I like to leave pugs when people dont hit interrupts or dps is low. No point in carrying people to get them loot.
I like to leave pugs when people dont hit interrupts or dps is low. No point in carrying people to get them loot.
Completely disagree here. r.io provides great data on an applicant. If I see someone in queue, I can look them up and look at their runs for the key, the affixes and make a somewhat informed decision about a pugs potential competence for the run.
Scoring for the affixes is a poor metric, because there is variance between classes/roles for various affixes. Also, how do we determine what affix is worth more? Bursting is harder on some tanks than others, same with necrotic, grievous is harder on some healers more than others, quaking harder on casters than melee and explosive harder on dot classes than melee. You can still see what affixes an applicant has completed and make your own judgement.
Of course the scoring system incentivises completing a dungeon, I'm not sure where you are drawing that conclusion from. Timing a key awards more than not timing, two-chesting even more, three chesting even more than that.
I'm not sure how you penalise key deserters, because it's not that simple. People leave for a variety of reasons, some decide to abandon the run altogether mutually due to running into issues, players can DC and fuck an entire run, so it's not so clear cut.
If a player has a 2k score with hundreds of departures within the first 5 minutes that would make absolutely zero difference to my decision-making process, because a 2k score for most classes will put you at least in the top 20 on the realm for the class and within the top 1% of all logged characters (at the time of posting). If they have a 2k score they have at least completed 17s (awards around 190-ish) and probably a few 18s. I don't see why not finishing a dungeon at all would be a factor when their total performance indicates that they are competent enough.
Wow @ the first comments telling me 15 is too high for my io rating - that I am not good enough for a 15 and am expecting/wanting to be boosted/carried. That's bullcrap. This is the type of elitism that raider io spawns. I'm not saying I am amazing, but I got to the #2 spot for horde priest healers on my server group (of 6) alone by pugging, not being carried, so I do my job just fine and then some. That's not to say you must be carried if you have friends, I'm not saying that. I'd love to be in that situation but my guildies (who I occasionally heal for) are doing 5's and 7's and my real id friends are doing like 16-21. Save me the "raise your io" crap because it isn't the only indicator of skill and 1200 isn't bad for a casual.
You are wrong. You should not invite people solely on their score. Here is a much better way to use the system:
In a similar way, if a 1200 player applies for a ML+15 key then they are likely trying to jump over their head. If they don't have ML+14 timed either, you may as well reject them without looking at any more details.
Last edited by ID811717; 2019-04-14 at 04:49 PM.
Raider.io is a dreadful system
What in the world is this io i keep seeing mentioned? Yes, I haven't played basically since the 1st month of Bfa
I do not see a reason to be outraged. Your realm rank is irrelevant, and the fact that you are pugging is irrelevant. A score of 1200 is not bad for a casual. But all that matters is how much experience you have pushing keys in general, and how much experience you have in a specific dungeon.
The overall score of 1200 is equivalent to timing every +12 dungeon in time. That is not indicative of being ready to time +15 keys. When you apply for a +15 key, it's still worth paying attention to what is your highest timed key in the specific dungeon. But if your highest is not +14, there is nothing to redeem that.
Your first statement is not objectively true. There are scenarios where that +20 score does not denote your mastery. It shows that MAYBE you know that one dungeon really well. Knowing Freehold inside and out does not translate to how well you know Temple of Sethraliss. It is possible to be carried through that one dungeon. IT is also possible, but much less likely to be carried through every single dungeon. Your premise requires the acceptance that all dungeons are exactly the same, and that all affixes effect the dungeons exactly the same, which is completely not the case. Group makers want to choose the player generally with the most complete experience across the board, not a superstar at this one specific thing.
Felpooti - DH - Echo Isles
Hack - Warrior - Echo Isles
Pootie - Hunter - Echo Isles
Ouraged? I wouldn't go that far. More like frustrated and discouraged. I've double chested dungeons 12's and 13's. I've done all of the dungeons over 10.
You shouldn't have to do every dungeon at 14 in time to be able to do a 15 in time. So your point is ridiculous. You don't need high io to be ready and able to do a timed run a single level higher than you have. And back to the first point. If you have done all the dungeons above 10, literally nothing changes as you go up except it is a bit harder each level and it really comes down to affix and what comp you want to run.
Again, you are saying you wouldn't invite someone for a 15 TOS if they have double chested a 13 TOS? No redeeming that? You're the definition of elitist.
But someone making a group, has the right to use whatever metric they see fit to compose that group.
