Mega-Thread: Mueller investigation

[Mekh]

People who lied to FBI were still protected by immunity (even though it could be withdrawn); contrast that to plea deal with Manafort that was revoked when he lied later.

That was not my question.

[Shalcker]

That was not my question.

I cannot tell if everyone who got those immunities lied.

It is possible, but i'm not going to try proving it one way or another, because single example is sufficient.

Also, people get immunities first because before that they just plead the Fifth (as Clinton staffers did) and refuse to cooperate.

[Mekh]

I cannot tell if everyone who got those immunities lied.

It is possible, but i'm not going to try proving it one way or another, because single example is sufficient.

Also, people get immunities first because before that they just plead the Fifth (as Clinton staffers did) and refuse to cooperate.

Immunities are part of the FBI's toolbox and they can apply them if it's strategically reasonable, usually if they can't get the information any other way. They did not have to offer immunities for Trump's guys, because they are all so spectacularly bad at this, there was always another way to get the stuff.

[Shalcker]

Immunities are part of the FBI's toolbox and they can apply them if it's strategically reasonable, usually if they can't get the information any other way. They did not have to offer immunities for Trump's guys, because they are all so spectacularly bad at this, there was always another way to get the stuff.

They could always wait and get those guys through over means (like night raids as it happened with Manafort).

[Kiri]

Killary would be behind bars as we speak if it wasn't for ol' rapin' Bill and Loretta having a clandestine discussion about "grandchildren".

But I thought Trump was going to have her thoroughly investigated again by the best people, so he could finally lock her up? Just like Comey and the DNC and everyone else. I am still waiting for these investigations to start, to be honest. Trump was investigated, so they could be next, just like you said before. Only no one seems to really want to start doing so properly.

Why is that again? Ah, yes, because it is much easier to just declare people guilty, have your followers believe that, and not have to put up actual evidence. That's why I kind of respect the Mueller report a lot. At least they went through with it, having an actual investigation and publishing the findings. Trump has his hand-picked AG at his disposal, so I say he should just start it all. Then we can have clarity on those issues.
Though, like with the Mueller report, it might not actually end with some grand apprehension, and people might have to stop accusing people of crimes all the time they were cleared of.

[rda]

And all these immunities were given to people who lied to the FBI?

Much worse, in at least one case they granted immunity to people who destroyed evidence which was specifically inquired for after it was inquired for.

[Cerilis]

How long are you going let this derailment continue to happen? How many pages do we need to skip this time?

[omerome]

How long are you going let this derailment continue to happen? How many pages do we need to skip this time?

I just ignore those posters, but the problem is they are still being quoted by others.

I wish we could just pretend they don't exist.

[rda]

If the "derailment" means "Benghazi", the one who brought it up was Mekh. So, if we are talking side vs side style, please make up your mind - either discuss it or don't bring it up.

[Mekh]

If the "derailment" means "Benghazi", the one who brought it up was Mekh. So, if we are talking side vs side style, please make up your mind - either discuss it or don't bring it up.

It's true. Not like you guys were discussing anything of relevance before.

[Dontrike]

Considering how polarized the country is politically, and specifically how Trump's support or "resistance" transcends both sides of the political spectrum, I don't GIVE A FUCK about the background of those hacks. Prosecutors tend to have no more integrity than the people they sit across from in the court room. Not an impressive feat to put that letter together at all, and to be honest, it's an overplayed stunt by the Dems at this point. Something you and the rest of the bots here will chirp about for another week until the next big thing to fall flat comes down the pipe.

Ah yes, this was all democrats doing, and definitely not them giving their professional opinion. Nope, it has to be the DEEP STATE! and this 18 angry dems, but also don't forget the DEEP STATE!

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We should play this game in the country for now on any time something doesn't go some side's way legally. Let's just round up all the lawyers that agree with me and have them sign a form letter as if it has any relevance and never shut the fuck up about it.

Oh do tell how these folks are wrong, I think we'd all love to hear it. Show us your expert legal opinion.

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Nobody was indicted on conspiracy between Trump and Russia. All charges were on lying about something during the investigation or hiding some finances. This was discussed several pages before, Endus even did a summary.

Someone forgets about working with Mueller for lesser crimes. Good for you.

[Ghostpanther]

I just ignore those posters, but the problem is they are still being quoted by others.

I wish we could just pretend they don't exist.

