Is she justified? Is she in the wrong? Is this cheating?

[Kithelle]

Sounds like a controlling bitch, forbidding him to have any male friends? Really? Fuck she is trying to control that boy's life and he needs to get out now!

[Endus]

Was the kiss "cheating"? Yes. A mild version, to be sure, but still cheating. Respective genders has nothing to do with any of this.

The only time it isn't is if you have pre-determined that your relationship is an "open" relationship. If that works for you, go nuts, but it needs to be overt and acknowledged, or you're just cheating.

That said, her fiancee cheating doesn't justify her being controlling or banning friends of his. She can ask him to cut off connections to the one friend they cheated on her with, but it's up to him to say yay or nay to that. Her one tactic should be to walk, ending the relationship.

Now, if she says "for me to not walk, you'd have to agree to A and B and C and D", that's fine. It doesn't mean those things have to be reasonable. It means that's your only alternative. If you aren't perfectly and happily willing to do those things, let her go, because you already fucked it all up and need to stop wasting her time because you're not willing to do what's necessary to fix it. Own that. It's your fault, and you are the one saying they aren't worth the sacrifice.

Does that seem mean? Well, it is. But all you're doing by agreeing and then bitching about it behind her back is lying to her face so you can be mean to her behind her back. That's not better, and you need to stop thinking it is.

[Rozz]

It's funny that this person can't see why the woman saw him as a threat, when they kissed their SO during a hang out. Yeah. She's totally paranoid.

It'd be stupid to believe this mistress' sympathy fishing when I don't know the full situation. Girl could be crazy, or this guy is a jealous liar and wants to make her look bad and her bf feel guilty. Either way, since her bf did something neither were okay with-- yes. It was cheating. Tbh the smartest thing the women could do would be to leave, because he and his associated friends are obviously more messy than she can handle. Find a guy who isn't in denial about his sexuality or has friends who are in denial about being attracted to him. Would save herself a headache

[Templar 331]

It's not clear whether this happened during the relationship or before.

Yeah, but I get the feeling it doesn't matter either way.

OT: There's only two ways this can end without more crap. All three come together and discuss things like adults (HAHAHAHAHAAHA!!!) or the two friends part ways.

[Aurrora]

Bitch gotta go.

[Goldielocks]

Just to be clear, you shouldn't have to make a comment about sexuality. Bisexual people exist. It's not illegal to be attracted to both. It makes sense to me that this girl doesn't agree with this sentiment, and that she believes the kiss wasn't "real," which is why they never broke up.

Yes this is cheating. Alcohol doesn't change a person. It reveals their true selves. Their inhibitions disappear.

[Thekri]

Wait, you so a post on a facebook page that was written by someone that is not you, about yet another persons relationship, and ask us to judge a the other party in that relationship? First off, why repost drama from someone else's life onto a forum where that person can't see it? If they did see it, would they be happy you posted it? After all, we aren't part of that facebook group, this story wasn't intended for us.

Second of all we are sitting at about 5 levels of separation from this story, so we can safely assume basically all the facts have been distorted at this point.

[Themius]

Seems like cheating to me not "fuck" cheating but... cheating nonetheless.

The part that gets me "nor is he to have any more male friends,"

What? like so she's worried he is going to have sex with guys so he can't have guy friends? What about girls he clearly likes women? That bit seems too much.

[Aurrora]

Seems like cheating to me not "fuck" cheating but... cheating nonetheless.

It’s not even clear if the kiss happened while they were together, the order the story is told in makes it sound like it’s something that happened in the past.

[RayahP]

Honestly, if he put up a fight to abandon this "friend", I'd dump him to the curb. If it happened once, it'll happen again, and having to keep your eye on him at all times is NO way to start a lifelong commitment, even if by today's standards, divorce is perfectly fine. She likely had a feeling about the two of them doing things together and that's why she's been so controlling to begin with.

