Why there are so many night elf haters?

[mickybrighteyes]

Dalaran was aware of this. Dalaran was allied with the Alliance in Vanilla and would probably have warned Southshore about it at the very least. She had five or so years to find out about it, it's not that much of a stretch.

Not sure what the state was between their original bubble ruins and what was going on inside the city.

The nearby towns were still around and interacting with some of the nearby regions like southshore, but I don't think it was exactly clear what was going on inside the bubble.

[Hellspawn]

My personal reasons:
2. Tyrande being an idiot (and really pissing me off in Val'sharah), Malfurion being elevated to God-tier levels and Shandris fawning over a stupid human meme character all left a sour taste in regards to major Night Elf characters. The only one I don't dislike is Maiev and even with her they did a full 180 back in Legion.
3. Them becoming infected by human potential (which is true for all Alliance races, but nowhere is it as blatant as with Night Elves)

I hate that to, that is genereally an alliance problem. But in this instance, they toned that down when people complained about it. Also with 8.1 they go their own direction, so lets see where this leads. But surely it is noticeable that the quests and story are written by different people.

[Syegfryed]

You hate us, 'cause you ain't us.

i hate you because you are you

[mickybrighteyes]

The night elves coming over to fight trolls wasn’t common knowledge, and Lorash’s age wasn’t a retcon because we never had official confirmation how long high elves could live.

The thing about Lorash's age was that it was sort of casually dropped and we had other 'elderly' elves around who are FAR younger. At least that was my thinking. Now casters typically live long periods of time. But the only time we had any real info on lifespans was the RPG and max lifespan stated then for high elves was under 4000.


edit:

I think the only thing to really reference is that might be canon is Anasterian Sunstrider. Who was referenced as 'old' while he had yet to reach 3000 years old.

Lorash comes along as a 'mundane' class of rogue and is somehow in the ballpark of 6k+?

[Aeula]

Not sure what the state was between their original bubble ruins and what was going on inside the city.

The nearby towns were still around and interacting with some of the nearby regions like southshore, but I don't think it was exactly clear what was going on inside the bubble.

True, but there were Kirin Tor outside who likely knew. Such as in Silverpine and Hillsbrad proper.

[Friendlyimmolation]

The thing about Lorash's age was that it was sort of casually dropped and we had other 'elderly' elves around who are FAR younger. At least that was my thinking. Now casters typically live long periods of time. But the only time we had any real info on lifespans was the RPG and max lifespan stated then for high elves was under 4000.


edit:

I think the only thing to really reference is that might be canon is Anasterian Sunstrider. Who was referenced as 'old' while he had yet to reach 3000 years old.

Lorash comes along as a 'mundane' class of rogue and is somehow in the ballpark of 6k+?

Anasterian rules for three thousand years, but it never said he was only three thousand years old if I remeber correctly.

Alleria was over 2k years and had a child etc.

[Combatbutler]

edit:

I think the only thing to really reference is that might be canon is Anasterian Sunstrider. Who was referenced as 'old' while he had yet to reach 3000 years old.

Lorash comes along as a 'mundane' class of rogue and is somehow in the ballpark of 6k+?

Anasterian reigned for nearly 3.000 we never learned how old he actually was just the period of his reign.

- - - Updated - - -

Anasterian rules for three thousand years, but it never said he was only three thousand years old if I remeber correctly.

Alleria was over 2k years and had a child etc.

Alleria was at least ca 3k years old when she had Arathor

[mickybrighteyes]

True, but there were Kirin Tor outside who likely knew. Such as in Silverpine and Hillsbrad proper.

not entirely sure since we don't know teh exact details of how the system of governance was during the time when the city was falling apart and other people start showing up. Can we really discern that those people in tirisfal or at the crater were really had any understanding of what was going on in the violet hold.

[Mehrunes]

Blood elves are the worst kind of hypocrites when it comes to finger pointing. Everything's somebody else's fault. They hate Night Elves for banishing them, when their circle kinda broke the world in the literal sense.

But it's Malfurion's spell that caused Well of Eternity to implode and then break the world. Also, Blood Elves are descendants of the Highborne that opposed Azshara.

Anasterian rules for three thousand years, but it never said he was only three thousand years old if I remeber correctly.

Alleria was over 2k years and had a child etc.

Alleria herself was closer to 3k already. She fought it the Troll Wars and those ended 2.8k years prior to the Dark Portal. And that was before a thousand years of bullshit in the Nether.

[steelballfc]

i don't care about NE

[mysticx]

But it's Malfurion's spell that caused Well of Eternity to implode and then break the world. Also, Blood Elves are descendants of the Highborne that opposed Azshara.

In Malfurion's defense, the alternative was letting Sargeras come through that portal at the Well of eternity, and that would've been sort of bad, too...

Blood elves are the descendants of highborne that kept using arcane magic after the War of the Ancients, something the other Night elves were (IMO understandably) not very happy with, Lorash (Or indeed any Blood elf) whining about their hardship due to banishment (Which they brought upon themselves, doing something they knew was forbidden) is just hypocrisy at its finest, what are they doing with void elves again? Starts with B... :3

[matrix123mko]

1. How did he actually become a dictator? After the shattering, there was nobody to lead the night elves - it actually made sense,that those,who lead the night elves against the Legion and the highborne would take the leadership. What did you expect,elections or something?

