The Next WoW class in 9.0

[Thagrynor]

Monk fit very well with the MoP design. There isn't going to be an expansion where we suddenly find a ton of tinkers that have been hidden from the world.

To be fair, while it is not a whole expansion, Mechagon appears to be an area filled with Tinkers and similar "classes" of folks. And with the design of the next expansion, a simple explanation could be that the Void is trying to kill everything, so the factions are embracing mechanical options as they cannot be "killed". Couple that with the idea of burrowing into the actual heart of Azeroth to fight N'zoth, and going to the Undermine as a precursor to the actual Void, as part of the Black Empire, for example, and there is a realistic reason to have Tinkers as a new class.

[Daikoku]

Uh. No. Sorry. You're really really grasping at straws here. A peon in a shredder, is not a tinker like people are describing it. Not even close. Using a machine that just whields a spinning blade, doesn't create or mean it will be a class. Try again.

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Yeah tell me about it. Every time I see people mention tinker, I just want to barf. If this is where Blizzard thinks the player base wants to be? The LEAST played races given a new class option... NEVER GONNA HAPPEN.

Same as for DH we saw or fight like 3 DH through 15 years and still we had it as Class

While we had and entire dungeon with Tinkers and a part of a raid plus 1 is a faction leader, a boss in BoD, a boss in SoO another famous NPC from War3 as secondary leader of goblin if we did 8.1.5 war campaign and 8.2 will bring anothrr entire dungeon of tinkers probably.

[Thagrynor]

Yeah tell me about it. Every time I see people mention tinker, I just want to barf. If this is where Blizzard thinks the player base wants to be? The LEAST played races given a new class option... NEVER GONNA HAPPEN.

So your preference is what? Honest question. Which of the above, if a new class is coming, would you prefer?

[Kumorii]

1. Island Expedition Tinkers (with Gazlowe's abilities from HotS)
2. 7th Legion and Gnomeregan Tinkers
3. Blackfuse, Gelbin, Galliwyx, and Gazlowe all piloting mechs
4. Mechagon
5. Tinker being a WC3 hero unit

Being represented is no real indication of it being playable. We had plenty of spellbreakers in tbc but no spellbreaker class. We had mechs before in gnomeregan, which had tinkers(which is basicly engineering which gnomes and goblins are known for). Still no tinkers class.

Dunno, just seems like people wishing it to be true. Which it might be, but I don't see it. Needs to tie in with story and I find it more likely that sylvanas story leads to ranger class with the third sister(can't remember name, not alleria) sharing their ranger knowledge.

Then again that's also wishful thinking from my side.

[Ielenia]

There was no misconception. I'm well aware of what the term refers to. I wasn't defining the term, my point was that it wasn't a good system even at launch, because of the problem i described where those roles weren't filled as much as would have been needed. It was completely overlooked that hey maybe people don't want to be yelled and blamed in every instance for every wipe, just cause they are a tank, regardless who's fault it really was, tank got blamed, cause the system created allowed it.

That's a people problem, not a game problem. You're basically saying that Social Media is bad system because there are people around that will go for your throat (figuratively speaking) the moment you post something that they don't agree with.

Which is something recent mmos that have come after have fixed by not having holy trinity in their system from the get go. Cause as a game system it doesn't really provide a meaningful aspect. Why is that an unbreakable game system, the open world isn't build around it. It's only the instanced content. Does it provide something that cannot be changed within WoW, is it a core feature that if changed would change the view of every player still playing? That player is a tank kudos to them, this player is a dps so nice that they are a dps. Would it make players quit the game that they cannot be a dedicated tank anymore after 15 years of tanking? No it just sounds that nobody wants to adapt. It sounds that everything new is always bad. Must be why classic is getting re-released. Not every new thing is a success, but without trying we would be playing the same game forever. And honestly it's not that perfect, nor has it ever been.

"Other games" are not WoW. They do "their own thing". And yes, the class system is a core feature of the game. I doubt it can be changed any easier than coding the ability to replace your starting bag can.

One reason is that all the instance content in the game is based on purely to the holy trinity. All of it would require a complete overhaul.
So we can't get completely rid of it, but that doesn't mean we can't alter it. It's not some written in stone rule, how it operates.

You just said it yourself: it would take a complete overhaul of the combat and class systems (at least) to make a support non-healer class possible. To the point that the game would practically become a completely different game, gameplay-wise.

Remaking combat rules, character stats, class stats, etc, all to add a new class type to the game is simply not feasible.

It doesn't have to be a reimplementation of tbc shamans or vanilla warlocks, where one is required for a group.

Except, if a support class is implemented, it will either: a) have completely negligible buffs and debuffs that will make the class useless and under-represented; or b) the class will have must-have buffs or debuffs that will make the class a "must-have" in every group. Just like shamans and paladins were, way back then.

