unquenchable malice and anger."

[Muajin76]

Here we see again and again Baine's MOLTEN OUTRAGE at perceived injustices but he never dares take any action. He goes along with Garrosh's orders because he is afraid. He gets angry over the loss of tauren lives but does nothing. Malkorok repeatedly harasses Baine and he refuses to do anything about it. Even when it looks like he is about to take action, he is immediately pacified by Anduin or cowed by Malkorok.

Baine's cowardice is his only consistent trait. We see things play out in exactly the same way in BfA as in MoP. Baine hates Sylvanas' orders but he goes along with them because he is scared. He is afraid to challenge Sylvanas to Mak'gora so he slinks behind her back. He gets cowed by Nathanos and lets Zelling be executed. I had hoped he would at least try to resist being arrested but he just threw a couple of snarky comments in Sylvanas' direction. His cowardice is eventually going to get him in a bad spot when all Horde leaders lose any respect they might've had for him.

I hope in 8.2. and beyond Baine will finally be pushed to his tipping point and become the angry but potent Baine we saw in the Endtime timeline.

One of these expacs he's gonna end up feeding someone a whole bunch of burgers..

[Leodric]

What's up with the notion that someone (in this case Baine) is a coward, because he doesn't resort to stupid violence whenever someone does something wrong in his eyes. The Tauren, you know the well-being of his race which a good leader should prioritize first and foremost, would get absolutely wrecked if he does something stupid.

Also I bet the same people who circle jerk every thread about Baine being a spineless coward would tell you how they would fight multiple guys IRL catcalling their girl, just to run away if such a situation actually really occurs .

[Houle]

What's up with the notion that someone (in this case Baine) is a coward, because he doesn't resort to stupid violence whenever someone does something wrong in his eyes. The Tauren, you know the well-being of his race which a good leader should prioritize first and foremost, would get absolutely wrecked if he does something stupid.

Also I bet the same people who circle jerk every thread about Baine being a spineless coward would tell you how they would fight multiple guys IRL catcalling their girl, just to run away if such a situation actually really occurs .

Lol. Its the fact that he DOES want to get violent, but doesn't have the balls to do it. Thats whats pissing people off, that hes always angry as shit, but never does anything. And the fact that he simply doesn't stand up for his beliefs, like his father did. When Cairne got angry and felt it was needed, he stepped forward and challenged Garrosh. When Baine is angry and feels it is needed, he steps back, thinks about how unfair all of this is, and continues to do nothing to change the situation.

[Super Dickmann]

What's up with the notion that someone (in this case Baine) is a coward, because he doesn't resort to stupid violence whenever someone does something wrong in his eyes. The Tauren, you know the well-being of his race which a good leader should prioritize first and foremost, would get absolutely wrecked if he does something stupid.

That implies Baine ever materially assisted the life of even one tauren. The "he did it for his people" defense is not only wrong in terms of his conduct, even Blizzard themselves don't pretend it's anything but bullshit and have the other Horde characters point it out. Lor'themar notes that Baine put his people at huge risk when he went on his Horde soldier killing spree to save Jaina's brother and half of those agreeing with him call him out on his poor timing and motivation.

[Leodric]

Lol. Its the fact that he DOES want to get violent, but doesn't have the balls to do it. Thats whats pissing people off, that hes always angry as shit, but never does anything. And the fact that he simply doesn't stand up for his beliefs, like his father did. When Cairne got angry and felt it was needed, he stepped forward and challenged Garrosh. When Baine is angry and feels it is needed, he steps back, thinks about how unfair all of this is, and continues to do nothing to change the situation.

You point out exactly what the problem is by calling him a coward. He saw what happens when you act on your rage mindlessly like Cairne. Obviously Cairne had the best intentions and was a honorable leader, but it would be kinda stupid to make the same mistakes his father did and fail the Tauren again. With the latest story iteration Baine does act and I think Blizzard will push the horde narrative more towards inner conflict with Baine being a main protagonist in it.

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I think the main issue with Baine is that he is a hypocrit, not a coward.

