[TV/Books] Game of Thrones ***SPOILER Discussion***

[TJ]

ROFL, holy shit was that bad. Congratulations D&D, you officially made one of the most popular and well liked series into a complete steaming pile of dog shit.

I think that was actually worse than Dexter. Unbelievable.

[ohiostate124]

I have doubts about this. D&D literally admitted after episode 3 that "Jon would have been the obvious one" to kill the NK, and they wanted to defy that, so they picked Arya. That doesn't sound, to me, like they're following the outline of GRRM.

I bet GRRM's outline was like 3 sentences:

1) Dany does all this crazy shit to get the throne, including heinous shit. She goes mad.
2) Jon is honorbound to kill her.
3) .............?


Like, the dude hasn't even started writing a Dream of Spring, which is the material episodes 4-6 covered. I'm not sure Bran will end up in the throne in KL, considering his story so far in the books.

I agree. Seems like they deviated quite a bit. Especially with the fact that they basically threw out all of the magical elements.

[ophion1990]

I thought the ending was fine, tbh. I think there are some very valid points of criticism, which I have plenty of myself, but I feel like half the complaints about character development can be narrowed down to "this isn't what I wanted, so it's bad".

[P for Pancetta]

And the ending. Arya just fucks off to sail to the west for some reason, despite being a loner, never leading, never expressing any desire to explore and being on a ship once. Sansa becomes the Queen of the North because she asked for it, and no Northmen have any problem accepting the loss of Jon Snow. And Jon himself just goes to the Wall, despite the fact that NOTHING IS IN THERE. Others are defeated and Wildguys are on his side, what's left to fight, polar bears?

When talking to the actress in season 6 Arya said she wanted to sail west of Westeros after she was done doing her thing.

There were also those wildlings that didn't join their side (assuming they're still alive after the night king marched south) but even if they're less then friendly they'd be in no shape to go south for some pillaging any time soon. But the worse part about this in my opinion is that Sansa is the Queen of the north now, castle black is in her kingdom and she could pardon Jon at any time and nobody in the world would have the right or means to do anything about it.

[Zandalarian Paladin]

This last episode was so freaking heartbreaking. But I think it's exactly what you'd expect from GoT.

I just wish we'd have more time to digest it all. All of those moments, characters, plots, twists in the past two seasons were obviously rushed...

Although contrarily to some people, I do think that's exactly how the show should've happened, I still believe the creators needed more screen time to really develop and put the threads together coherently.

[Ivanstone]

I have this buddy. We'll call him George. George, like GoT, was a good time for awhile. Then one night everything went off the rails.

After a night of hard partying it was time to go home. Best way to go home? Drive yourself!

Many garbage cans were knocked over and lawns were being driven over. Eventually police intervention was required.

He was pulled over, frisked and taken away. He resists calling the cop a "fag" for frisking* him and saves himself same rough treatment from the police.

George eventually makes it home but he made a hell of a mess and lost his drivers license for five years.

GoT eventually got the ending it should've but it also made a hell of a mess getting there. GoT's showrunners may also lose their licsense (goofy Confederate show) for 5 years as well.

*IRL George called the cop a fag. GoT's showrunners at least showed a little bit of forethought at the end.

**********************

I didn't find the ending for GoT inappropriate but I don't feel the ending was well-earned either.

Thinking back there were very many characters who did very shitty things in the name of inheritance. GoT was always a book where people perceived as lesser individuals were denied any form of inheritance but managed to carve a path in the world anyways. Even then I'm not sure the show always showed that to its best and certainly not as much in later seasons.

[Puri]

I actually liked the ending. A little too cheesy perhaps, but after all a suitable end I can live with.

The only thing that is bothering me is why anyone from that (completely made up and without any form of legitimation acting) council would want Bran to be King - he knows everything about everyone. In all seriousness, who would vote for that?

And:
Sam: Aye
Arryn: Aye
Davos: Aye
Sansa: Muh independence
Arryn: Wait, I didn't know this was an option

Oh, and to add: I really thought for a moment they would go for Sam's democracy and feared they would actually go for that. But when everyone started laughing I also had to laugh.

[Voidwielder]

All the Great Houses will bail out of this democracy non-sense within a year. Dorne is just as isolated as the North, the Ironborn will fall back to their old ways without a blade to to their throat.

[Dystemper]

No.

He is unaffected by those things because he has no emotions anymore. Like he said himself, he doesn't really want anymore. He is emotionless.

This makes him a piss poor choice for king because it also means he doesn't truly care about his people or his kingdom. Nor is he going to inspire the people or his council.

He is only the "perfect ruler" inasmuch as he is a puppet to the real power in Westeros now. It also makes no sense that the lords would so easily vote for him...they don't know anything about the three eyed raven.

This ending was nonsense. Could it happen in the books? Absolutely. But the way it was done here was stupid. The journey is just as important as the destination, and in the show's case the journey has spoiled the destination.

