Next expac speculation: Time Heist and Ancient Azeroth

[Kithelle]

Going back in time to an Alternate Universe to kill AU Orc heroes because Garrosh escaped Panda Nuremberg was ridiculous and the "WoD didn't have a bad premise" or "the beginning of WoD was fine" memes need to stop.

Which doesn't have much to do with time travel and more to do with the design? Would it have been much better if say Garrosh went to a secret world that contained a unknown Orc army? No it wouldn't have....

[Zandalariprelate]

The concept of multiverse is far too complex to be accurately depicted in an MMO setting. Especially when the ones in charge are hacks like Afrasiabi of Danuser.

Blizzard can't even handle a romantic story, the bar is very low in the writing department of blizzard, hell maybe that place is the heaven for rejected writers for B movies

[vertigo12]

Not necessarily. There's a lot you can learn from your past. There are also timeways in which things went differently which you can explore. Nothing happening to the world doesn't mean that nothing is happening to the characters. You can also do the classic "time is falling apart" or "the future has been broken so we need to fix it by going back in time" angles if you need a cataclysmic threat to our world for the fight to matter. Obviously there's going to be time paradoxes but if the story's told well enough that doesn't matter. Back to the Future has paradoxes and is still enjoyable because it's a well told story.
I think that an Infinite Dragonflight expansion has quite a lot of potential. Of course it might be done poorly, but that doesn't make it an inherently bad idea.

This is also the perfect time for WoW Vanilla! It fits thematically for Classic release along with an expac focusing on Backtracking of events.

[Wildberry]

Which doesn't have much to do with time travel and more to do with the design? Would it have been much better if say Garrosh went to a secret world that contained a unknown Orc army? No it wouldn't have....

Conversely, would it have been better if Garrosh travelled through time for a cause unrelated to raising another Orc army? Of course not. Time travel is inherently problematic.

If you travel close enough back or forward that you're interacting with recognizable characters, it cheapens them. If you go too far back or forward, the entire thing feels disjointed from the world you're immersed in. If time travel changes things, that's a can of worms that Blizzard isn't nearly qualified enough to open (and rarely works out anyway). If time travel doesn't change things, the entire premise is self-contained, thoroughly unrewarding and the narrative stagnates without properly seeding any compelling story threads.

Time travel is literally a no-win situation. It doesn't pay off, there's nothing good that can ever come of it, save for a few moments where the player/reader might think something is neat. That's not nearly enough to justify the associated costs.

[Mehrunes]

Blizzard can't even handle a romantic story, the bar is very low in the writing department of blizzard, hell maybe that place is the heaven for rejected writers for B movies

Why do you think they even have a bar?

[Zandalariprelate]

Why do you think they even have a bar?

Because they were capable of copying arcs from others franchise and the result wasn't cringe, lord soth/vader/Elric with Arthas and Moses with Thrall

[vertigo12]

Because they were capable of copying arcs from others franchise and the result wasn't cringe, lord soth/vader/Elric with Arthas and Moses with Thrall

I thought Thrall was Jeezas.

[vertigo12]

So...

You are saying that we are recylcing the time travelling expansion
The Pandaria expansion
Aszhara
And Zandalar



ok

Retrofitting.

[vertigo12]

They could just say that the flow of time have been hi-jacked, the arrow of time broken, or the sands of time lower hourglass has been cracked and the only way for the sands of time not to flow out of it is to flip it and reverse time.

It is a very good plot devise for entropy and the void.

[Segus1992]

This, a million times.

If they ever do AP again i'm done forever.

They're going to do it next expansion, for sure. People have been wanting a path of the titans for a very long time prior to Legion, and it's an easy way to get people to want to play to get slightly stronger. Stop farming it so hard and it isn't a problem.

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They could just say that the flow of time have been hi-jacked, the arrow of time broken, or the sands of time lower glass has been cracked and the only way for the sands of time not to flow out of it is to flip it and reverse time.

It is a very good plot devise for entropy and the void.

Time travel is never a "very good plot device". Ever. It's lazy, uncreative, and doesn't progress the actual story.

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I'll disagree, travel forward in time (but not just a few weeks or months but rather years or decades) CAN work as long as you never get to travel back.

In which case it's just a retcon. Yes in that case it can WORK, but it can never be great - it's always a copout and a "we fucked up, let's ignore that and move on".

[vertigo12]

They're going to do it next expansion, for sure. People have been wanting a path of the titans for a very long time prior to Legion, and it's an easy way to get people to want to play to get slightly stronger. Stop farming it so hard and it isn't a problem.

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Time travel is never a "very good plot device". Ever. It's lazy, uncreative, and doesn't progress the actual story.

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In which case it's just a retcon. Yes in that case it can WORK, but it can never be great - it's always a copout and a "we fucked up, let's ignore that and move on".

It it weren't, there is no "Back to the Future movie 1,2,3" and Avenger's Endgame's plot by your standards is pretty much a failure.

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I think it is best used when your characters make certain decisions which seem benevolent in the short term and then end up disastrous in the long term.

The King of Diamond made pawn and his meddling with the Heart of Azeroth.

[The Stormbringer]

Guys, the OP is messing with you, from one very simple fact: The Waist of Time.

Does that not sound like a joke to all of you? :P The WASTE of time.

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The concept of multiverse is far too complex to be accurately depicted in an MMO setting. Especially when the ones in charge are hacks like Afrasiabi of Danuser.

"All dimensions, all realities are open to me!" -old concept for WoW.