I had a longtime male friend, we've been best friends for two decades just like these two, tell me that he was in love with me one night after heavy drinking. I told him that night, "You are exactly like my brothers, I could never see myself doing anything romantic with you." And I meant it exactly like I said it. He's an addict, just like most of my family, compared to my now husband who is retired from the army, has his HVAC license and takes great care of our family. He then continued to badger my boyfriend (at the time) about how he wasn't doing enough for me, didn't deserve me, etc. That lead to a physical altercation where my husband put him to the floor and kept him there till he nearly passed out.

After that, I stopped hanging out with him alone and/or anytime it involved anything with mind altering substances. I didn't need my husband to tell me to stop hanging out with him. I knew the boundary that he crossed, I accepted it and forced my best friend to deal with it. He ruined that trust and friendship, not me. I didn't act out anything to make him think I wanted to be romantically involved with him and now that I think about it, I was pregnant with my first child at the time of that incident.

So, no, she's not wrong and you're not wrong. Cheating is being unfaithful in any way, shape or form. Hats off to the man for telling her instead of keeping it a secret.

[Malkiah]

Please read and answer if you think this was was justified in her reaction, was she wrong, and do you consider this to be cheating?

IMO every single person involved in the OP is wrong.
1. the gay friend (i assume it's a gay friend? the boyfriend kissed a male friend of his, right?) is wrong for "supporting" this relationship and for passively letting their friend ruin their life.
2. the boyfriend is wrong for wanting to marry in the first place, wrong for telling her about the kiss (for fuck's sake people if you ever do something that could be construed as 'cheating' don't ever tell your partner about it), and wrong for accepting any sort of dictates about his life.
3. the girlfriend is wrong for over-reacting and thinking that being a controlling asshole is the same thing as a healthy relationship.
4. and the OP is wrong for encouraging her bat-shittery and acting like there's any defense for that sort of reprehensible behavior on her part.

i'll say that a kiss is not "cheating" in the same way that a taco missing a single piece of shredded cheese is not "ruined" - ie, it's not an issue unless some wanktard makes an issue out of it for no good reason.
flirtation is fun, the thrill of interacting with a new person is fun, the jolt of attraction and wondering where it's going to go is a wonderful thing and one of the most joyous experiences that humans can have.
the idea that getting into a relationship means that you're never allowed to experience that joy ever again for the rest of your life is utterly fucking absurd.
if you add into that the fact that most people are fine with the general concept of using alcohol to try and partially or fully obliterate the person they are when they're sober in order to experience things they normally wouldn't, it's pretty ridiculous to hold someone to account for a single instance that happened while drunk.

this is all just a shitshow of toxic monogamy, the diseased underbelly of a society that strictly preaches the notion that there is only one rigidly structured path to acceptable romantic relationships, and that any deviation whatsoever is immediately betrayal of a high moral order.
this whole thing is a fucking farce and everyone involved in every aspect of the OP should be bloody ashamed of themselves.

[Laerrus]

Looks like a mismatched relationship to me. He wants to keep his friends, she is jealous and controlling.


IMO they need to break up and each find someone right for them.


Oh yeah, and his buddy needs to stop being such a whore.

[gaymer77]

Just to be clear, you shouldn't have to make a comment about sexuality. Bisexual people exist. It's not illegal to be attracted to both. It makes sense to me that this girl doesn't agree with this sentiment, and that she believes the kiss wasn't "real," which is why they never broke up.

Yes this is cheating. Alcohol doesn't change a person. It reveals their true selves. Their inhibitions disappear.

I agree that I shouldn't have to make the statement about sexuality but on these forums any topic that enters the discussion of gender or sexuality gets shut down and more often than not the OP gets infracted.

Wait, you so a post on a facebook page that was written by someone that is not you, about yet another persons relationship, and ask us to judge a the other party in that relationship? First off, why repost drama from someone else's life onto a forum where that person can't see it? If they did see it, would they be happy you posted it? After all, we aren't part of that facebook group, this story wasn't intended for us.

Second of all we are sitting at about 5 levels of separation from this story, so we can safely assume basically all the facts have been distorted at this point.

