What is up with all these angry young men?

[PC2]

Honestly I blame idiots like Jordan Peterson and a lot of other nut jobs

The guy preys on religious nut jobs, which last time I checked you wouldn't even enter a theoretical teleporter because God might lose your spirit...

[Jastall]

You think would-be Islamic militants in the Western world - also predominantly young men - are that way just because they're finding radicalization in Islam and Islam is the problem? No. They're the Islamic expression of something larger: the internet is allowing angry young men, many with limited life options, to find a resonating chamber which in turn radicalizes them. Sometimes it's Islam and we get the neighborhood idiot who think's their ISIS now. Sometimes it's white supremacy / the alt-right. Sometimes it's a bizarre techno-anarchism (see: some hacker-types). But it's all the same thing at its core.

Folks talking about "the war on boys" and feminism up thread are being ridiculous and just projecting what personally pisses them off. It's a bunch of nonsense. "Angry young men" is nothing new. Historically population booms and large populations of young men "of fighting age" sitting around, bored, without economic or personal opportunity has been incredibly destabilizing. It's toppled governments and started revolutions. It's caused wars. One of the major questions in the history of governance is how a society manages it's "young men of fighting age" in a way that doesn't cause greater issues.

The way to solve it is pretty well charted. Jobs. Work. Encourage them build ties to family (usually by starting their own) and the community. A fully employed young man working from 9 to 5, with responsibilities to their family and community, will not be hanging out on the shitty corners of the internet.

So sure, we can continue to do deep dives in the things that annoy folks. Man some feminists can sure be obnoxious cunts eh? Or we can see the current problem as what it is, which is the modern iteration of something that's been a recurring issue across many centuries, in many societies, countries and traditions, that far predate the things that annoy you.

Wanna stop these angry young men? Give them a good job and keep them in it. That's step one.

That's more or less it. I remember reading historical articles which posited that the Crusades and the great Viking expeditions were at least partially motivated by the need to give bored young men something to do, lest they turn their destructive tendency inwards or towards society. Nowadays they turn to crime, become professional shitposters, and some crazies shoot up mosques, temples and whatnot.

[ohwell]

The take away of the last few years of the internet is basically:

(1) Being able to be extremely racist, particularly using the N-word freely without social reprocussions is really, really important to some people. Some folks just don't like minorities, especially black people.

(2) Some dudes have real problems with women in general, and even more problems with women in positions of authority (either in general or over them). It's impossible to look at this as anything more than people projecting their insecurities. Really. Every guy who goes on about "feminism", I just want to ask "okay now tell me about the woman who friendzoned you" or something. That, and it starts at home. Guys who say shitty things about women probably saw their dad do it or something.

I mean it's been ok for women to be sexist and for black people to torture a special needs white boy in their home for a good while now(not ok but somehow not a hate crime while they broadcast racial slurs...). I guess using the N-word should be fine too. Some folks don't like white people

Some women have problems with men, particularly those in power. Hey let's ignore that Podrick from GoT gets repeatedly groped by fans to the point that he doesn't want to really go out into crowds because it's only women who get abused and harassed by men though.

[smityx]

I blame

[Misuteri]

Why are there more and more angry young men this decade? Is this a symptom of a much deeper social problem? If so what is it? Do young people feel that their futures have been stolen from them?

How can we turn the tide of the ever increasing anger and hatred?

A good war that thins out twenty million usually fixes such things.

The west has engaged in major wars every 70-80 years in its history and we’re past due.

I wish I were joking but history says I’m right.

[Lionwoman]

1 post and already blaming feminism.

[Doctor Amadeus]

The guy preys on religious nut jobs, which last time I checked you wouldn't even enter a theoretical teleporter because God might lose your spirit...

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAAHA NO, the reason I wouldn't step in a theoretical transporter is because of the risk in the technology where the fuck you got that was because I am Christian I don't know.

As for Jordan Peterson, you don't need to be religious to fall for this dopes utter horse shit, just unstable or mentally vulnerable. Which describes the much of Ben Shapiro's audience too.

