Russian Support for Stalin Surges to Record High, Poll Shows

[RussianGoblin]

How do you convince millions of people that a tyrant was good for the country? Even better than the current regime?

There were many radical movements and ideologies clashing during those times.
There was geopolitical instability and fast technology/society changes.
Its easy to judge him today. But times were different back then.
Despite all the internal/external problems and pressure he kept the country in one piece;
Under his rule ussr went through rapid industrialization and became a superpower.
Maybe many russians perceive their country as weak today and that makes them think of stalin positively?

[Kaleredar]

He most definately was. We can all pile on Hitler for all the right reasons but to say he wasn't effective in terms of building Germany up would be a lie.

That's burying the lede, though. Hitler, and Stalin's, rapid short term buildups of their countries weren't done in spite of the terrible things they did, they were rapidly accomplished because of the things they did. Those are inextricable components of their leadership, and people "hand waving" away those things is what causes morons to worship these people.

Both countries might have surged in productivity, but they then crashed and burned swiftly afterwards. The USSR might have stuck it out longer than Germany did, but in the 80s and 90s it what extremely apparent which side of the iron curtain had stayed with the times, and which side had sunk into destitute misery. Nobody hopped the wall to get into East Germany.

[Charge me Doctor]

Post hoc reasoning right there.

Pot, meet kettle.

I'll also repeat this to anyone, who thinks that Stalin is single-handedly murdered millions upon millions innocent USSR people:
It's also easy to blame Stalin for everything, and close your eyes on what NKVD did and people like Ezhov or Beria. Why no one EVER remember these guys when Stalin is brought up? Why don't you look at whole picture and don't understand that whole apparatus wasn't treating humans very... humane?

[Kaleredar]

Pot, meet kettle.

I'll also repeat this to anyone, who thinks that Stalin is single-handedly murdered millions upon millions innocent USSR people:
It's also easy to blame Stalin for everything, and close your eyes on what NKVD did and people like Ezhov or Beria. Why no one EVER remember these guys when Stalin is brought up? Why don't you look at whole picture and don't understand that whole apparatus wasn't treating humans very... humane?

The whole management situation was a shitshow. But stalin was the figurehead, he held a tremendous amount of power, and he's the one that, according to this thread, Russians are "fondly remembering" as a great and effective leader.

I do wonder how many Russians alive now that lived during his rule hold that same opinion about him.

[Shalcker]

The whole management situation was a shitshow. But stalin was the figurehead, he held a tremendous amount of power, and he's the one that, according to this thread, Russians are "fondly remembering" as a great and effective leader.

I do wonder how many Russians alive now that lived during his rule hold that same opinion about him.

Some did, some didn't. There was propaganda effort during Khruschev to pile all mistakes on Stalin too.

Many grandkids of Stalin's executioners are modern Russian liberals for some reason.

[Eldar45]

The support for Stalin has to do with him holding the country together against the Nazis. Not support for his communist purges. The mentality has traditionally been that yes he did horrible things, but being taken over by Nazi Germany would have been far worse.

He didn't help much at all though. He sat and sulked for several weeks after Barbarossa began, and when he did finally take command he wasn't good at it at all. When he finally let the army run itself is when the Red army started turning the Germans back.

[Kasierith]

He didn't help much at all though. He sat and sulked for several weeks after Barbarossa began, and when he did finally take command he wasn't good at it at all. When he finally let the army run itself is when the Red army started turning the Germans back.

I didn't say, and never will say, that he had any meaningful tactical impact. That said, he set the line of no surrender, no capitulation. And thats what Russians remember. He was the head of the ship and thus reaped the benefits of victory.

This is backed up by, well... Essentially any examination of the questions asked and the responses given show this. The people saying that these surveys show Russians love Stalin are being purposefully misleading. The question and answer is that he was a great leader, and honestly I don't think it's possible to fully disentangle Stalin from the USSRs victory.

[XDurionX]

How do you convince millions of people that a tyrant was good for the country? Even better than the current regime?

Ask the republicans?

[Ihavewaffles]

It is obviously much better to maintain oligarchy that bleeds people dry and incompetent czars rather then dream of society where everyone is equal and has equal access to education and healthcare, independent of their financial status.

That's not true, children of those that got purged were barred from higher education n good jobs.

[Shalcker]

That's not true, children of those that got purged were barred from higher education n good jobs.

Plenty were rehabilitated during Khruschev era and later.

Barring/limiting their children from education was reversed in mid-1930s. Jobs were scarce for everyone.

Plenty of sons and daughters of repressed elements went on to have a career in USSR (though it could make things harder for them, but not insurmountably so).

Also repressions of previously dominant elements (clergy, bourgeois, and other "exploitators") went from "social justice" perspective - quite reminiscent to modern social justice movement. Repressed classes were previously priviledged and so they had to pay - and clear up (limited) spots for those coming from worker and peasant background.

[Crispin]

Lack of education.

[Trbn]

Also, Stalin murder millions of his people after WW2. The war was over, the threat was done. There was no need to be as sadistically cruel as he was. The fact that you are saying that all of this was acceptable for progress is disgusting.

except nukes

[Shalcker]

except nukes

"Threat was gone" argument applies perfectly to US use of nukes on Japan as well.

Clearly that makes them monsters matching Stalin.

[d00mGuArD]

Interesting..

So Russians love Stalin.
The Chinese love Mao.
The Cubans love Castro.
The Vietnamese love Ho-Chi-Minh.

And syrians love Assad
Turks love Erdogan
etc etc

3rd world countries are gonna 3rd world. That is why they are 3rd world.
We can learn from it, by NOT following their example

[Trbn]

"Threat was gone" argument applies perfectly to US use of nukes on Japan as well.

Clearly that makes them monsters matching Stalin.

that was my point, how one can say that threat was gone when there was some maniacal country bombing innocent just for lulz

[Visor]

this story not about "love". Its about understanding and accepting price. If USSR have no Stalin then USSR most likely be defeated in WW2 and German nazi keep full control of EU and Asia. Nazi was very close to create their own atomic weapon. And 2-3 bombs from US do not stop them definitely. And with all this resources USA or GB have no chances to survive. That was dark times when Soviet leadership understand that no1 in EU will help them against nazi. Because after Munich Agreement when all EU signed peace treaty with nazi it was pretty obvious what will happen next. EU preffer surrender and work with nazi. USSR are not. That's why they have so many casualties. This is the price for freedom that no1 in EU was rdy to pay. Many ppl who live in EU right now must say thx to "tyrant" Stalin for their lives. That was saved cos Soviet ppl do their work and their parents survived. And after all this years Russians see how Europe "say thx" to them.

Ppl simply dont understand that great challenges require great price. And if you do not pay this price you will be cleared and washed out from history. Some ppl died so others can live. Thats how it works. Perhaps it hard to understand with modern world understanding where "every1 is uniq and his death soooo big story".

[Tabrotar]

Maybe you're the one being brainwashed though?

Or perhaps you could acknowledge those victims were part of huge societal transformation that in the end propelled some of those countries to superpower status?

To the point where some things established/developed under them still happen to be cornerstone of modern society?

Hey then we can say the same about the nazis then, they also wanted to transform society...

[VanishingAct]

Like the wests younger generation who want a similar type of suicide.

[Mormolyce]

Or perhaps you could acknowledge those victims were part of huge societal transformation that in the end propelled some of those countries to superpower status?

Yeah Russia couldn't ever have been a superpower without shit like the Holodomor lol.

[Trbn]

Yeah Russia couldn't ever have been a superpower without shit like the Holodomor lol.

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