The quoted portion of my first post was copy & pasted from a Facebook group I'm part of. The gay friend posted it to discuss his anger over the girlfriend telling him they couldn't be friends anymore. Judging from his follow-up comments on his post, he was basically looking for people to support his belief that he did nothing wrong and that the girlfriend in question is a bitch.

It’s not even clear if the kiss happened while they were together, the order the story is told in makes it sound like it’s something that happened in the past.

This pretty much sums it up. If it happened before the relationship, then the girlfriend is being insanely jealous for no reason. If it happened afterwards, I could understand her maybe being upset but her response was very much an overreaction that shows they are not in a trusting relationship.

That post doesn't seem to actually mention that the engaged couple were dating at the time of the kiss, sounds like gay panic.
If it was while they were dating then it's probably cheating, but her response isn't reasonable. Break up with him or build trust back up. You can't tell him not to have friends, that's nonsense.

It's not clear whether this happened during the relationship or before.

How would we know if it was cheating without any context as to the time frame? He says he knew the guy for nearly 20 years... Was their encounter fifteen years ago before he even knew the fiance? Was it last week? Makes a pretty significant difference depending on when it happened.

In any case, the fiance sounds like a crazy person... Even more so if the event in question happened long ago.

That's just the thing. The way he talks about the kiss is as if it was something recently not in the past. He talks like it happened AFTER the guy & girl got together not BEFORE. The problem is when he's called out to specifically state when the kiss happened (before he met the girl, before the got engaged, or after they were engaged) he flat out refuses to answer the question saying "its not relevant to the situation". Judging by THAT reply one can only assume it happened after the guy & girl were at least dating if not engaged and that it was relatively recently.

***UPDATE***

He finally commented about the time this happened and sure enough it happened after the guy & girl were engaged but it was "several months ago".

[Witchblade77]

honestly? and i could be reaching here, but I'm wondering if the reason he went for a kiss with his friend in a first place is becasue he is subconsciously trying to sabotage his relationship with her. or possibly consciously, given how controlling he is describing her to be, I wonder if he is trying to force the issue and kinda push her into dumping him becasue he is too afraid to dump HER.

forbidding all contact with entire gender is a gigantic red flag to me, personaly. not only does it show that she doesn't trust him, but she is trying to isolate him. these are early signs of potentially abusive relationship.

description doesn't state WHEN they kissed btw, so good question above - was it while the guy was dating this girl? or before that?

if he kissed his friend during relationship, he did a wrong thing and yet i'm wondering why. but if he kissed his friend before dating this girl? he did NOTHING wrong and he needs to run far FAR away from her. and support from his friends when it comes to getting away from her.

edited to add, so it happened after they were together. in which case.... sounds more and more like self sabotage.

there is this perception that abuse generally happens with guy abusing girl, but reality is - reverse happens far more often than we are willing to admit and accept and becasue support network is not there, male victims of abuse are less likely to seek help.

just.. this whole situation is ringing alarm bells in my head for the guy.

P.S. the whole "fear that bisexual person is going to cheat on you, becasue they are bisexual" is so fucking insulting. both to bisexual person in question AND to their partner to be honest. its like you are reducing relationship to body parts. if your relationship is primarily based on sex? you have bigger problems in it.

[Malkiah]

if your relationship is primarily based on sex? you have bigger problems in it.

i mean, i think most relationships are so i don't see how that's a problem.

but yeah, pro tip for totally straight people: just because i'll suck a dick if it's 8:30 on a tuesday and i'm bored enough doesn't mean i want to suck your stupid ugly smelly dick you sweating pig.
but i think ultimately that's why men freak the fuck out about being in the presence of gay men more than women freak out being around gay women: at the end of the day, "gay panic" is just the delusional horror that men experience at the possibility that another man will treat them the way they usually treat women.

[kamuimac]

Though there are elements of sexuality in this situation, this is NOT meant to be a discussion on sexuality. You could change all parties involved so that it is strictly a heterosexual situation and I feel it would have the same resulting answer.

Saw this post on a Facebook group I'm in. I chimed in (will post my reply at the end of this post) and was blasted for my view on this situation. Please read and answer if you think this was was justified in her reaction, was she wrong, and do you consider this to be cheating?