[The Stormbringer]

You think would-be Islamic militants in the Western world - also predominantly young men - are that way just because they're finding radicalization in Islam and Islam is the problem? No. They're the Islamic expression of something larger: the internet is allowing angry young men, many with limited life options, to find a resonating chamber which in turn radicalizes them. Sometimes it's Islam and we get the neighborhood idiot who think's their ISIS now. Sometimes it's white supremacy / the alt-right. Sometimes it's a bizarre techno-anarchism (see: some hacker-types). But it's all the same thing at its core.

Folks talking about "the war on boys" and feminism up thread are being ridiculous and just projecting what personally pisses them off. It's a bunch of nonsense. "Angry young men" is nothing new. Historically population booms and large populations of young men "of fighting age" sitting around, bored, without economic or personal opportunity has been incredibly destabilizing. It's toppled governments and started revolutions. It's caused wars. One of the major questions in the history of governance is how a society manages it's "young men of fighting age" in a way that doesn't cause greater issues.

The way to solve it is pretty well charted. Jobs. Work. Encourage them build ties to family (usually by starting their own) and the community. A fully employed young man working from 9 to 5, with responsibilities to their family and community, will not be hanging out on the shitty corners of the internet.

So sure, we can continue to do deep dives in the things that annoy folks. Man some feminists can sure be obnoxious cunts eh? Or we can see the current problem as what it is, which is the modern iteration of something that's been a recurring issue across many centuries, in many societies, countries and traditions, that far predate the things that annoy you.

Wanna stop these angry young men? Give them a good job and keep them in it. That's step one.

This makes a frightening amount of sense, really. Not just the part I bolded, but the whole thing in general. I can definitely say that men get angry and desperate when they're without work for long enough, at themselves and at others. I've been there, though fortunately I had my family to help me when times were rough. A lot of people these days don't have anyone, or they have a few friends who can only help a little.

Imagine how many problems would've been solved in history if people just... had jobs. Not having to fear for work, or if they could afford to eat, or whether or not they had somewhere with a roof and walls to sleep that night.

[Wyrt]

You mean incels? Because they think women owe them sex.

[Alydael]

Meanwhile it's perfectly acceptable for certain other people to racist and sexist. "Men are XXXXXX(insert insult)" is perfectly fine. "White people are XXXXXX" is perfectly fine.

Amazing how that works! My favorite is "it is impossible to be racist against white people." NBC wrote a whole op-ed about it. I guess white people are supossed to sit there and take it when you hurl racist comments at them.

Pelosi, the NY TImes, MSNBC are all guilty of consistant racism against white people. I guess, judging by their two recent cartoons- the NYTimes is getting tired of just being racist against white people and wants to become anti-semetic to support Yohan Omar and Rashid Talib.

Racism against anyone (or any group) for any reason is not tolerable, anyone who says different is basically a racist by their own words.

Society should never accept racism- no matter what narrative you are trying to push.

[The Stormbringer]

I mean it's been ok for women to be sexist and for black people to torture a special needs white boy in their home for a good while now(not ok but somehow not a hate crime while they broadcast racial slurs...). I guess using the N-word should be fine too. Some folks don't like white people

Some women have problems with men, particularly those in power. Hey let's ignore that Podrick from GoT gets repeatedly groped by fans to the point that he doesn't want to really go out into crowds because it's only women who get abused and harassed by men though.

Part of it may be that it's really the first time in history that women and minorities have been able to do those things without major and instantaneous backlash. When you're on top, you don't have to accept that sort of treatment, you can just slap it down. Now that equality is more prevalent, white men are experiencing the same sort of thing for the first time, and they don't like it. They especially don't like how it hypocritical it all seems.

[Dakhath]

I think with the rise of social media, people just don't develop any real social skills anymore. Sure, you can chat over snapchat and act like a badass, but in person you act like a fool and don't understand why the world doesn't revolve around you. I hate to go all old man here, but go to most restaurants and you see a table full of people staring at their phones when breaking bread with people can be one of the greatest social situations one can be in.

[The Stormbringer]

Amazing how that works! My favorite is "it is impossible to be racist against white people." NBC wrote a whole op-ed about it. I guess white people are supossed to sit there and take it when you hurl racist comments at them.

See above.

It's not 'impossible to be racist against white people', it's just the first time that you can really do it without facing severe consequences.