[Segus1992]

It it weren't, there is no "Back to the Future movie 1,2,3" and Avenger's Endgame's plot by your standards is pretty much a failure.

Ah yes, so because a few movies have utilized a plot device, it's very good for some reason? Back to the Future used it in a very specific way, and Avengers had basically no choice but to do it that way, because the heroes have to win in the end. Yes, it was still a copout and cheap plot device in Endgame.

[vertigo12]

Guys, the OP is messing with you, from one very simple fact: The Waist of Time.

Does that not sound like a joke to all of you? :P The WASTE of time.

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"All dimensions, all realities are open to me!" -old concept for WoW.

Definitely is considering the number of pre-requisites you have to do jist to obtain it. The Uuna quest leading to Ba'al and the quest proper in itself as one of the requirements has to do with Daval Prestor, Grim Batol and hinting the Dragon Isle.

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Ah yes, so because a few movies have utilized a plot device, it's very good for some reason? Back to the Future used it in a very specific way, and Avengers had basically no choice but to do it that way, because the heroes have to win in the end. Yes, it was still a copout and cheap plot device in Endgame.

Then how about Kamen Rider Zi-O, the demon king of hesei generation and the involvement of time traveling. Does it also cheapens the plot and storyline of Elder God Liu Kang and Kronika for MM11?

One of the many requirements for the Waist of Time:


Anagram 19: Scarce Odds, still. = Castle Disc Lord
This one might reach beyond Chronicle 2, as the last mention of Grim Batol in Chronicle 2 was on page 197 and is just a single paragraph about the Dragonmaw remaining in Grim Batol with Alexstrasza captive. So, we go to Chronicle 3. On page 19, we've got the chapter "The Fragmented Horde" where we learn that the Dragonmaw Clan are still definitely residing in Grim Batol, and they've got the Demon Soul - the disc-shaped object that the dragon aspects poured their energy into, also known as the Dragon Soul. In a chapter after this, called "Legacy of Deathwing" we see that Deathwing sets his sights on Grim Batol once more. He takes the guise of Lord Prestor to distract the Alliance and ensure that the orcs of Grim Batol are not wiped out by them. There was stipulation that Deathwing resided deep under Deepholm after a battle of Grim Batol where the dragons aspects fight Deathwing and ruin his plans - temporarily - for the brood. Nekros Skullcrusher was also the orcish leader of the Dragonmaw at the time who was using the Demon Soul. But, "Lord" would point to Lord Prestor, Disc points to the Demon Soul, and Castle points to Grim Batol. So, we find the Broken Tablet and the clues begin to dip into Chronicle 3. The Battle of Grim Batol is on page 23 in Chronicle 3.

Btw isn't Grim Batol being put in the forefront with the continuation of Magni quest or perhaps Xal'atath?

[Segus1992]

Then how about Kamen Rider Zi-O, the demon king of hesei generation and the involvement of time traveling. Does it also cheapens the plot and storyline of Elder God Liu Kang and Kronika for MM11?

It cheapens the plot in every form of media that uses it. Just because there are good stories that use time travelling doesn't mean time travelling is a good plot device, let alone very good.

[vertigo12]

It cheapens the plot in every form of media that uses it. Just because there are good stories that use time travelling doesn't mean time travelling is a good plot device, let alone very good.

So far with all the multimedia and multi-genre product existing out there, seems like a lot have been successful so far.

[wanax]

Time travel works for raids, dungeons, or even maybe a zone but please not another time travel xpac.

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So far with all the multimedia and multi-genre product existing out there, seems like a lot have been successful so far.

It works in a lot of things but I think with an ongoing MMO like WoW time travel is a rough road. Time travel works better with a definitive end. IMO

[SirBeef]

"Time Heist?"

That wouldn't coincidentally be inspired by Endgame, would it? We did a time travel expansion. It was called Warlords of Draenor and it sucked because it was abandoned halfway through and while the concept was interesting, it was executed poorly even when they were still investing time into it.

A patch featuring Nozdormu and a return to Caverns of Time maybe, but a whole expansion? Leads to no progression of the current time's story.

It wasn't abandoned halfway through. Those decisions were made prior to the game even releaseing.

[Jericho21]

Uldaz, Uldorus, Pandaria (Ancient Kalimdor), Zin Azshari (back to it's glorious form), Black Empire, Empire of Zul, Y'shaarj and the other old gods in their former glory, Elemental Wars, Troll vs. Aqir Wars, Ripping of Y'Shaarj which is shown in a vision of the past.

One Continent of Azeroth,the Unsundered, Heart of Azeroth + Waist of Time (new belt slot AP type power up gear) Troll sub-races option, Highborne option for Elven races, Vrykul/Azotha for Human,Gilnean and Kul'tiran. Earthen.


Notable NPC:
- Empress Azshara
- Chronomancer Elysande
- Emperor Shao Hao
- Zul
- God King Dazar
- Senjin
- Amanthul and Pantheon
- Protodrake Alexstraza, Ysondre, Maligos, Neltharion, Nozdormu
- Keepers of Ulduar, Ra
- Xal'atath and the 4 Primal Gods
- Ragnaros, Neptulon, Al'akir, Therazane

Yeah no. Another Time Travel Electric Bugaboo expansion and WoW will just shut down. Void Lords are next.

Thank you, next.

[Timester]

So, that means Khadgar is going to calculate the one in 14 million possibilities to get it right and we actually lose against N'zoth at the end of BfA?