My reply:

Hate to play devil's advocate but even putting aside your opinion of her, the 2 of you did overstep boundaries by kissing. If it were a girl he kissed instead of you I'm 100% sure she would be telling him he couldn't see her again either. He borderline cheated on her with you. She has every right to not want you near him. Yes HE made the decision to kiss you and should be held responsible for doing so but YOU also made that decision to kiss him too and are equally responsible for the kiss. You couldn't be held accountable for the near/semi cheating but since you knew he was with someone before it happened, you are equally to blame for it. A kiss can be cheating. A text conversation can be cheating. Sending/receiving nude pics can be cheating. Cheating isn't just fucking someone.

yup that cheating and you are jealous person who tried to use this situation to break them up .

she is 100% right in demanding him to stop contacts with you .

[Witchblade77]

i mean, i think most relationships are so i don't see how that's a problem.

but yeah, pro tip for totally straight people: just because i'll suck a dick if it's 8:30 on a tuesday and i'm bored enough doesn't mean i want to suck your stupid ugly smelly dick you sweating pig.
but i think ultimately that's why men freak the fuck out about being in the presence of gay men more than women freak out being around gay women: at the end of the day, "gay panic" is just the delusional horror that men experience at the possibility that another man will treat them the way they usually treat women.

well if most relationship are, maybe that's why so many of them fail? you have got to have something other then sex keeping you together.

and that kinda ties into the whole "just because I'm potentially attracted to both sexes, doesn't mean I'm going to be interested in having sex with anyone other then my partner" deal. potential attraction =/= active interest, and there's honestly no difference between trusting your heterosexual partner not to hop in bed with a friend of opposite sex, and trusting your bisexual partner not to hop in bed with their same sex friend. if they are in a committed relationship with YOU, then sex of their friends shouldn't and doesn't matter. you are the one they chose to be with, and if you cannot trust them - then your relationship has problems that have nothing to do with sexuality and everything to do with trust issues. and in case of OP - control issues.

[Aurrora]

Regardless of the kiss happening during the relationship the amount of control the girlfriend wants over the guy's social life is a huge red flag. If she's expecting him to give up all contact with male friends and he's "straight" I can only assume that women have already been made verboten.

This is textbook behavior of abusers.

[Malkiah]

well if most relationship are, maybe that's why so many of them fail?

i don't want to go off on too much of a derail here, but i think in order to properly address this point we'd need to be on the same page as to what a "relationship" really is and what purpose it serves in our lives, because otherwise we may end up at cross purposes just trying to discuss want "succeed" or 'fail" even mean in context.
IMO in the most basic terms the function of a romantic pairing is to provide joy, in the same way that the basic function of a job is to provide money.
what "joy" means differs from person to person, and how that joy expresses itself in a relationship is just as unique, but i think this is pretty universal to all humans in why they seek out romantic pairings in the first place.
now, there is also a secondary function that has been proscribed by society, and this is where shit gets REALLY complicated: because the functional purpose of a relationship is for the sharing of resources, procreating, and fulfilling socially mandated norms.

a successful relationship is one that blends the two functions (barring severe external circumstances).
a failed relationship is when the two functions are incompatible with each other, most often due to incompatibilities in the needs and desires of the two people involved.
thus, i consider many relationships as "failed" even if they're technically ongoing... for example a friend of mine has been married for about 10 years, they absolutely despise each other, they fight every waking moment of their lives, they've both become intolerable bitter shells of human beings because of the emotional damage they've done to each other, but they have a 6 year old and they're dirt poor so they won't split up.
they're both utterly miserable because of the relationship, so despite the fact that it's "strong" i consider it to be a failure.

so, having said all that, my response to your quote...
1. in my anecdotal experience issues with sex far outpace every other issue when it comes to causing relationship problems.
they're certainly not the only issues that can come up nor are am i suggesting it's generally true that sex is the biggest potential issue, but i've seen plenty of couples weather financial stress, geographic problems, personality differences, etc etc, and go long term overcoming those problems and making it work.
i've never seen a relationship that i knew had a sexual dysfunction that lasted.