Perhaps Bran lied. It Seems that Bran might actually be the most ruthless despot in the Show. He killed more people then teh Night King and he set himself up and his family to have the most power in the world . It Now appears that the Night king was really a good guy, at least by the shows standards .

[Nathreim]

[Byuiso]

Perhaps Bran lied. It Seems that Bran might actually be the most ruthless despot in the Show. He killed more people then teh Night King and he set himself up and his family to have the most power in the world . It Now appears that the Night king was really a good guy, at least by the shows standards .

The Night King wanted to kill everyone and control everything. He wanted to erase everything from the past. We need to watch that prequel to delve more into the Night Kings motivations. Why did the Night King stray from his intended purpose and kill The Children of the Forest and decide he wanted war with The Three-Eyed Raven?

I don't think the Night King and the Three-Eyed Raven will make much sense until we understand more about The Great Other and Lord of Light. Did The Great Other corrupt the Night King?

I don't think Bran is evil, I think Bran knows he is the only person who can see this new world take off correctly even if he is detached from emotions.

[Dystemper]

Sure, they're not that smart at all.

But canonincally, we now have to figure and make sense of it all.

1. Bran can see the future
2. Bran says Jon needs to know who his parents are
3. This causes tension between Jon and Dany, which pushes her further to do horrible things
4. Bran becomes king "Why do you think I came?"
5. The only person who could contest his claim is forced to join the Night's Watch
6. Tells Jon, you were where you were supposed to be.
7. Makes remark about finding Drogon...

They might not have intended it to come off like this, but this makes Bran a cunning villain who orchestrated the creation of the Mad Queen and her slaying by Jon, opening the Throne for him to rule.
There is literally no empathy from the character, he's been reduced to a cold calculating character and his actions aren't just random.

- - - Updated - - -



Thank you!

Actually who is to say that Bran didnt worg into or influence Dany to burn KL to the ground?

[Celista]

Sansa never wanted the throne for her own personal power. She wanted the North to be free, and didn't see anyone else willing or able to get it there. There had to be a Monarch in the North for it to happen, which is why she originally backed Jon. Who fucked it all up, hence her rolling up her sleeves and doing it her own damn self.

She's her father's daughter, through and through. Duty before self.

Yeah, that's how I interpreted Sansa's actions in the series. It makes complete sense, after what happened with her father, that she would value independence more than any alliance.

[Dystemper]

I found it odd the first things they were talking about, Rebuilding and brothels but no mention of the hundreds of thousands of dead Kings landing citizens . The city was just depleted by over half, if not more of its people. How many would want to stay there after that? The city would be considered cursed. And how many in Westeros would accept a crippled kid whom to anyone on the outside appears to be a fucking nut?

[hulkgor]

You are not reading his post correctly. The first sentence is a reply to the post he's quoting, which is talking about how the NK/WWs aren't a threat. He's acknowledging your point that they don't exist in the books. His second sentence then suggests that the SHOW built them up to be the most massive threat in the universe.

Completely saw a comma there instead of period, changing it entirely. thanks for the correction, and apologies to the user.

[Celista]

Perhaps Bran lied. It Seems that Bran might actually be the most ruthless despot in the Show. He killed more people then teh Night King and he set himself up and his family to have the most power in the world . It Now appears that the Night king was really a good guy, at least by the shows standards .

Uhh...based on what? The NK was going to obliterate the living. So far all we know about Bran's leadership is that he granted the North independence and that he hasn't gone on a tyrannical conquest spree like Dany did. Dany's actions were in full swing before Bran morphed into the three-eyed raven.

[Graeham II]

Sansa declaring independence but none of the other kingdoms following suit is one of the dumbest moments in the show. I can't even bring myself to re-watch the earlier seasons at this point - the ending has just soured even the good stuff.

[Celista]

I found it odd the first things they were talking about, Rebuilding and brothers but no mention of the hundreds of thousands of dead Kings landing citizens . The city was just depleted by over half, if not more of its people. How many would want to stay there after that? The city would be considered cursed. And how many in Westeros would accept a crippled kid whom to anyone on the outside appears to be a fucking nut?

Hence the "Bran has the best story out of all of us" line from Tyrion. It's a stupid justification for picking a ruler but I suppose they could have done worse.

[eschatological]

I mean, I wonder what happens when Bronn decides Highgarden isn't enough. Who is gonna be more inspiring to get people to fight for him? The robotic crippled kid of a major Lord who literally was handed the throne, or the "common man" who through cunning and skill became the Lord of the Reach?

Even if it isn't Bronn, any Lord with a reasonable army could potentially challenge him.

I don't see how Bran's hold on the throne is in any way solid.

[Drutt]

Although contrarily to some people, I do think that's exactly how the show should've happened, I still believe the creators needed more screen time to really develop and put the threads together coherently.

I agree with this.

My problem isn't with the ending; it actually makes sense. My problem is with much of how they got there. The 7 cut episodes from the last two seasons are simply being felt as a lack of narrative on the setup for key plot points.