Capitilism is rigged. Using working in retail as an example

[Drusin]

Your first mistake it thinking that people SPAWN in these situations. They don't. The guy at the top worked his ass off, he was among the guys on his feet for 12 hours but he stood out or did it better and eventually broke through and got promoted all the way up. Once up there, sure he's not doing the same manual labor and while you wrongly think that all he does is sit in meeting, he actually has to deal with shit all day long, phone calls late at night with people screaming at him, tons of responsibilities, problem solving at 6 am, managing people and projects and problems and actually leading the meetings and shit.

Basically, you're talking about something you know nothing about but you think you know something because you watched a movie where you saw a rich character do nothing and be mean. Classic leftist hollywood elite agenda pushing (while they also make millions for shooting a movie in 4 months and then masturbating for the next 8).

Now, do CEOs really need to be paid THAT MUCH MORE than the people working for them? No they don't. But still, thinking that they do nothing is just you being ignorant. When you think about anyone in any job, think about them as babies and the life path they had to go through to get there realistically not just random "their dad gave them the job" kind of bullshit.

I have no stake in this topic but I would like to know if you believe 100% of CEOs fit your description.

[Independent voter]

I am fortunate enough to live in a country with freedoms and the ability to choose your lifestyle and career. And education too if you can afford it.

However I also live in a country with incredibly high suicide rates/depression/violence/crime

Why is that? in a land of opportunity do we still see the same rates of poverty and general social status where only a few excel and most wallow in their own pits of poverty.

I dont claim to be a expert politically or a business analyst but I have a lot of experience working in retail which is the basic model of modern capitalism.

Why is it the worker bee's, the people at the bottom do all the work, and the few at the top thats jobs consist of mostly sitting in on meetings and listening to phone calls and they never spend a 12 hour shift working on their feet on concrete tiles take over 95% of the profits and you get such large inconsistency from the top to the bottom even though you are all working towards the same goal, a successful company.

Or let alone cleaners of malls who literally shovel shift and earn less in a year than a CEO makes in a month.

It just all seems so rigged to me and it makes me depressed at the state of the world.

Soviets had capitalism too. It was called the Black Market. It's the most capitalist of systems as it is completely unregulated. You can sell heroin just as easily as new shoes. People will pay whatever the going price is. Shortage? Prices shoot through the roof, surplus, prices drop.

You can't fight capitalism, it just happens. It's like rain, you can't fight rain, it's a natural process that just happens.

[schwank05]

I'm not a Luddite but I dont think its ridiculous to suggest workers will soon be more expensive than coding and maintenance on machinery and we need to protect that area a little better

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you can train a chimp to work in retail. This isnt professional sports or space travel we're talking about

Society gives waaay to much stigma to managers/ceo's because we love the idea of alpha leaders and people ruling us.

Have you ever owned or managed a business? Do you know how many hours we work and have to not only worry about putting food on our tables, but also the tables of every one of our employees. I am a working boss, I work side by side with my employees while they are here for the 8-5 grind, but also show up an hour earlier in the day and am here 3-4 hours after they leave each night. There are times where business owners don't even make a profit if its a slow season or you make some investments into growth of your company. I think if someone is in charge of a major company they deserve every penny they can get. It's not their fault they were willing to put the time in and work hard to get where they are, and the lower man on the totem pole bitches because they didn't get the same outcome when they had the same opportunities.

[Berndorf]

Nothing of what you said has anything to do with Capitalism. Thats basic businesses around the world. Boss always gets more because the boss needs to rebuy items to sell and expand and pay employees.

Boss and owner aren't always one and the same. In most corporations its not.

[melodramocracy]

Of course it's rigged. Capitalism at its core is a variation on a pyramid scheme, and the existence of opportunity has never had any direct relation to availability, despite what every "you can be anything you want to be" motivational poster on the planet might say.

[Freshouttajail]

I have no stake in this topic but I would like to know if you believe 100% of CEOs fit your description.

Not 100%.
No idea what's the ratio but if it's anything like the incorrect representation of reality the media does, my guess is less 1% were given everything for free.

[Vash The Stampede]

UBI will happen eventually and all the people with the most $$ will have to foot that bill anyways.