[dacoolist]

Yea the internet is a thing but before then it wasn't easy finding a group of messed up people telling you that it's okay being obese (fat acceptance), loser (incel) etc etc. Before the internet you were more likely to go shit I should change that because it's bad now you have people reinforcing each other's awfulness stewing in their misery making it worse.

Agreed there, the internet is ALL about the circle jerk - but the internet has brought us amazing things as well fam.

[arandomuser]

Just like the fascist state that the lefties on these forums want while trying to enslave white males, punish them for things they hadn't done, or outright kill them?

your right, bernie sanders is a fascist, just look at his platform, he wants to make it EASIER to vote, every despot throughout history have loved voting, he also wants to get big money out of politics so more people can run for office instead of millionaires, this man really hates democracy !

[Dziubla]

What do you call women who blame all of their problems on Men?

Oh, I know that one! We call them feminists.

https://www.amazon.com/WAR-AGAINST-B.../dp/0684849577

Good book. I can also recommend The Manipulated Man by Esther Vilar.

As for the thread itself -

Everywhere you look it's all "the future is female", or "toxic masculinity" this, and "toxic masculinity" that. Even older guys will be affected by this, even if they don't consciously feel it. Now imagine the influence it might have on younger males. Actually, you don't have to imagine it, you already see the results of it. Add to that the fact that there's absolutely ZERO support for men, and the fact that the moment any of them try to fight back, they're mocked, riddiculed, blamed...

Also, everywhere women are being promoted based solely on their gender, applauded for whatever they do, even the most vile shit like killing their own children, while boys and men are demonized for nothing else but being born with a penis. Hate speech against men is practiced in broad daylight, while the moment you say anything against women you're automatically eaten alive by all the feminists and leftards, branded misogynist, sexist, incel, and whatever else they can come up with. Hell, you can even see it in this thread. Honestly, if you're not angry, then you're not paying attention.

And the most worrying thing is, that shit ton of people do NOT pay attention. All the hatred towards men has been so widespread for quite a while now, that a lot of people don't even see it, they think of it as the norm.

Also, the funniest thing for me is that most of the so called sexism and misogyny, is just...equality. Exactly what women supposedly wanted. Men stopped treating them like divine beings, and started treating them the exact same way they would treat any man. But that is NOT the kind of equality women wanted. They wanted to keep their own privileges, gain the privileges men had, all without gaining any of the responsbilities that should come with it. Guess it backfired. Oh well. When all your life you're accustomed to privilege, equality feels like oppression.

[Lynarii]

You think would-be Islamic militants in the Western world - also predominantly young men - are that way just because they're finding radicalization in Islam and Islam is the problem? No. They're the Islamic expression of something larger: the internet is allowing angry young men, many with limited life options, to find a resonating chamber which in turn radicalizes them. Sometimes it's Islam and we get the neighborhood idiot who think's their ISIS now. Sometimes it's white supremacy / the alt-right. Sometimes it's a bizarre techno-anarchism (see: some hacker-types). But it's all the same thing at its core.

Folks talking about "the war on boys" and feminism up thread are being ridiculous and just projecting what personally pisses them off. It's a bunch of nonsense. "Angry young men" is nothing new. Historically population booms and large populations of young men "of fighting age" sitting around, bored, without economic or personal opportunity has been incredibly destabilizing. It's toppled governments and started revolutions. It's caused wars. One of the major questions in the history of governance is how a society manages it's "young men of fighting age" in a way that doesn't cause greater issues.

The way to solve it is pretty well charted. Jobs. Work. Encourage them build ties to family (usually by starting their own) and the community. A fully employed young man working from 9 to 5, with responsibilities to their family and community, will not be hanging out on the shitty corners of the internet.

So sure, we can continue to do deep dives in the things that annoy folks. Man some feminists can sure be obnoxious cunts eh? Or we can see the current problem as what it is, which is the modern iteration of something that's been a recurring issue across many centuries, in many societies, countries and traditions, that far predate the things that annoy you.

Wanna stop these angry young men? Give them a good job and keep them in it. That's step one.

It seems to me that a lot of the problem that I see in my area is the demonization of middle-class jobs. Everyone has to be a doctor/lawyer/banker or they're considered a failure. There are ads running all the time here pretty much begging people to go into trades, or for things like dental assistants, or other mid-tier jobs that are desperately needed for society to function and provide a legitimate living wage, but in school people are taught that anything that doesn't require a university degree is a crap job for losers.