Saw him called spineless coward more than enough

[Wilfire]

You point out exactly what the problem is by calling him a coward. He saw what happens when you act on your rage mindlessly like Cairne. Obviously Cairne had the best intentions and was a honorable leader, but it would be kinda stupid to make the same mistakes his father did and fail the Tauren again. With the latest story iteration Baine does act and I think Blizzard will push the horde narrative more towards inner conflict with Baine being a main protagonist in it.

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Saw him called spineless coward more than enough

Cairne would have won had Magatha not poisoned Gorehowl. There was no way anyone could have foreseen it. We know for a fact that Baine would have beaten Garrosh had he challenged him because that's exactly what happened in the AU. The MoP war could have been prevented. The BfA war could have been prevented. Baine's inaction has resulted and continues to result in loss of Horde lives. Zelling's death is his direct and unambiguous fault. He dragged Zelling along on his betrayal tour. And then when Zelling needed protection, Baine chickened out instead of challenging Sylvanas to Mak'gora to prevent Zelling's execution. He is not just a hypocrite. He refuses to take any responsibility for his actions.

Imagine if Doomhammer chickened out of challenging Blackhand. Or Garrosh didn't challenge Thrall and the Horde never invaded Northrend. Sometimes you gotta take a risk and Baine is just not willing to do so. As a leader, he should either own up to his failures or step aside and let someone else lead. Right now, he is doing neither.

[GetCrunk]

Anduin is a person for whom war and violence has robbed him of people he cared. War claimed his father and his guardian, domestic terrorism claimed his mother.

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This is pure bs, was no terrorism his mother die do his father being a weak shit leader and let the nobles manipulate him in not paying for his city construction, Stonemasons riot only ask for there pay check for the work they done, then after Tiffin die they become a terrorism organization.

[Aucald]

That implies Baine ever materially assisted the life of even one tauren. The "he did it for his people" defense is not only wrong in terms of his conduct, even Blizzard themselves don't pretend it's anything but bullshit and have the other Horde characters point it out. Lor'themar notes that Baine put his people at huge risk when he went on his Horde soldier killing spree to save Jaina's brother and half of those agreeing with him call him out on his poor timing and motivation.

Wouldn't "As Our Fathers Before Us" basically be Baine materially helping all the Tauren of Mulgore?

[Super Dickmann]

Wouldn't "As Our Fathers Before Us" basically be Baine materially helping all the Tauren of Mulgore?

Only in isolation. Immediately after, in-game quillboar kept on attacking tauren, rendering that whole chain of events pointless.

[Aucald]

Only in isolation. Immediately after, in-game quillboar kept on attacking tauren, rendering that whole chain of events pointless.

Is the storyline addressed in-game, or is that just a matter of the events being frozen in place before "As Our Fathers Before Us" canonically occurred?

[Super Dickmann]

Is the storyline addressed in-game, or is that just a matter of the events being frozen in place before "As Our Fathers Before Us" canonically occurred?

Basically all quillboar in game are hostile and many of them attack tauren. In fact, the very first thing you see as a tauren is quillboar attacking you and they're involved in all sorts of things in S. Barrens including the ever popular Taurajo. If we're charitable we can see that specific quillboar tribe learned the error of its ways, but all other quillboar actually expanded in territory and continued harassing the tauren, so the total benefit is pretty low.

[Evilfish]

*while fighting on a battlefield.

Yes.

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No. Saurfang is the old honorable horde.

Sylvanas fanbois think she represents the horde when she doesn’t. She’s just in it for herself and the forsaken.

Actually Saurfang is exactly what the Alliance wants. Another moron buying into the douchebag honor monologues of the Alliance, playing grabass in their all-human club, putting his "honor" before the interests of his people. And you know what? It wouldn't bother so many if his Honor wasn't so in line with the Alliance interests and so out of line with the Horde interests.

At least Sylvanas has proven she's competent and that she may put herself before the rest, but she makes sure that her interest and the Horde's interests are parallel. And while I am not always behind Sylvana's choices I can't deny that she's one of the best characters we have and I am honestly amused at the amount of butthurt she managed to generate. I think she's only second to Trump in that regard.

