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  1. #421
    so what? do you enjoy raiding mythic to get your loot? then why do you care if others get the same items as you doing lesser stuff? You still get prettier skins, better trinkets and chance to optimal stats which those getting gear from WQ wont get.

  2. #422
    Quote Originally Posted by OneWay View Post
    Well yeah, there aren't but you have azerite gear now. No one has been complaining so far that raid items are shit, hence it's same ol.
    My azerite gear is the same ilvl as mythic raids azerite gear.

  3. #423
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    Quote Originally Posted by kubaje View Post
    Crucible of Storms releasing, time to increase emissary rewards to 395/400.




    So Blizzard is saying that the majority of players doesn't raid mythic, which means they are either entirely or mostly invalidating everything the majority did for the past 3 months.

    This pretty much means: 1 week 3 months after raid release = 3 months of progressing multiple hours a week

    Why would any sane person choose to actually raid and invest that much more time when they can get the same rewards 3 months later without any effort by doing trivial content?
    because of the challenge that Mythic raids and high level Mythic+ provide? because they like raiding? pretty sure that it makes zero difference to mythic raiders how geared other people are. like literally zero. sure, the casual player might get extremely lucky and hit 410-415 ilvl. but that makes no difference to and doesn't lessen what the hardcore players do.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kubaje View Post
    "Scrubs" will have something like 400-410.

    You seem to not get what this changes means. You can now get items equal in quality to the ones you get in the second highest difficulty by only doing trivial content. At this point you don't even need a keyboard and can play with a steering wheel attached to your toaster and get the same rewards that people get who are actually trying.

    If people don't have to try, they won't and they will eventually quit. The devs should try to make me want to play as much as possible, not making in easy for me to skip everything and play as little as possible.
    why do you care so much? does it impact at all on your gameplay? or your guilds gameplay? no, no it doesn't - at least not negatively anyway. so why are you whinging?

  4. #424
    Quote Originally Posted by MrLachyG View Post
    because of the challenge that Mythic raids and high level Mythic+ provide? because they like raiding? pretty sure that it makes zero difference to mythic raiders how geared other people are. like literally zero. sure, the casual player might get extremely lucky and hit 410-415 ilvl. but that makes no difference to and doesn't lessen what the hardcore players do.
    Casual doesn't mean bad. I'm casual, I don't like this change at all. My alts are all 400+ just from doing a 10 per week, doing warfronts when up and doing world boss when up. My 2 chars I play mythic plus with friends on, that I've played higher keys on, are around those item lvls you specified.

  5. #425
    Quote Originally Posted by krl View Post
    I partially share your view. The gear incentive to do difficult, organized content has all but disappeared in this game. It was a powerful motivator for people to keep playing and apply in guilds. On the other hand I'm quite happy we can get players in MM raiding shape in two weeks...
    good so go play your classic instead pollute retail and pretending you are interesting in retail.

    im sure this will be amazing experience to play 16 year old game in ints primitive state from 2004

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    Quote Originally Posted by Heran View Post
    Casual doesn't mean bad. I'm casual, I don't like this change at all. My alts are all 400+ just from doing a 10 per week, doing warfronts when up and doing world boss when up. My 2 chars I play mythic plus with friends on, that I've played higher keys on, are around those item lvls you specified.
    if you are doin mythic + 10 you are not casual - you are in top 5% of players.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sunderella View Post
    so what? do you enjoy raiding mythic to get your loot? then why do you care if others get the same items as you doing lesser stuff? You still get prettier skins, better trinkets and chance to optimal stats which those getting gear from WQ wont get.
    they are just angry that casual finally get content to do in game and its no longer catering only to nolifers.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Magical Mudcrab View Post
    Sure, you can look at related WoW search terms and their size compared to previous expansions - BfA has fewer people searching for WoW-related terms than any other expansion - or the overall player feedback for BfA, specifically regarding gear and the gearing systems. The only people who seem to be on-board with the current systems are people who feel entitled to gear they haven't worked for, or people being intentionally obtuse.
    it has also more people then ever before out there doing quests. i have never seen that many people out in world even in legion .

    clearly you are not target audience .

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    Quote Originally Posted by ReD-EyeD View Post
    People like this is the reason we can't have good things. Farming same dailies over and over again for arbitrary numbers and having fun doing it.