2. at its core a "relationship" is just a man agreeing not to fuck other women, and a woman agreeing to fuck him enough that he doesn't have to. so yeah, sex is pretty much the lynch pin of the entire thing.

you have got to have something other then sex keeping you together.

do you though?
i suppose it comes down to what you both want, but i've never once seen any pair of humans be happier with each other than when it's 2 people who get along well enough to not want to kill the other in between fucking, and don't really bother much with it past that.

[Witchblade77]

i don't want to go off on too much of a derail here, but i think in order to properly address this point we'd need to be on the same page as to what a "relationship" really is and what purpose it serves in our lives, because otherwise we may end up at cross purposes just trying to discuss want "succeed" or 'fail" even mean in context.
IMO in the most basic terms the function of a romantic pairing is to provide joy, in the same way that the basic function of a job is to provide money.
what "joy" means differs from person to person, and how that joy expresses itself in a relationship is just as unique, but i think this is pretty universal to all humans in why they seek out romantic pairings in the first place.
now, there is also a secondary function that has been proscribed by society, and this is where shit gets REALLY complicated: because the functional purpose of a relationship is for the sharing of resources, procreating, and fulfilling socially mandated norms.

a successful relationship is one that blends the two functions (barring severe external circumstances).
a failed relationship is when the two functions are incompatible with each other, most often due to incompatibilities in the needs and desires of the two people involved.
thus, i consider many relationships as "failed" even if they're technically ongoing... for example a friend of mine has been married for about 10 years, they absolutely despise each other, they fight every waking moment of their lives, they've both become intolerable bitter shells of human beings because of the emotional damage they've done to each other, but they have a 6 year old and they're dirt poor so they won't split up.
they're both utterly miserable because of the relationship, so despite the fact that it's "strong" i consider it to be a failure.

so, having said all that, my response to your quote...
1. in my anecdotal experience issues with sex far outpace every other issue when it comes to causing relationship problems.
they're certainly not the only issues that can come up nor are am i suggesting it's generally true that sex is the biggest potential issue, but i've seen plenty of couples weather financial stress, geographic problems, personality differences, etc etc, and go long term overcoming those problems and making it work.
i've never seen a relationship that i knew had a sexual dysfunction that lasted.

2. at its core a "relationship" is just a man agreeing not to fuck other women, and a woman agreeing to fuck him enough that he doesn't have to. so yeah, sex is pretty much the lynch pin of the entire thing.


do you though?
i suppose it comes down to what you both want, but i've never once seen any pair of humans be happier with each other than when it's 2 people who get along well enough to not want to kill the other in between fucking, and don't really bother much with it past that.

we definitely have very different views on relationship, I find yours to be far too simplistic and it seems coming with assumption that romantic relationships cannot function when sex is taken off the table for whatever reason. it sounds very transactionary and i reiterate... maybe that's why so many of these "relationships" fail. BECAUSE sex is all it has going for it, so when sex falters - relationship falters. kinda my point.

to take an example of your friend, for instance. I would also call it a failed relationship. and i would wager, that originally sex was fine, but because they didn't have any interpersonal foundational relationship blocks other then sex? when sex soured, so did entire relationship. becasue they had nothing else connecting them on a PERSONAL level.

but furthermore. what happens when you grow old and sex is no longer a priority? what if one or both of you get sick? how about relationships between 2 men? 2 women? difficult pregnancy? recovery AFTER pregnancy? and so on and so forth?

what you describing IMO is more akin to fuck buddies who decided to only fuck each other for a bit. NOT a relationship. if you don't want to be with each other, when sex is not an option, then its not really a relationship. nothing wrong with recreational sex - monogamous or otherwise, if that's what does it for you. its just... not a romantic relationship without other stuff to keep it going, to get you through the bad spots. becasue there will ALWAYS be bad spots, challenges to overcome. whether they are external or internal.

honestly? reading your post made me sad. you see relationship as transaction and/or obligation rather then a choice to spend some or all of your life with another person.