Yes, they should either choose a leader by election(candidates can be limited to Resistance leaders) or let highest rank highborne lead. I wouldn't be surprised if people preferred Illidan or Maiev.

And why would the night elves need the barrier? The decisions made by Malfurion and Tyrande were harsh,yet necessary to ensure,that the Legion wouldn't find the Azeroth again and a prohibition of using arcane can be compared to forcing the civilians to turn off the lights in the houses during the World War 2,so that the bombarders wouldn't drop the bombs on their heads.

That's why they need barrier. It lets them use arcane magic without risk of being noticed by demons. That prohibition was completely unnecesary, but Tyrande and Malfurion wanted their people to be bound to them, so they prohibited arcane magic which was substantial in their society.

If somebody's ambition prevails over the common sense,such individuals have to banished from the society,to ensure the safety of the others.

I want to banish Malfurion then.

2.Right,the orcs are so dull and naive beings,that they thought,that nobody inhabits Kalimdor and they are the only living being in there. How the night elves should've acted? Should they approach the orcs and ask kindly to stop lumbering the wood? And even if they did,I guess the orcs would then apologize and leave instead of charging into battle?

Grom would propably attack, but Thrall would negociate like he did with trolls, tauren and other races. We also have to remember that tauren might convince orcs not to chop in that holy site.

3.It's wrong to blame the night elves for the actions of Azshara. Remember,that the night elves and the highborne were not the same people - the night elves were considered as a filth to Azshara and her loyalists. You could blame the night elves,if they would kill the trolls left and right under Tyrande's and Malfurion's leadership.

I don't think highborne would bother to kill them by themselves. They would rather stay in their palaces while common soldiers fight. Of course, these common soldiers, as soldiers in any place and time usually do, loot, burn and rape. This is enough for trolls, really. Not to mention that trolls propably have problem with distingushing elves.

4.It's true,Varian started the war,but it's uncertain if it wasn't for a reason - and by that I mean,if the Blizzard won't admit,that Sylvanas actually knew about the Wrathgate.

I don't understand why Blizzard did that statement. I wonder if they need it for some future reveal or they just wanted to stir some additional controversy.

It's also unclear what were the relations between the night elves and the Shatterspear tribe - from what we see during the Cataclysm,they lived in the Darkshore for some time,they had settlements there.

They live there since fall of Atal'ai Hakkari, so 1500 years. We have to remember that Teldrassil has been planted after the Third War and thus night elves are the foreigners. It is said that it was difficult to find them, so propably elves ignored them. However, we don't know if they once had greater territory. It is possible that they were pushed to these caverns by elves.

If before they probably co-existed and with the approach of Horde they joined Garrosh's army,then they are the aggresors - cause I highly doubt,that before they were part of the Horde.

We don't really know why did they join the Horde. They may have been hired to fight or they wanted vengeance for something. Maybe spirits said them to do so.

- - - Updated - - -

In Malfurion's defense, the alternative was letting Sargeras come through that portal at the Well of eternity, and that would've been sort of bad, too...

That was really foolish, as it took a moment for the highborne to create Ban'dinoriel. I think if he would be more eager to talk with them, they would explain that.

Blood elves are the descendants of highborne that kept using arcane magic after the War of the Ancients, something the other Night elves were (IMO understandably) not very happy with, Lorash (Or indeed any Blood elf) whining about their hardship due to banishment (Which they brought upon themselves, doing something they knew was forbidden) is just hypocrisy at its finest, what are they doing with void elves again? Starts with B... :3

That was really out of character. I don't get why didn't they just try to upgrade Ban'dinoriel. Blizzard should come up with some explanation for that.

[Feanoro]

That's why they need barrier. It lets them use arcane magic without risk of being noticed by demons. That prohibition was completely unnecesary

Hindsight. Right after the literal end of the world as they knew it, "hey let's resume doing what attracted the demons" isn't going to win a popular vote. You can hardly fault the survivors taking a very dim view of experimenting with what just caused the apocalypse and not being willing to risk Apocalypse 2.

Tyrande and Malfurion wanted their people to be bound to them, so they prohibited arcane magic which was substantial in their society.

Er what? Got a source on these never-before-heard-of ambitions?

They live there since fall of Atal'ai Hakkari, so 1500 years. We have to remember that Teldrassil has been planted after the Third War and thus night elves are the foreigners. It is said that it was difficult to find them, so propably elves ignored them. However, we don't know if they once had greater territory. It is possible that they were pushed to these caverns by elves.

Teldrassil was basically because they wanted all races to have capitals and starting areas that were relatively safe from pvp. They glossed over things like whether the NElves considered Darkshore the edges of Ashenvale, which is how it appears in game. An argument could be made that Darkshore is NElf land, but it's a detail that's just not addressed anywhere (to my knowledge).