    Now don't get me wrong, you can have fun in your own way and there is nothing wrong with it, but why would developers change their game if there are enough people to do their checkmark activities?
    because clearly they have statistics proving them correct - regrdless of how much you hate it '

    stop living in elitest bubble and acknowledge that different people play this game differently

  6. #426
    Quote Originally Posted by kamuimac View Post

    if you are doin mythic + 10 you are not casual - you are in top 5% of players.
    Casual does not mean a player who is bad. It means a player who is not playing a lot. I have a whole 8 days /played on my priest at 120 since BFA launch. I come home, ask if someone wants to play a mythic plus, do it and then I'm off again. I do the warfronts once per character during the time they're up, I do a weekly 10 on my alts when I have the time and then I've done higher keys on 2 characters, when I have the time. Estimate playtime per week? About 8-10 hours. Most of the people who you think are casuals are just bad players who spend an obscene amount of time in the game but still does not improve.
    Last edited by Heran; 2019-04-22 at 12:33 PM.

  7. #427
    Quote Originally Posted by Heran View Post
    Casual doesn't mean bad. I'm casual, I don't like this change at all. My alts are all 400+ just from doing a 10 per week, doing warfronts when up and doing world boss when up. My 2 chars I play mythic plus with friends on, that I've played higher keys on, are around those item lvls you specified.
    Sorry, but you're not casual then. Doing trivial content is not being casual. It's all about time and effort investments.
    I have friends that only collect mounts and pets in wow, but they're pretty hardcore about it. I honestly can't call them casuals.

  8. #428
    Quote Originally Posted by ReD-EyeD View Post
    Sorry, but you're not casual then. Doing trivial content is not being casual. It's all about time and effort investments.
    I have friends that only collect mounts and pets in wow, but they're pretty hardcore about it. I honestly can't call them casuals.
    Ok? I've got 8 days /played on my priest since BFA launch and that's my main character. I know people who have closer to 50 days and still can't progress beyond normal mythic/LFR quality gear. Those people with 50 days are the ones that are being labeled casual players by people when the proper term is bad players.
    Last edited by Heran; 2019-04-22 at 12:39 PM.

  9. #429
    Quote Originally Posted by kubaje View Post

    So Blizzard is saying that the majority of players doesn't raid mythic, which means they are either entirely or mostly invalidating everything the majority did for the past 3 months.
    The vast majority of players don't touch mythic. According to wowhead, 444 guilds have cleared BoD as of today. If we estimate there are 80 unique accounts per mythic guild, that means that just over 35k players are 9/9. This is probably an overestimate. This is 4% of a million accounts. Perhaps double this number are still working through BoD, again, this is probably an overestimate. Mythic raiding is a minority interest.

  10. #430
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    Quote Originally Posted by Heran View Post
    I used to think Ghostcrawler was bad but Ion... That's another level.

    - - - Updated - - -



    What bonuses? There are no tier sets.
    Ghostcrawler at least tackled the issues head on and was never afraid to speak his mind. Even if it the change was unpopular he would explain why they did things on a much more human level. They haven't had any game director since who can communicate like he did.

    @OP But really this entire thread isn't an issue. This is how a gear treadmill works in a game where gear is your progression.
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  11. #431
    Quote Originally Posted by kamuimac View Post

    stop living in elitest bubble and acknowledge that different people play this game differently
    I'm not sure why you're being this hostile to me. I never said anything against it. More to it, I fully agree with you and saying this I stopped subscribing to BfA months ago because it's not the game made for me anymore, but for entirely different market.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Heran View Post
    Ok? I've got 8 days /played on my priest since BFA launch and that's my main character. I know people who have closer to 50 days and still can't progress beyond normal mythic/LFR quality gear. Those people with 50 days are the ones that are being labeled casual players by people when the proper term is bad players.
    I fail to understand how time spend online = skill, to call them "bad" players.

  12. #432
    Quote Originally Posted by ReD-EyeD View Post

    I fail to understand how time spend online = skill, to call them "bad" players.
    They're the ones that are called casual players when they should be called bad players, while actual casual players, like me aren't bad players. We don't need this. It's the bad players who need or want this feeding of gear to them, not casual players.

  13. #433
    Quote Originally Posted by Heran View Post
    while actual casual players, like me aren't bad players.
    Never heard this one.

  14. #434
    Quote Originally Posted by ReD-EyeD View Post
    Never heard this one.
    Hmm? I've done +15, these people who this caters to, can't even do any difficult content. They're the type of players who will wipe you in a m0 even and whines that content is too hard.

  15. #435
    I don't understand why this matters ?
    Like I play M raiding because I enjoy the progress and the banter in the 20m group. The gear is irrelevant, its just few numbers. Other people are getting more gear ? Cool for them, couldn't care less. If anything, it makes gearing an alt easier which I fully support.

    Overall, I do think its a good change.

  16. #436
    Quote Originally Posted by predlol View Post
    I don't understand why this matters ?
    Because it disrupts the entire gearing process. So does warfronts and world bosses dropping 400 gear. They never should have been added.

