[EU] Brexit negotiations at a standstill

[Kronik85]

Did he? 'Cos these days he thinks Stalin was a hero... that'd be quite the shift in personality.


OT: WTF good is a 3 month delay going to do when we're at this point in the shit show after 2 whole years? Should just cancel this mess and deal with the fallout from that. The UK is standing toe-to-toe with Trump as the world's laughing stock already.

We would "need" an extension even if the HoC had a position, to actually implement it. There are something like 300 pieces of legislation that to this day need ammending to (what we can only assume) no longer include or reference the EU and it's mechanisms. I don't think anyone in the thread has a firm understanding of what would happen if this didn't occur but it is the opinion of experts and Parliamentarians that this needs to happen before we can leave in any form.

[zealo]

https://www.rte.ie/news/2019/0320/1037436-brexit_delay/
https://static.rasset.ie/documents/n...an-council.pdf

For something more constructive than engaging with Kangodo, the letter May is sending to the EU to ask for an extension is now available.

It basically boils down to that she wants more time just to try to push her deal, or an amended version of it, through parliament again. I can see the EU almost certainly rejecting this.

[Naiyano]

It basically boils down to that she wants more time just to try to push her deal, or an amended version of it, through parliament again. I can see the EU almost certainly rejecting this.

She failed before, she will fail again. It's time to end this clown fiesta already. But as I said I still have no confidence that the EU will just reject it.

[Shalcker]

If the EU was dictatorship do you really think UK could do the shit it does right now?

Yes? Why not?

"A dictatorship is an authoritarian form of government, characterized by a single leader or group of leaders with either no party or a weak party, little mass mobilization, and limited political pluralism." - EU leaders are generally not decided on party lines, and political pluralism on top level is limited - it is mostly just (neo-)liberal policies.

You're probably thinking of totalitarianism?
"Totalitarianism is a political concept of a mode of government that prohibits opposition parties, restricts individual opposition to the state and its claims, and exercises an extremely high degree of control over public and private life."

EU isn't totalitarian (at least not yet), some of their decisions can border on dictatorial though (as noted above, you can have dictatorship with "group of leaders" rather then single decision-maker).

[Kronik85]

There was plenty of time to do that...

I don't think anyone is making a case for the competence of the UK Gov at this stage. It's more a case of "well this is where we are".

[Slant]

Stop derailing the thread, Russian trollbot. Fuck off.

[Pann]

'BREAKING I just asked PM's spokesman to confirm clearly that her #Pmqs remarks mean she would quit if Brexit was delayed beyond June 30.
His reply: "You should infer from those words the strength of the prime minister's resolve".'

https://twitter.com/paulwaugh/status...59784342962176

But given her resolve to get a good deal for the UK and for the UK to leave the EU on 29/03 I'm not sure too much can be read in to this.

[Xarkan]

"And you wonder why we used to hang and assinate your kind, can't say my granddad was wrong would have even loaded to gun to deal with such anarchists."

but this is perfectly fine if it's done against people who dislike liberalism apparently.

I thought you refered to the part in dutch to be honest

[thathwother]

Stop derailing the thread, Russian trollbot. Fuck off.

This is one of about fifty different instances of Slant and numerous other neoliberal posters very obviously breaking the rules and being ignored.

This is why no one respects the moderation process. You just get some cunt like Northern Goblin protecting the posters he agrees with and ignoring any examples of racism or ad hominen personal attacks otherwise.

[Shalcker]

Because the EU doesn't hold referendums at all since it's not a separate entity, it's is a union of countries that each decide for themselves, you sound as smart as dribbles.

It is more like EU actively avoids referendums after problems with EU constitution voting in 2000s (which failed a few of them), preferring to limit EU decisions to parliamentary approvals.

...that is setting up to fail though given that referendums still remain as available option in many democratic countries, and not every parliamentary body is capable or willing to block them.

[Fuiking]

Maybe it's a thing with Dutch posters, the poster "Deruter" also was normal at some point and then became rabid, not seen him in a while though, maybe he changed name.

- - - Updated - - -


There was plenty of time to do that...

Im dutch and perfectly not rabid!

But I feel embarresed by Kangodo... Btw, just throw him on ignore, I did, and Im happy I did so.

[Kronik85]

'BREAKING I just asked PM's spokesman to confirm clearly that her #Pmqs remarks mean she would quit if Brexit was delayed beyond June 30.
His reply: "You should infer from those words the strength of the prime minister's resolve".'

https://twitter.com/paulwaugh/status...59784342962176

But given her resolve to get a good deal for the UK and for the UK to leave the EU on 29/03 I'm not sure too much can be read in to this.

May's resolve to say the exact same thing over and over and yes, over again is by now, the stuff of legend. If you need an MP to stay on script (to the point people think she may very well be scripted) then May is your gal....robot thing.

[Dizzeeyooo]

Question, what happens if May resigns next week when the EU refuses the extension?

Unless other parties can force a general election, Boris Johnson likely becomes PM.

[Acidbaron]

I thought you refered to the part in dutch to be honest

Even so I spoke in past tense, he's simply trying to insinuate something. But I know the past hurts for some, he still hasn't figured out anarchists hardly ever life long.

[Shalcker]

The EU has no authority to conduct referendums, it is up to the individual states to call for them.

You don't need to have authority to actively advise against doing them.

Got to note that last Dutch referendum on EU matters went pretty significantly into "against" territory.

...in fact every referendum since (and including) 2015 Greek one seems to go into anti-EU direction.

[Slant]

The EU has no authority to conduct referendums, it is up to the individual states to call for them.

A referendum also doesn't make something "more democratic". The various democratic institutions of the EU and the democratic institutions that make up parts of the EU are equipped with a perfectly sufficient mandate to manage the EU on behalf of the member states. Whenever legislation radiates back into the member states, it is because those member states have at several stages mandated the EU to do just that. Saying the EU is undemocratic is saying The Netherlands are undemocratic. It's a ridiculously stupid statement.

[Mayhem]

You don't need to have authority to actively advise against doing them.

Got to note that last Dutch referendum on EU matters went pretty significantly into "against" territory.

...in fact every referendum since (and including) 2015 Greek one seems to go into anti-EU direction.

EU scapegoat for local politicians not just in the UK, more at 11.

[Shalcker]

A referendum also doesn't make something "more democratic". The various democratic institutions of the EU and the democratic institutions that make up parts of the EU are equipped with a perfectly sufficient mandate to manage the EU on behalf of the member states. Whenever legislation radiates back into the member states, it is because those member states have at several stages mandated the EU to do just that. Saying the EU is undemocratic is saying The Netherlands are undemocratic. It's a ridiculously stupid statement.

Any power granted to EU to "manage on behalf of member states" should be allowed to be taken back from EU by same institutions for democratic checks and balances to work.

Otherwise you end up in capture mode where pro-EU government passes pro-EU laws, fails, then gets replaced by anti-EU government that cannot do anything to change existing laws.

Not a good outcome.

[Mayhem]

*SIGH*

Showing your ignorance here, the EU has no power to hold referendums of any kind. Only the individual countries do, it has nothing to do with them being affraid they simply don't have the authority to do so.

I'm not sure why you are participating in this discussing since you don't have even a basic idea of what the EU actually is.

Because Putin ordered him to?

At least that's my best guess.

- - - Updated - - -

Any power granted to EU to "manage on behalf of member states" should be allowed to be taken back from EU by same institutions for democratic checks and balances to work.

It is allowed, it's called Article 50.

[kaid]

That would be hilarious.

Never go full Tory.