We don't really know why did they join the Horde. They may have been hired to fight or they wanted vengeance for something. Maybe spirits said them to do so.

Because Blizz likes to gloss over things like different tribes of Orcs and Trolls and simply lump them all together.

That was really out of character. I don't get why didn't they just try to upgrade Ban'dinoriel. Blizzard should come up with some explanation for that.

Because like most things around the Nightborne and VElves, it was an asspull to justify a gameplay decision.

[Combatbutler]

Hindsight. Right after the literal end of the world as they knew it, "hey let's resume doing what attracted the demons" isn't going to win a popular vote. You can hardly fault the survivors taking a very dim view of experimenting with what just caused the apocalypse and not being willing to risk Apocalypse 2.

They didn't start right after though, the highborne barely used magic for almost three thousand years until they reached a breaking point and openly defied the law, resulting in their exile. The night elf leadership dismissed the arcane teachings outright out of paranoia, despite the fact that many other societies on the planet used arcane magic, making the ban pointless to begin with.

[Feanoro]

They didn't start right after though, the highborne barely used magic for almost three thousand years until they reached a breaking point and openly defied the law, resulting in their exile.

Hmmm, the three thousand years is a change, I'll take your word on it though.

The night elf leadership dismissed the arcane teachings outright out of paranoia, despite the fact that many other societies on the planet used arcane magic, making the ban pointless to begin with.

What other societies? How did they know about them? There were two major elements in that story, their xenophobia and being the only ones using the arcane, which is how they created their empire. Humans learned arcane magic from Highborne only after Silvermoon was fully established, so unless we're up to more poorly written time travel...

[Skytotem]

Honestly I think the orc fixation on Ashenvale and the rest of nelf territory has been bad for the Horde story, Blizz hasn't done a good job making the Nelfs feel like enemies to the orcs or making it clear WHY the orcs need these materials

Instead it's just made me feel like the orcs aren't able to survive without stealing, instead of building up their own society which does not make me feel badass, like playing Horde ought to.

[Combatbutler]

Hmmm, the three thousand years is a change, I'll take your word on it though.

The exile of the high elves being 7.300 years before the opening of the dark portal has been known for quite some time. Meaning 2.700 years of existence within the new night elf society.

What other societies? How did they know about them? There were two major elements in that story, their xenophobia and being the only ones using the arcane, which is how they created their empire. Humans learned arcane magic from Highborne only after Silvermoon was fully established, so unless we're up to more poorly written time travel...

Vrykul used arcane magic, so did all of the troll tribes and their esteemed dragon allies and those were the ones they should have been aware of, then there were the highborne enclaves of Eldre'thalas they forgot about, the highborne enclave of Shandaral, the city of Suramar, the titan keepers, the mogu, the Pandaren, the mantid, the nerubians etc.

[Syrah-the-Old-One]

Because of the sheer number of elves that were forced into our mouths with Allied races + People crying for Highelves in the Alliance.

Call it catharsis maybe ?

[Combatbutler]

In Malfurion's defense, the alternative was letting Sargeras come through that portal at the Well of eternity, and that would've been sort of bad, too...

Lorash (Or indeed any Blood elf) whining about their hardship due to banishment (Which they brought upon themselves, doing something they knew was forbidden) is just hypocrisy at its finest, what are they doing with void elves again? Starts with B... :3

Comparing the void and arcane is quite dishonest, one is pretty much the ultimate source of corruption and entropy, the other is a life giving source of power that enhances the natural cycle of life.

Blood elves are the descendants of highborne that kept using arcane magic after the War of the Ancients, something the other Night elves were (IMO understandably) not very happy with

How is it understandable, their closest allies the dragons were using arcane magic left and right, pretty much every other advanced civilization on the planet did so as well, the ban on arcane magic was stupid, supervision was necessary to make sure people weren't abusing their power, but the outright ban was utterly retarded. Just imagine what night elf society would look today if the druids had actually allowed it to be practiced in a manner it was in Quel'thalas, hidden behind a barrier.

Granted humanity would have been wiped out by the Amani, but still night elf society would have been much stronger.

[Feanoro]

Vrykul used arcane magic, so did all of the troll tribes and their esteemed dragon allies and those were the ones they should have been aware of, then there were the highborne enclaves of Eldre'thalas they forgot about, the highborne enclave of Shandaral, the city of Suramar, the titan keepers, the mogu, the Pandaren, the mantid, the nerubians etc.

Putting them into lists.

Unknown at the time of the prohibition
Vrykul, mogu, pandaren

Considered evil and/or dangerous, which doesn't help get warm fuzzies for arcane
Mantid, nerubians

Considered lost/destroyed or hid themselves
Eldre'thalas, Shandaral, the city of Suramar


Titan keepers tend to stay apart, as part of their jobs to oversee. Dragons similarly stay mostly aloof. In both cases though, they would have been revered as higher beings. As such, it would be assumed they knew what the hell they were doing. The prohibition on the arcane was more about the recklessness of Highborne usage than arcane itself. The idea was to prevent such carelessness happening again, not unlike withholding booze from an alcoholic.