Understatement of the century. Even without UBI the wealthy will only go down hill from here. At some point people are going to be unable to pay their taxes. For example my area there are so many empty houses that aren't collecting on taxes and you can only increase taxes on people so much before you create a domino effect. New Jersey is particularly bad because a lot of people like myself are forced to pay for the most expensive flood insurance even though before Sandy I didn't. I paid someone to do a flood elevation level and turns out I'm above the flood line and therefore don't need to pay for any flood insurance. I wouldn't be surprised that many people in NJ are in the same situation and can't pay it, as they want thousands per year for flood insurance. For whatever reason FEMA went along with this and the homes they were trying to save are now lost probably partly due to being required to pay an enormous amount for flood insurance.

Lots of people in the business to make free money and that's going to end. Banks and stocks come to mind as they often make money for free without doing anything. I hear Wells Fargo isn't doing so well after they were caught stealing from their customers multiple times. The stock market is another pointless system that is just there so that rich people can get rich off rich people. I really doubt that Apple needs money to expand and grow.

When you have all the money there's no way to make more of it.

[Tic Tacs]

People are paid far more then they are worth in most low skill jobs these days. You wanted globalism and automation well the competitive wage for that retail job is roughly under a dollar.

This is not how economy works... If wages drop than prices on basic goods will drop too, this is simple economics, less labor costs - generally cheaper products, take the Big Mac index. US = around $5, China = $3 and Russia = $2. We earn more we pay more, they earn less they pay less, we are kind of in the same boat, granted labor unions in the US make things easier for a working class on top of more or less stable healthy economy. However, if your average Chen or Ivan will want to buy imported goods like iPhone or Samsung TV he will have to work twice more hours than an American on top of extra costs added from tariffs and taxes.

In case of China they already have solid alternatives like Huawei and Xiaomi phones while Russia has none so Chen is much better off than Ivan in this case. So you see we don't have to slave away because our economy is pretty much alive in most sectors hence strong dollar while China is catching up which is always bad for dominating economy like ours and Russia is pretty much stuck in 90s.

Food for thought, Apple, Intel, Boeing, Nike among many many others including European corporations build assembly lines in China to chase greater profit margins by doing so they speeding up the whole "catching up process", the irony. What are they going to do when China catches up, move to China?

[Mormolyce]

each of them moved to Australia in their early 20's alone and left all their family and friends behind never once seeing them again only contact was though letters

you seem to be a jelly person who has no idea how hard life can really be selfish

Comes from a family of immigrants, big surprise lel.

I love how you're just blatantly trying to strawman me because you know you can't win against the real me. I'm not jealous of anyone, I'm just not deluded with romantic notions about the rich and powerful.

Now answer the question: what do you do for a living?

[Dolus]

I am fortunate enough to live in a country with freedoms and the ability to choose your lifestyle and career. And education too if you can afford it.

However I also live in a country with incredibly high suicide rates/depression/violence/crime

Why is that? in a land of opportunity do we still see the same rates of poverty and general social status where only a few excel and most wallow in their own pits of poverty.

I dont claim to be a expert politically or a business analyst but I have a lot of experience working in retail which is the basic model of modern capitalism.

Why is it the worker bee's, the people at the bottom do all the work, and the few at the top thats jobs consist of mostly sitting in on meetings and listening to phone calls and they never spend a 12 hour shift working on their feet on concrete tiles take over 95% of the profits and you get such large inconsistency from the top to the bottom even though you are all working towards the same goal, a successful company.

Or let alone cleaners of malls who literally shovel shift and earn less in a year than a CEO makes in a month.

It just all seems so rigged to me and it makes me depressed at the state of the world.

Your pay is commensurate to your skill. Lower skilled workers need to diversify their skill set. Companies have to deliver a product that turns a profit. If the product is crap, people will not buy it. CEOs usually have years of experience at a high level. They're paid for making the tough calls. If bad calls are made the board will replace him/her. You aren't entitled to the CEO's money. If you think you can do better, then go create a start-up. Challenge them. I suspect you won't.

[Mormolyce]

why would you talk about strawmaning then go on to do it yourself

I literally haven't said anything about what you believe so it can hardly be strawmanning, can it? Do you not know what strawmanning is?

Answer the question, what do you do for a living? Or are you unemployed?

[jeezusisacasual]

The bigger problem has been inflation. When I first moved out of my parents house a newish 2 bedroom apartment cost about $1200-1300/month....Ten years later Average rent where I am is $1800-2000 for a 2 bedroom apartment. Hell, even groceries...I used to be able to get a full cart for $100...Now It's like 6 bags of groceries if that. With that said, wage has not kept up with inflation where I live(just outside of Boston).