[Daikoku]

Being represented is no real indication of it being playable. We had plenty of spellbreakers in tbc but no spellbreaker class. We had mechs before in gnomeregan, which had tinkers(which is basicly engineering which gnomes and goblins are known for). Still no tinkers class.

Dunno, just seems like people wishing it to be true. Which it might be, but I don't see it. Needs to tie in with story and I find it more likely that sylvanas story leads to ranger class with the third sister(can't remember name, not alleria) sharing their ranger knowledge.

Then again that's also wishful thinking from my side.

Please LIST all the spellbreakers especially the one with some kind of relevance or don't bother making random post.

Because we have enough DH and Tinker NPC to call it plausible.

[Ielenia]

Or simply have Junker Gnomes and Vulpera introduced as playable races in the next expansion.

I sincerely doubt mecha-gnomes and vulpera will ever become "expansion races". They use existing skeletons and animations. Expansion races have completely new animations and skeleton rigs.

[Daikoku]

I sincerely doubt mecha-gnomes and vulpera will ever become "expansion races". They use existing skeletons and animations. Expansion races have completely new animations and skeleton rigs.

Vulpera and Mechagnome make really no sense at this point begin introduced.

[Aleksej89]

Uh. No. Sorry. You're really really grasping at straws here. A peon in a shredder, is not a tinker like people are describing it. Not even close. Using a machine that just whields a spinning blade, doesn't create or mean it will be a class. Try again.
Yeah tell me about it. Every time I see people mention tinker, I just want to barf. If this is where Blizzard thinks the player base wants to be? The LEAST played races given a new class option... NEVER GONNA HAPPEN.

Where did you see a peon in a shredder?
Shredders are piloted by goblins and are obviously made by technology and science oriented people - such as tinkers, alchemists and similar.

A class with the basis of using science and high tech equipment as your main method of combat IS the tinker.
The basis for a class is science and technology itself in all its forms.

We have TWELVE classes that use magic either exclusively or to a significant degree - and not a single class that predominately or exclusively uses high technology and advanced science.

There is absolutely NO grasping at straws here.
Talking about classes such as the dark ranger is grasping at straws - those classes dont even have enough to compose a single working spec, let alone class identity.

Tinkers/Alchemists and many similar tech science oriented archetypes have been in WoW since vanilla.
As i said take a look at what is in the Gnomeregan or Ulduar or any of the other tech oriented places.
Countless NPCs exist who perform combat through high tech and science, ranging from lowly trash mobs all the way to bosses and faction leaders.

Your statements are so empty and void of reason it looks like you are just baiting and trolling.

[agentsi]

So your preference is what? Honest question. Which of the above, if a new class is coming, would you prefer?

None of them really make sense to be fair.

We have Warlocks and DKs, no need for Necro.
We have hunters, so I can't see them doing Dark rangers really.

Spellbreaker would be a very neat idea, but they've given a few of those type of skills to other classes, like DH. So if they revoke them? Maybe?

But the rest just make zero sense in WoWs current state. And where its going. We're going into the void in some way right? What part of a tinker, would help us versus the void? It wouldn't. Not a single part of it.

[Thagrynor]

Being represented is no real indication of it being playable. We had plenty of spellbreakers in tbc but no spellbreaker class. We had mechs before in gnomeregan, which had tinkers(which is basicly engineering which gnomes and goblins are known for). Still no tinkers class.

Dunno, just seems like people wishing it to be true. Which it might be, but I don't see it. Needs to tie in with story and I find it more likely that sylvanas story leads to ranger class with the third sister(can't remember name, not alleria) sharing their ranger knowledge.

Then again that's also wishful thinking from my side.

It is not just "representation". It is the fact that they are adding abilities and combat mechanics and even some combat animations. You don't add all that stuff to random NPCs. Granted, it could be things added for a whole host of NPCs that we will deal with in Mechagon. But to say that it isn't a step towards potentially adding a class is just shortsighted and you being unwilling to see and accept the possibility.

And Rangers cannot happen as they exist. Dark Rangers are literally 1 faction only. It could not work to have them on Alliance. That is like saying, "I want Banshees to be a class." or I want "Alliance Footmen" to a class.

[Teriz]

Uh. No. Sorry. You're really really grasping at straws here. A peon in a shredder, is not a tinker like people are describing it. Not even close. Using a machine that just whields a spinning blade, doesn't create or mean it will be a class. Try again.

It's origins:

http://classic.battle.net/war3/neutr...intinker.shtml

How Blizzard has expanded that concept since that time:

[Daikoku]

It is not just "representation". It is the fact that they are adding abilities and combat mechanics and even some combat animations. You don't add all that stuff to random NPCs. Granted, it could be things added for a whole host of NPCs that we will deal with in Mechagon. But to say that it isn't a step towards potentially adding a class is just shortsighted and you being unwilling to see and accept the possibility.