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Why do people owe you something? You are assuming that a group wont take you based on your score, but maybe, just MAYBE they had a more experienced player than you apply? Do they not owe it to they whole group to bring the seemingly most experienced player based on the information they have? Do you suggest they hold interviews to get to know all the applicants before picking one?
Felpooti - DH - Echo Isles
Hack - Warrior - Echo Isles
Pootie - Hunter - Echo Isles
I almost did a 14 in time and the highest thing I've done in time is a 10. Leading damage and not dying.
It's all about who you group with, imo. If you get Randy Mcdirtbag and Randumz Mcgee, then yeah, they won't let you in arbitrarily and people will also arbitrarily list excuses why you don't qualify for a 15, even though theoretically you could time one. My buddy who is like 1700 io gets denied on his Shadow priest all the time just because Shadow.
This is where you learn the IO doesn't make actual sense because it's being utilized by morons (jk) and that people are militant more on principle, than actual ability. If you've been raiding at the highest level since launch, then I think you have a good grasp on how to do M+. Interrupting and not standing in bad to a timer is not exactly rocket science and they are easy if you're in BiS gear/traits and know how to mitigate/avoid dmg.
Even a monkey at a typewriter can get 1.8k - 2k score. Good players are @ 2,8k - 3,5k score, now you can guess what your 1,2k are put some effort into it and you will be invited to normal groups.
I don't assume it's one particular reason over another, that is why I often ask. Sometimes I get no response or someone who says they won't tell me why they wouldn't invite me. But just going by those who do give me answers - it's sometimes my io isn't high enough but more often it's because I haven't already completed a 15.
Why do people own me something? Typical elitist/apologist response. I expect difficulty in pugging and to come in contact with toxic player, but would like (emphasis on like) to be given a chance from time to time. If you are trying to progress and you point out that people often have extreme requirements, shall I say to you, what do think these people owe you? This is a way to dismiss valid gripes regarding this system and certain types who use it. I don't think someone owe's me a spot. I apply because I believe I can fulfill my role and be a benefit to my group. I'm tired of seeing people not pull their own weight or leave over the slightest thing. There's nothing wrong with me feeling that way. Did your feelings get hurt for you to reply to me with this nonsense.
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Oh look. Another person suggesting I shouldn't complain. You are being dishonest. It takes time and effort. Not everyone is casual by choice. Some people have jobs and children and school and don't have time to grind out io rating. Not to mention, there are others things in game to do. So in your mind, 1200 took no time and effort on my part, but if i just put some effort into raising my score to 2.8 or 3.5 (because that is easily obtainable for a casual, right?) then I can be considered good and get invited to normal groups. Do you listen to yourself?
Last edited by Evelyn; 2019-04-14 at 07:30 PM.
What class/spec a person is seems to have been neglected in this post. As keys get higher it's harder to get into groups as a certain class. Classes like rogue, and dh have an easy time getting into keys. Like my Dh who is 408ilvl with a raider io of >700 has had no problem getting into keys when I try to get into groups. So it is possible that the person who is making the m+ group wants to run with certain classes/specs and your class doesn't fall into that comp. Then it seems that people want to blame it on their io score instead.
And as keys get higher they also become less forgiving. You get to a point where if someone messes up or the group wipes once, it's a scuffed key. Unlike with 10-12s you can easily wipe a group times and still time the key no problem. So if I were to make a group I would be more inclined to pick someone with a higher io and of a good spec. And the thing is that there are a lot of other players (or at least there were) queing for the same key, so you have to make yourself stand out somehow. And for me that doesn't necessarily mean ilvl because after a certain ilvl I don't really care what you're ilvl is.
I play holy priest for mythic+. I should have clarified. I'm aware that as you get higher keys, you have less room to make mistakes. If someone whispers me saying they are looking for a druid because brez, I mention that I have eng brez. I don't expect it to change their mind (it's not as good as a druids) but it has happened before. I think holy is underrated and the utility I bring to the party ought to be considered.
What you guys saying "but he knows how to do 1 dungeon really well" aren't considering is if the maker of the group wants to keep doing keys after that one.
Oh look the "I hAvE A jOb" Jocker .... im 9/9M and i have 2,2k io guess what i have a job too, and no i dont tell you to get 2,8k (I seriously doubt that you get over 2k Judging by your comments here ) i tell you to get near the score you want to play, for +15 a min. score of 1,4k and so on.
this is quite typical.
raider.io was invented by people who wanted to ensure that they can keep the difficulty level of mythic + on level of lfr by going there in overgeared overqualified groups but still be able to pretend that they are god's gift to humanity .
the level if entitlement to smooth wipeless runs is terrible
but its clearly showing how toxic and detrimental to game is making hard content .