1. #16381
    Quote Originally Posted by ctd12345 View Post
    Justice Department: Mueller did not find that Trump campaign or its associates 'conspired or coordinated' with Russia.

    Lads you are gonna get battered if you keep doubling down.
    "Did not establish." There's a clear difference between that and "did not find." That means there wasn't "proof beyond a reasonable doubt." I'll just quote myself because you clearly need to read this:

    Quote Originally Posted by Ripster42 View Post
    You don't think it's relevant that the standard of proof of "beyond a reasonable doubt" might not have been met (and again, we don't actually know this because of who barr is and his beliefs about the limits of presidential power), but the standard of "clear and convincing" (or preponderance of the evidence) could be met w/out charges being filed? You don't think your average voter would want to know that? How convincing would the evidence have to be to affect your vote?

    For that matter, how convincing would the evidence have to be for you to support impeachment and conviction? It shouldn't be "beyond a reasonable doubt." The penalty for impeachment and conviction isn't imprisonment. The impeached party would still get another trial after they've been impeached before they serve time. In civil court, the standard of proof isn't "beyond a reasonable doubt" or even "clear and convincing." It's just preponderance of the evidence. I urge you to remember that the process of impeachment is a political process. With bill clinton there was clearly proof "beyond a reasonable doubt" that he committed perjury. Because the perjury was about something so benign as to whether or not he had an affair, he wasn't convicted.

    So I ask again, how strong does the evidence need to be that the president of the united states colluding with foreign states (or committing obstruction of justice that benefits a foreign state) for help to get elected and selling our foreign policy for you to not want that liability as president? This isn't as if it's through carelessness, but by corrupt intent. It's not something minor, like an affair, but the legitimacy of our democracy itself.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rudol Von Stroheim View Post
    I do not need to play the role of "holier than thou". I'm above that..

  2. #16382
    The Unstoppable Force Belize's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MoanaLisa View Post
    Asset seizure from Manafort paid for it.
    No please, don't debunk already debunked talking points.

  3. #16383
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    Quote Originally Posted by ctd12345 View Post
    Justice Department: Mueller did not find that Trump campaign or its associates 'conspired or coordinated' with Russia.

    Lads you are gonna get battered if you keep doubling down.
    Barr doesn't have the greatest of reputations given his history in covering up shit. We also don't know what Mueller's take on the report is. Only the special counsel and parts of the DOJ have seen the full report. The only thing we've learned is what appears to be a half assed maybe maybe not. That isn't going to change unless more people see the report, regardless if charges come as a result of it or not.

  4. #16384
    Quote Originally Posted by Vatrilian View Post
    Again Fact: NO COLLUSION.
    Key word in the summary report though is "knowingly".

    As many here stated they didn't think Trump was knowingly an active agent working with Russian, but instead said because of Trump ego he could be easily manipulated into unknowingly working for Russian's interests.

  5. #16385
    Quote Originally Posted by Mighty Tim View Post
    We have been jumping to conclusions for three years
    This is ironic as that's what you are doing right now.

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  6. #16386
    Dreadlord FeedsOnDevTears's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vatrilian View Post
    But the report ignored that premise.
    "After reviewing the Special Counsel’s final report on these issues… Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein and I have concluded that the evidence developed during the Special Counsel’s investigation is not sufficient to establish that the President committed an obstruction-of-justice offense."
    "Our determination was made without regard to, and is not based on, the constitutional considerations that surround the indictment and criminal prosecution of a sitting president."
    That's surprising. Because two months ago, while being considered for AG, he said the exact opposite, “I actually haven’t read those opinions in a long time. But I see no reason to change them.”

    Making that claim is Barr taking his credibility out behind the barn right before we hear a gunshot.
    Impeach the MF.

  7. #16387
    Quote Originally Posted by Mullet Man View Post
    50% of the USA are Trump supporters.
    No .

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Knadra View Post
    And 100% of American patriots.
    Knadra, you're right. The MAGAbomber is a patriot, the ones ready to bomb refugees are patriots, the ones shooting up churches are patriots. Everyone should be just like them.

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  8. #16388

  9. #16389
    Quote Originally Posted by Vatrilian View Post
    No collusion. No obstruction as there is no underlying crime. Total victory.
    Says "doesn't exonerate."
    Everyone thinks "did nothing wrong, ever."

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  10. #16390
    Void Lord Elegiac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Celista View Post
    Welp, this went as predicted and once again Skroe's posts have not aged well.
    I mean ignoring the fact that all anyone has to go on at the moment is the word of the guy who had a hand in covering up Iran-Contra, sure.
    Quote Originally Posted by Marjane Satrapi
    The world is not divided between East and West. You are American, I am Iranian, we don't know each other, but we talk and understand each other perfectly. The difference between you and your government is much bigger than the difference between you and me. And the difference between me and my government is much bigger than the difference between me and you. And our governments are very much the same.

