[EU] Brexit negotiations at a standstill

[AeneasBK]

You could vote remain for racist reasons.

Yes. Apart from you, I don't think anyone was making the connection that "Some Leave voters are racists" means "No remain voters are racist".

[Shalcker]

Yes. Apart from you, I don't think anyone was making the connection that "Some Leave voters are racists" means "No remain voters are racist".

I'm not sure i see how people are making connection that "there were a lot more racists on one side then the other" i guess, so that was just counter-example to "guarantee" that made racists and exploiters into two completely separate groups.

Is that perception appears just because racists on Leave side were more outspoken? Or is there some hard data behind it? What's the proxy racism measure?

[Elegiac]

I'm not sure i see how people are making connection that "there were a lot more racists on one side then the other" i guess, so that was just counter-example to "guarantee" that made racists and exploiters into two completely separate groups.

Is that perception appears just because racists on Leave side were more outspoken? Or is there some hard data behind it? What's the proxy racism measure?

Shackler, you don't quite seem to grasp none of us take you seriously and aren't going to provide you with a serious answer.

Perhaps you'd have more luck making a quota on Reddit.

[Elegiac]

Depends how you define it.

I'm sure, but given that I'm neither interested in stupid semantic arguments nor moving goalposts I will politely abstain.

Cameron's exact title is immaterial to his mishandling of both Scottish Independence and Brexit; harping on the former demonstrates no argument of substance regarding the latter.

[Elegiac]

There was a discussion about the PM's title.

No. There was a discussion about the Premier's role. You being unable to tell the difference is a you problem.

And that you can't seem to grasp that I'm not arguing what Cameron's title is but that is exact title is irrelevant is, again, a you problem.

[Slant]

That cuts both ways. There's a lot of middle/upper-class people that voted Remain that wanted migration so they could exploit foreign workers to get cheap goods. Those people are arguably worse than the Brexiteer isolationists.

I'm in favour of immigration personally, but not just as a way to exploit people to produce cheap goods.

I have yet to meet someone who wants more immigration. Anywhere on this planet. The most I see is people tolerating immigration and making the best of it. But want?

That's you talking bullshit.

[Elegiac]

I have yet to meet someone who wants more immigration. Anywhere on this planet. The most I see is people tolerating immigration and making the best of it. But want?

That's you talking bullshit.

Nah, I want more immigration.

Not for cheap labour though. If I wanted low paid uneducated workers I'd be looking at the Midlands rather than Poland.

[Slant]

Btw Dribs...

https://www.businessinsider.de/price...19-4?r=US&IR=T

The price of Brexit has been £66 billion so far, plus an impending recession — and it hasn't even started yet

Cha-chink! Cashing in, yet?

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Nah, I want more immigration.

Not for cheap labour though. If I wanted low paid uneducated workers I'd be looking at the Midlands rather than Poland.

Why do you want more immigration?

[Elegiac]

Why do you want more immigration?

Similar reason to free movement being one of the core pillars of the EU. I believe people as a whole are generally better off when their cultures and skillsets are transmissible.

[AeneasBK]

I have yet to meet someone who wants more immigration. Anywhere on this planet. The most I see is people tolerating immigration and making the best of it. But want?

That's you talking bullshit.

I think the inidividuals he means are things like construction company owners, for whom the prospect of employing 40 legit workers and 50 EAster nEuropean ones "under the table" is more attractive than paying 90 legit workers.

i.e. they exist but there's probably about 50 of them in the entire UK in the position to make serious dollar from cheap immigration ;p

[AeneasBK]

Again though, there is no racist motivation in the exploitation of workers. They'd be more than happy to exploit British workers if there were any willing to be exploited.

Well, for the most part we practice classism rather than racism; but you're right

[Shalcker]

Shackler, you don't quite seem to grasp none of us take you seriously and aren't going to provide you with a serious answer.

Perhaps you'd have more luck making a quota on Reddit.