[Bigby]

Actually Saurfang is exactly what the Alliance wants. Another moron buying into the douchebag honor monologues of the Alliance, playing grabass in their all-human club, putting his "honor" before the interests of his people. And you know what? It wouldn't bother so many if his Honor wasn't so in line with the Alliance interests and so out of line with the Horde interests.

At least Sylvanas has proven she's competent and that she may put herself before the rest, but she makes sure that her interest and the Horde's interests are parallel. And while I am not always behind Sylvana's choices I can't deny that she's one of the best characters we have and I am honestly amused at the amount of butthurt she managed to generate. I think she's only second to Trump in that regard.

Sylvanas? Competent? Her utterly moronic plan to somehow hold Darnassus hostage - literally - blows up in her face, by her own stupidity, and leads the Horde into a war of attrition that it cannot win. Yes, very much in the Horde's interest. Maybe she'd have a point if the Alliance had intentions to wipe out the Horde, but with the most Stupid Good idiot on the (ugh) High King seat, the Horde and Alliance could potentially have managed to warm themselves up to the idea of peace.

I am honestly amused at the amount of butthurt she managed to generate. I think she's only second to Trump in that regard.

That would be Jaina.

[Zandalariprelate]

You know even if that happens on a subconscious level, which it might, it is not on Golden. It's on her freakin editor.

That only makes things worse, even Metzen didn't wanted to explore of mixed relationship outside of the elf/human

[Archibalde]

What's up with the notion that someone (in this case Baine) is a coward, because he doesn't resort to stupid violence whenever someone does something wrong in his eyes. The Tauren, you know the well-being of his race which a good leader should prioritize first and foremost, would get absolutely wrecked if he does something stupid.

The problem is that he doesn't resort to anything whenever something big happens. Yeah, it's obviously much smarter to analyze a situation fully before taking actions. Cairne used to do that a lot. But Cairne also took action whenever it was necessary. Baine just gets angry, suppresses it and walks away and then acts like he did something grand and heroic. That's what makes him a coward. He's basically that one person who gets insulted to his face, waits for the other to turn around and leave, then whispers under his breath "your face". Then he pats himself on the back for totally calling that person out and making a fool out of them.

The Tauren are meant to be peaceful people but that doesn't make them pushovers. Baine is a pushover.

[Evilfish]

Sylvanas? Competent? Her utterly moronic plan to somehow hold Darnassus hostage - literally - blows up in her face, by her own stupidity, and leads the Horde into a war of attrition that it cannot win. Yes, very much in the Horde's interest. Maybe she'd have a point if the Alliance had intentions to wipe out the Horde, but with the most Stupid Good idiot on the (ugh) High King seat, the Horde and Alliance could potentially have managed to warm themselves up to the idea of peace.


That would be Jaina.

You are the perfect depiction of the above mentioned butthurt. Please do yourself a favor and don't reply to me.

[Bigby]

You are the perfect depiction of the above mentioned butthurt. Please do yourself a favor and don't reply to me.

Sounds like you're pretty butthurt over my reply, eh? People in glass houses and all that.

Personally I can't be butthurt over Sylvanas seeing as she'll be dead(er) or chased out of the Horde by the end of the expansion anyway. Looking forward to the sea of tears from the same Blood Elf mains who, without irony, claim the Alliance playerbase are whiny babies.

;^)

[Evilfish]

Sounds like you're pretty butthurt over my reply, eh? People in glass houses and all that.

Personally I can't be butthurt over Sylvanas seeing as she'll be dead(er) or chased out of the Horde by the end of the expansion anyway. Looking forward to the sea of tears from the same Blood Elf mains who, without irony, claim the Alliance playerbase are whiny babies.

;^)

Yeah, your post perfect reflects how unbutturt you are, having to mention the Horde calling the Alliance whiners. In fact I don't remember a post with your name on it that didn't involve that subject. Whatever.

[Minikin]

Following that logic saurfang represents only old suicidal orcs with PTSD.

Makes sense cuz he's one of them.