You can. Just do not respond to any one who uses a quote from anyone on your ignore list. Besides that, do not let them bother you. Not like they can reach across the screen and touch you. Unless you let them.

[Dontrike]

Because this always happens when the investigation is long and extensive enough whether you want to or not. The police / investigators are trained to set traps and catch people on lies about the simplest things, this helps them move the investigation on bigger matters forward. Alas, in this case, no big matters materialized. But there were some technical catches along the way, sure.

That in no way answered the question of "why did they lie?"

[Levelfive]

How long are you going let this derailment continue to happen? How many pages do we need to skip this time?

It's like trying to fight fire with oxygen. At no point are IRA employees ever trying to arrive at an agreed upon set of facts--in fact, they are explicitly aiming for the opposite: to undermine faith in each other, our institutions, and the nature of truth, and exacerbate tensions along the way. And all they need is a platform given to them, freely, over and over and over again. Every time people think they're correcting the record (I understand the pull--but of course, so do they...), they're just giving fresh opportunities for bad faith actors to muddy the waters--it's no wonder they work so well the right wing noise machine, they're just Russian FOX News.

In any case, does anyone have anything more concrete about Mueller leaving the justice department "within the coming days," according to his spokesman? https://theweek.com/speedreads/83983...spokesman-says

[Dontrike]

These obstruction-hawks often forget that Killary and her minions literally destroyed subpoena'd evidence. Probably not a good example for them to bring up in a whataboutism play.

You mean like Trump did as well? Oh shit, it's almost like your hammer and bleach story has no backing while we have a report that says Trump did.

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The personnel at the diplomatic mission in Benghazi that she refused to send timely help to and then lied about... for starters.

"But Benghazi" isn't an argument. If you want to make a thread on that do it elsewhere, stop going off topic.

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How long are you going let this derailment continue to happen? How many pages do we need to skip this time?

Mods seem to think it's okay, so....forever? Unfortunately mods don't do much around here unless you speak ill of their orange baby god.

[rda]

Someone forgets about working with Mueller for lesser crimes. Good for you.

What do you mean? I say that nobody was indicted on conspiracy between Trump and Russia. You are saying that I forget something. What is it?

That in no way answered the question of "why did they lie?"

It does, the answer is: the police / investigators are trained to set traps and catch people on lies about the simplest things, people end up falling into these traps if they are questioned long enough whether they are guilty or innocent.

[Mekh]

It does, the answer is: the police / investigators are trained to set traps and catch people on lies about the simplest things, people end up falling into these traps if they are questioned long enough whether they are guilty or innocent.

That explains why liars got caught, not why they lied.

[rda]

That explains why liars got caught, not why they lied.

You are not understanding what I am saying. Are you guilty of anything? No? But if the police think you might be involved in something and will get to question you for a prolonged time and you will have to talk, you will end up falling into one of the traps they will set up, it's just a question of how long. It's a given. And then it will be a question of what they are going to do with it - they will try to use that to make sure they got everything you know, and if you end up not guilty of whatever they suspected at first, they will most likely forget your lie but they might also charge you if they want. Welcome to the real world where everything is complex.

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Here, watch this for example, that's a good starter:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d-7o9xYp7eE

[Draco-Onis]

You are not understanding what I am saying. Are you guilty of anything? No? But if the police think you might be involved in something and will get to question you for a prolonged time and you will have to talk, you will end up falling into one of the traps they will set up, it's just a question of how long. It's a given. And then it will be a question of what they are going to do with it - they will try to use that to make sure they got everything you know, and if you end up not guilty of whatever they suspected at first, they will most likely forget your lie but they might also charge you if they want. Welcome to the real world where everything is complex.

This isn't Russia you ask for your lawyer and exercise your right to remain silent, the people that got caught lying did so after legal council. If you are lying even to your lawyers they can't help you prep. It's laughable saying these people with the most expensive lawyers are common lemmings.

[Mekh]

You are not understanding what I am saying. Are you guilty of anything? No? But if the police think you might be involved in something and will get to question you for a prolonged time and you will have to talk, you will end up falling into one of the traps they will set up, it's just a question of how long. It's a given. And then it will be a question of what they are going to do with it - they will try to use that to make sure they got everything you know, and if you end up not guilty of whatever they suspected at first, they will most likely forget your lie but they might also charge you if they want. Welcome to the real world where everything is complex.

So now you are saying every lie the FBI caught during that investigation was an irrelevant detail an innocent person under stress would mess up, yes?