So many people bought into the fantasy that a 4 year university (and the student debt that goes with it) was a guaranteed route to success and happiness, we now are left with a lot of people who have degrees that were outdated before they graduated (the job market moves FAST now, what was a great opportunity when you start a 4 year degree may not exist when you finish), who have a lot of debt that they don't have a clear way to pay off, and feel frankly betrayed by society as a whole because of it. We have comp sci majors and engineers flipping burgers, because people were told that those were the super-hot jobs that you needed to get, and now there's a thousands upon thousands of people with the degree and it's not worth anything. In the meantime, we're told that being a welder or a plumber is a menial job for someone who wasn't smart enough to go to university, and then we wonder why there aren't enough decent reliable people going into those professions.

I've never met a stable, successful, confident man who was terrified that 'teh feminists!' were coming after him. But even if I believe that the target of these people's anger is often misdirected, the fact that they ARE angry is very real, very serious, and not unwarranted. People feel that society lied to them because they WERE lied to. It may not have been malicious, nobody may have been intending to mislead or harm them, but that is scant consolation to someone who was misled and harmed.

[Skroe]

That's more or less it. I remember reading historical articles which posited that the Crusades and the great Viking expeditions were at least partially motivated by the need to give bored young men something to do, lest they turn their destructive tendency inwards or towards society. Nowadays they turn to crime, become professional shitposters, and some crazies shoot up mosques, temples and whatnot.

Precisely. In fact historically one of the inflection points in terms of the history of governance came in the past 150-200 years (but really only "locked in" after World War II) when war and conquest was replaced by economic growth as the driving justification for a government or group in power to continue on governing. Leaders were measured for almost all of history by success in the battlefield or things that contributed to that, with the ultimate metric being the success of a war policy that allowed for the continue acquisition of territory (and the riches therein). Young men would have an avenue to fight. As they aged, they had land to farm and call their own. From the Romans through the Crusades through Nazis, this was the outline of how nations ran. And yes, that often times was intertwined, and sometimes secondary to religious or ethnic interests. But it was always there. Economic growth through plundering thy neighbor, and thus giving the young men of the nation something to do.

It is only after World War II we start to see the spread of economic philosophies and growth becoming the driving force behind national policies. Thus GDP/GNP. Thus consumer confidence. Thus unemployment numbers. Sure, many of these existed in the decades before, and some countries were more ahead of the curve, but it was only globally, at the end of the war, where, with the looming threat of nuclear annihilation hanging over everyone, the day to day affairs of countries became the common good through economics.

I think the current "flare up" (let's call it that) in angry young men is directly linked to that. The US is growing fine, but there is more competition than ever before and sustaining a middle class life is harder than at any time since World War II. Europe is economically stagnant, as is much of the rest of the world. We've certainly hit some kind of "growth wall", and countries can no longer count on perpetual economic growth utilizing the tools that have been in existence for 80 years. Worker productivity is that high, and job requirements are requiring ever more training, while populations are flat and declining and cost of living is rising. It's a nasty mix. So we're seeing a return of some of the problems that economic growth was designed to help suppress in the first place.

I'm not a subscriber at all that growth based economics is finished. I think that's a bunch of nonsense by folks who find the idea offensive and advocate and alternative and aren't being driven by the data itself. Because growth is still there, just tepid, and the barriers to greater growth may very well be things that policy can bring down. The baby shouldn't be thrown out with the bathwater in other words. But flat growth is the root of this. More young men get in the work force, in good jobs... careers!... the more this problem will be mitigated.

[Alydael]

See above.

It's not 'impossible to be racist against white people', it's just the first time that you can really do it without facing severe consequences.

You should never be racist against anyone though. I agree with you that there doesn't seem to be any real penalties at the moment for being racist against whites. Racism against white has been going on a real long time though.

It's just hard to take some one that complains about racism seriously when they act racist themselves (or propose racist ideas to make up for past racism). It's hard to believe or trust a hypocrite.

[Foosha]

snip

This. What is modern feminism trying to achieve? Higher pay based solely on having tits and a vag? More roles in movies? Exclusion from the draft? Mandatory hirings? Isn't that the opposite of what feminism is about?