And Rangers cannot happen as they exist. Dark Rangers are literally 1 faction only. It could not work to have them on Alliance. That is like saying, "I want Banshees to be a class." or I want "Alliance Footmen" to a class.

Also because if Alliance can get Dark Rangers


Worgens and Gilneas will leave asap.

[Kromus!]

I have a feeling that the next expac will break pattern and not have a new class. I hope it does personally.

If the next expansion is Northrend revamp themed, it will probably be necromancer and they'll retcon some stuff, maybe do some fresh angles but it would probably just be deathknight in a dress. I still like the idea of this, even though the least original.

If its Void/black empire themed, something like a Herald/Dark Ranger. Uses chaos energies/void stuff. The void side has potential to be pretty unique.

If they did do a tinker class, I think they'd add Ethereals into the mix for it as a mutual allied race, as well as Gnome and Goblin. I think it's a good avenue to explore.

[Kumorii]

All of those things contribute to the lore around Tinkers existing, that they are a part of the world and that they are much more fleshed out than simply a statement of "some folks use mechanical stuff." The teams in the Islands really show that they are fleshing out potential abilities, "specs", roles, etc that could be easily adapted into a full class. Mekkatorque has abilities that, to a lesser degree, could be adapted into player class abilities.

Additionally, Mekkatorque alone being a more prominent part and his death could spark a response of a "The High Tinker has perished. We need more Tinkers to heed the call and join us in avenging our King!" kind of call to action for the Gnomes, while the Goblins would see them mobilizing and train more in response. Thus, both races would have them. Add in Dwarves and Vulpera, maybe Dark Iron and maybe Mag'har (Iron Horde esque), and you have a bunch of races that could then become Tinkers.

Thanks, seems reasonable. Although I think the abilities used on islands are just rehashed abilities from hots or previous encounters. I wouldn't say that's testing the waters or fleshing it out, mainly giving flavor in an easy and cheap way since there aren't much to come up with.

Find it a bit odd that suddenly they will start training tinkers since they evidently already have been recruiting some but I guess they can use Mekkatorque story into some tinkering stuff.

[Ielenia]

I think healing would be easy, using their own life force to imbue heals, so they would do a little bit of damage to "reap" the life essence of the enemies and unleash more powerful heals and shields to allies.

I pretty much made a very basic necromancer concept using blood magic as a healer spec, inspired by the D2/D3 necromancers.

[agentsi]

Same as for DH we saw or fight like 3 DH through 15 years and still we had it as Class

While we had and entire dungeon with Tinkers and a part of a raid plus 1 is a faction leader, a boss in BoD, a boss in SoO another famous NPC from War3 as secondary leader of goblin if we did 8.1.5 war campaign and 8.2 will bring anothrr entire dungeon of tinkers probably.

Uhhh what? You're joking right? The illadari were ALL over TBC, Shadowmoon Valley? Jesus christ you don't even try to make sense.

[Daikoku]

It is pretty easy to introduce Tinker post BFA rather than for Necromancer ROFL or Dark Ranger

When we already have them as classes somehow.

[agentsi]

To be fair, while it is not a whole expansion, Mechagon appears to be an area filled with Tinkers and similar "classes" of folks. And with the design of the next expansion, a simple explanation could be that the Void is trying to kill everything, so the factions are embracing mechanical options as they cannot be "killed". Couple that with the idea of burrowing into the actual heart of Azeroth to fight N'zoth, and going to the Undermine as a precursor to the actual Void, as part of the Black Empire, for example, and there is a realistic reason to have Tinkers as a new class.

I thought about that. But void magic / death magic, while it can't hurt the machines, it was always capable of hurting the person controlling it. Therefore making it void of use.

[Thagrynor]

None of them really make sense to be fair.

We have Warlocks and DKs, no need for Necro.
We have hunters, so I can't see them doing Dark rangers really.

Spellbreaker would be a very neat idea, but they've given a few of those type of skills to other classes, like DH. So if they revoke them? Maybe?

But the rest just make zero sense in WoWs current state. And where its going. We're going into the void in some way right? What part of a tinker, would help us versus the void? It wouldn't. Not a single part of it.

False. The Void seeks what? To end life. What life does a mechanical being have to end? None. Not as the Void wants it. Having a class/race/whatever that is effectively ignored by/immune to the desires of the main villains seems like a pretty important trait to have. Sure, they aren't powerful enough in their own right to simply end them, but to say they wouldn't aide in defeating the Void is nonsense. The Tinkers bots and mechanical devices give them an edge that the Void would need to figure out an answer to. And they would, likely, just as they would have an answer to most power we throw at it. But again, it is an edge that would need to be overcome. A secret weapon they wouldn't be anticipating.