  11. #16391
    Quote Originally Posted by Celista View Post
    Welp, this went as predicted and once again Skroe's posts have not aged well.
    Why? Because he isn't wrong.

  12. #16392
    Quote Originally Posted by Hobb View Post
    Key word in the summary report though is "knowingly".

    As many here stated they didn't think Trump was knowingly an active agent working with Russian, but instead said because of Trump ego he could be easily manipulated into unknowingly working for Russian's interests.
    And again, it's weirdly specific about "the russian government." We know that, indeed, at least one member of his campaign was giving kilimnik internal polling data, from manafort's own lawyers.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rudol Von Stroheim View Post
    I do not need to play the role of "holier than thou". I'm above that..

  13. #16393
    Quote Originally Posted by Celista View Post
    Welp, this went as predicted and once again Skroe's posts have not aged well.
    Uh?
    It happed as Skroe predicted. or what did you expect, that the Goon inside the DOJ would act in any other way? remember, this is the best they could do: "(...) It does not exonerate him (...)"

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Dontrike View Post
    Says "doesn't exonerate."
    Everyone thinks "did nothing wrong, ever."
    Everyone in this case is Trumpettes.
    Forgive my english, as i'm not a native speaker



  14. #16394
    Quote Originally Posted by Didactic View Post
    I mean ignoring the fact that all anyone has to go on at the moment is the word of the guy who had a hand in covering up Iran-Contra, sure.
    Quote Originally Posted by Orbitus View Post
    Why? Because he isn't wrong.
    Quote Originally Posted by Thepersona View Post
    Uh?
    It happed as Skroe predicted. or what did you expect, that the Goon inside the DOJ would act in any other way? remember, this is the best they could do: "(...) It does not exonerate him (...)"

    - - - Updated - - -



    Everyone in this case is Trumpettes.
    Oh god here we go.

  15. #16395
    Void Lord Elegiac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orbitus View Post
    Why? Because he isn't wrong.
    Pretty much.

    Skroe and most others have been saying since the probe started that "collusion" is a nebulous charge which is difficult to substantiate; which bore out, if Barr is to believed. The question was always whether or not there was an attempt to obstruct justice: and on that note, the only thing we know is that Mueller didn't find sufficient evidence for the DoJ to indict Trump - by the standards of a man who was put into the position of Attorney General for the express purpose of shielding Trump from indictment.

    Basically, the only thing that will exonerate Trump at this point is the text of the report explicitly saying as such.
    Quote Originally Posted by Marjane Satrapi
    The world is not divided between East and West. You are American, I am Iranian, we don't know each other, but we talk and understand each other perfectly. The difference between you and your government is much bigger than the difference between you and me. And the difference between me and my government is much bigger than the difference between me and you. And our governments are very much the same.

  16. #16396
    Quote Originally Posted by Celista View Post
    Oh god here we go.
    What? it is true. Until we have the full report on our proverbial laps, we cant jump to a conclussion.
    Forgive my english, as i'm not a native speaker



  17. #16397
    Quote Originally Posted by MoanaLisa View Post
    Asset seizure from Manafort paid for it.
    And your point? Money wasted on a useless investigation.
    "You know you that bitch when you cause all this conversation."

  18. #16398
    Void Lord Elegiac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Celista View Post
    Oh god here we go.
    Don't make stupid posts and don't get shit on. Simple enough.
    Quote Originally Posted by Marjane Satrapi
    The world is not divided between East and West. You are American, I am Iranian, we don't know each other, but we talk and understand each other perfectly. The difference between you and your government is much bigger than the difference between you and me. And the difference between me and my government is much bigger than the difference between me and you. And our governments are very much the same.

  19. #16399
    Quote Originally Posted by Didactic View Post
    Pretty much.

    Skroe and most others have been saying since the probe started that "collusion" is a nebulous charge which is difficult to substantiate; which bore out, if Barr is to believed. The question was always whether or not there was an attempt to obstruct justice: and on that note, the only thing we know is that Mueller didn't find sufficient evidence for the DoJ to indict Trump - by the standards of a man who was put into the position of Attorney General for the express purpose of shielding Trump from indictment.

    Basically, the only thing that will exonerate Trump at this point is the text of the report explicitly saying as such.
    The bolded part is important.
    Forgive my english, as i'm not a native speaker



  20. #16400
    Seems you Lefties just got a dose of reality.

    A tough pill to swallow, I know, given that you live in a pile of your own delusions.

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