You weren't making that comment seriously then, clearly, as you're unwilling to defend it.

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Depends how you define it. Leave racism is pretty obvious. Remain racism is not obvious even to the people who hold those views. It is the "where will the baristas come from" crowd who generally think they are actually socially progressive.

As far as i see Isolationism/Exploitation are on different axis then Racism/Equality.

You could probably make a square like:
Racist-Isolationist - Keep those foreigners out, we can do everything better ourselves!
Racist-Exploitator - Get those foreigners in, deny them all rights and privileges, and keep their salary down!
Equality-Isolationist - People should work on making their own country better rather then seeking better spot for themselves in the world by uprooting themselves.
Equality-Exploitator - Everyone should be given opportunity to excel anywhere they want - so got to suck all talent out of the world to concentrate it in places which already have advantage to keep that advantage permanent.

[Slant]

Similar reason to free movement being one of the core pillars of the EU. I believe people as a whole are generally better off when their cultures and skillsets are transmissible.

Okay, you're supporting the idea of open borders. I get that. But you sounded like you'd want to import people at any cost.

[Mayhem]

As far as i see Isolationism/Exploitation are on different axis then Racism/Equality.

You could probably make a square like:
Racist-Isolationist - Keep those foreigners out, we can do everything better ourselves!
Racist-Exploitator - Get those foreigners in, deny them all rights and privileges, and keep their salary down!
Equality-Isolationist - People should work on making their own country better rather then seeking better spot for themselves in the world by uprooting themselves.
Equality-Exploitator - Everyone should be given opportunity to excel anywhere they want - so got to suck all talent out of the world to concentrate it in places which already have advantage to keep that advantage permanent.

What about Isolationist Exploitator?

[dribbles]

Btw Dribs...

https://www.businessinsider.de/price...19-4?r=US&IR=T



Cha-chink! Cashing in, yet?

Disappointed in you Slanty, once upon a time you were so on the ball, old age or laziness catching up with you?

That report was plagiarised from the PMI data released by IHS Market which I dealt with in detail 10 pages back. If anything it is an argument for many other nations to leave the EU whilst at the same time clearly showing how British membership of the EU has been damaging economically to the UK.

Compare the current UK PMI figures that your article mentions with those of Germany, what do you see? Prepare yourself for the worst German figures in almost 10 years. And if the French could take a weekend off from the rioting at their EU influenced government their figures are not much better either.

The economic outlook for the UK maybe neutral, the EU is already, in the economies that matter, negative.

If only we had left on March 29th and the EU stopped continually dragging us down...

[Kronik85]

What about Isolationist Exploitator?

Do we have a name for a type of trolling whereby you will engage with anyone about any non sequitur providing that it deflects from the topic at hand?

Because if we don't then I'm calling it Shalckering from henceforth.

[Acidbaron]

Do we have a name for a type of trolling whereby you will engage with anyone about any non sequitur providing that it deflects from the topic at hand?

Because if we don't then I'm calling it Shalckering from henceforth.

I find it almost mandatory to incorporate the word turnip in describing his type of trolling.

[Shalcker]

What about Isolationist Exploitator?

You mean something like "Keep those foreigners out and exploit them in place"? Like traditional British imperialism?

I think you need actual colonies for that... modern outsourcing doesn't seem to cut it.

[Kronik85]

Macron's plan actually includes a solution in a directive to force equal pay for EU immigrants with the locals in each member state. As far as illegal employment is concerned, that is up to the individual states to solve (by having massive fines).

We have a minimum wage in the UK, hiring foreigners is no cheaper than hiring the locals providing you are playing by the rules (eg not dealing with gang masters who will bus out you out 20 eastern European slaves working for 50p an hour).

[Kronik85]

I find it almost mandatory to incorporate the word turnip in describing his type of trolling.

”Turniping" then?

"To engage in relatively good faith with any argument in order to deflect from the subject at hand"?