  17. #437
    Quote Originally Posted by Charge me Doctor View Post
    "Once i hit like 360+ i went into LFR once, then did a few M+0, for Azerite gear mostly and actually playing my character in a setting outside of WQ's, now that character just sits & waits for Emissaries each day.
    Nah, i just want both, get new and loot and have the raiding experience, if one is missing it feels bad.

    You're free to look into the past to find out that the "path of least resistance" is a real thing in WoW, do you think people farmed Mechanar because it was the best designed instance?
    Or to make a more recent example, Maw of souls.

    Quote Originally Posted by Charge me Doctor View Post
    You keep repeating that having a chance to get a piece of loot each day is more efficient that raiding or M+, you know that it won't make it true, right?
    And it's strange how you're not understanding that the effort of doing four WQ is just nothing compared to raiding.
    Or what it does to the motivation to raid itself, because i've said multiple times by now: Looking into dungeon journal and realizing you don't even need that many items from a raid kills off the incentive.
    Or the knowledge that an Emissary waits around the other day that might give you equivalent loot.

    Quote Originally Posted by Charge me Doctor View Post
    Yes, and while you do all these things, you, in fact, slay dragons. You get better gear to slay bigger and badder dragons, and you get rewarded with access to bigger and badder dragons... i hope you get it at this point.
    Unless my goal is to raid mythic on every single character (which it isn't) then that kinda fall flat on its face.
    After all, Heroic is the second highest difficulty.

    And if those dragons drop equivalent gear to what i can get from picking flowers, well, you get the idea.

    Quote Originally Posted by Charge me Doctor View Post
    Anyways, each have his own goals in wow, maybe you was craving for items, but this item-based focus is not going to work in any "live" game, because it'll be constantly updated and stuff will get outdated because of it, gear is not an endgoal, gear are steps on the ladder for bigger challenge.
    The problem is that unless you're into mythic raiding with every character, Emissaries will offer equivalent to the highest difficulty below mythic.
    But that's some you entirely ignore.

    Because that is the crucial difference to catch up previous expansions, in Wotlk Catch up was one tier below the current tier, which kept any difficulty within the current tier relevant, now the catch up rewards loot equivalent to heroic.

    Quote Originally Posted by Charge me Doctor View Post
    You may disagree with me, but you can simply look at the game and see yourself that gear becomes less and less "sticky", since "content cycle" is way faster than it used to be.
    This is the same story over again: Do you consider Crucible of Storms as actual new content that replaces "old content" in the traditional sense?
    Like is BoD now obsolete due Crucible of Storms? Not really considering CoS only drops like 3-4 per spec.

    And the content cycle being faster, i would say BfA is right now "behind schedule" regarding major content releases.
    This expansion now about 8 Months old and had one major Content patch, 8.1.
    8.2. will come in roughly two months, at least that's what a lot of people are suggesting (and makes sense considering Blizzard has in the past sticked to a ~60 day PTR cycle).
    Making it roughly 10 months for two major patches.

    Let us compare this to Wotlk:
    8 Months into the expansion, Wotlk already had its first major Content patch (3.1) and we're about to receive the second one, 3.2.
    So BfA is kinda behind there.

    If we compare this to Legion, it's not that much better.
    Legion had a huge initial package with EM,ToV and Nighthold, Karazhan was also released pretty quickly after release.
    This is despite that ToS hit roughly after 10 Months as well.

    The bottom line is, BfA is not really ahead in terms content cycle.
    The issue here is not necessarily that Blizzard releases content much quicker, but rather that in this case particular, Blizzard updates existing content with new rewards.
    That's not even bad by itself, but if you update content to the point where it's basically competing with loot of the current tier, yeah then this is frankly a new development.
    Like, if Emissaries would offer 370 Loot, they would still be valueable to people, but loot from both M+ and Raids would still be meaningful, even on a lower difficulty such as Normal.

  18. #438
    Titanforging is anchoring the entire rewards structure of this game. This is yet another example of that.

  19. #439
    Quote Originally Posted by Heran View Post
    Hmm? I've done +15, these people who this caters to, can't even do any difficult content. They're the type of players who will wipe you in a m0 even and whines that content is too hard.
    Honestly, it caters to everyone and even more to hardcore raiders as it can titanforge so much that it makes mythic raid drops poor in comparison. Even the best trinkets in the game for most specs are world bosses drops.

  20. #440
    Quote Originally Posted by kamuimac View Post
    they are just angry that casual finally get content to do in game and its no longer catering only to nolifers.
    What content are you now able to do that you couldn't before because some ilvls got bumped?

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