In order to allow people to live a sustainable life, inflation first needs to be tackled...because if you increase minimum wage drastically one of a few things will happen...Hours will be cut around the board so yes you make more money per hour but work less...Workers will be laid off and inflation will affect the lowest common denominator with the increased minimum wage. Best case is nothing changes with said business but the cost of their products go up substantially...Look at what's been happening in Seattle and New York City with their restaurant employees...I can't even imagine the other industries the minimum wage hike has affected.

I just got back from Boston, I landed during this last weekend and holy shit its much colder and much more evil snow then Wyoming. I was comparing some prices of things like food and other everyday items and it appears to be slightly more expensive in Boston ( Emmets Irish Pub was a great lunch spot btw ). I agree with your entire line of reasoning but fixing it will be rough tho.

[Gaexion Ramza Beoulve]

A couple of things.

I have to paint you a picture of the journey of the american worker told over 50+ years across 5+ generations and multiple races/demographics/geographics.

America enters the war and becomes a boom economy. With men going to war the demand for workers is so high women enter the work force. As the war ends America transitions into a service economy. Cold war and draft enacted creates a rush to get into college as the war machine will more than likely claim your life. Now you have inflated economy but huge technological leaps, boomers rush to remake the economy but ultimately fail and sell their children into wage-slavery. Then the golden-god-who-never-made-any-mistakes decides to enact welfare reform which mandates you have to work to get benefits. This means everyone is competing just to stay alive but also it essentially transforms minimum wage jobs into a psuedo-welfare system. Although having 100% employment sounds good on paper the reality is most people are more miserable than if they lived inna woods.

The sad irony is that I don't necessarily blame capitalism. I blame America for doing everything half-ass. I'm not offering any solutions just trying to explain how we fucked everything up.

[Mighty Tim]

UBI will happen eventually and all the people with the most $$ will have to foot that bill anyways.

Or the poor starve to death as they have done traditionally for millennia.

[Hilhen7]

It's not necessarily the job related skills or how hard you work that determines your level of success. A lot of it is who you know and the connections you've made.

Otherwise everyone with a CPA should be making around the same amount of money, but they don't...

[zenkai]

I am fortunate enough to live in a country with freedoms and the ability to choose your lifestyle and career. And education too if you can afford it.

However I also live in a country with incredibly high suicide rates/depression/violence/crime

Why is that? in a land of opportunity do we still see the same rates of poverty and general social status where only a few excel and most wallow in their own pits of poverty.

I dont claim to be a expert politically or a business analyst but I have a lot of experience working in retail which is the basic model of modern capitalism.

Why is it the worker bee's, the people at the bottom do all the work, and the few at the top thats jobs consist of mostly sitting in on meetings and listening to phone calls and they never spend a 12 hour shift working on their feet on concrete tiles take over 95% of the profits and you get such large inconsistency from the top to the bottom even though you are all working towards the same goal, a successful company.

Or let alone cleaners of malls who literally shovel shift and earn less in a year than a CEO makes in a month.

It just all seems so rigged to me and it makes me depressed at the state of the world.

Grew up dirt poor out in the country, worked my way, did well in school, financed myself through college, have a damn good job. Some people are in bad conditions because of things out of their control such as their health, other people are just lazy and want to blame other people for their own short comings.

[RuneDK]

I just got back from Boston, I landed during this last weekend and holy shit its much colder and much more evil snow then Wyoming. I was comparing some prices of things like food and other everyday items and it appears to be slightly more expensive in Boston ( Emmets Irish Pub was a great lunch spot btw ). I agree with your entire line of reasoning but fixing it will be rough tho.

Hope you had a good time and hope the people weren't rude to you. New England is something different when it comes to storms...it's incredible how crazy snow can be here.

[Unholyground]

Or the poor starve to death as they have done traditionally for millennia.

No that won't happen, not in a world with social media and outrage and free wifi.

[Mighty Tim]

No that won't happen, not in a world with social media and outrage and free wifi.

I think that you grossly overestimate how powerful that is.

[Unholyground]

I think that you grossly overestimate how powerful that is.

UBI is something modern society should have so all of these wasteful government programs can be eliminated. If you want nice things you still have to work for them, and soon as you move over your cap in earned pay you no longer get it. Pretty simple and is paid for by those government sectors you no longer need.