Do you think Classic will Overtake Retail?

[Gadzooks]

It's mind boggling to me how both sides seem to have this absolute belief that it will go either way. And it's fully based on their subjective preference of the game. No one actually knows what the majority is until Blizzard releases numbers some months down the line into classic.

The wow community has an odd ability to polarize over anything, and invest personally in the issues. It's similar in other communities, but there's something about the WoW community that amplifies it.

It's of no matter to me if Classic is successful or not, if I'm being really honest, which is why I dropped having a stance at all. I'm more interested in if Ion can keep BfA viable until the end of the expansion, regardless if Classic is there or not (and which could drive players onto Classic servers.)

Look. Everyone. The Classic game got 8 million players for a reason. Those reasons still exist for people who didn't experience it. Let them try it, like we did. They are more than capable of deciding if it's a game they want to invest in. They deserve a chance, like we did.

And can we stop with the "You'll be SOWWY" comments? This isn't personal. It's really not. Classic being successful won't be an actual slap in your face. The same goes for the "Classic in YOUR FACE" types, too. Stop using a video game to be abusive, everyone.

[Iambackagain666]

Classic and Retail are tied together so it wont mean shit.

If 100 percent of the playerbase plays Retail and nobody plays Classic then it wont mean much in the short term but we all know that wont be the case.

This is about keeping players subbed for longer and that wonderful cash stream.

Also very, very, very few people on Classic will be able to stump up 120k gold to pay for the sub so they will have no choice but to cough up the greenbacks or to keep playing retail to pay for it.

This is a win win for Blizzard just like those of us who have championed classic servers has always said.

[MalfLFT]

Not a chance, it appeals to a niche market who very much enjoy it but are nevertheless the minority.

I really think you are wrong. Classic appeals to the entire MMORPG market which hasn't seen a really good game in 10 years. Modern wow appeals to ... hm? People who like the instant gratification game design of modern games like fortnite and shit but don't want to play competitive games? Oh yea and it also appeals to people who enjoy PVE at a high level but that is insanely niche.

- - - Updated - - -

I don't really see how it could go any other way. Modern wow doesn't really appeal to any real market but instead appeals a tiny bit to a ton of different people which in the end just leave most people unsatisfied. Classic is a proper MMORPG which is a market ripe for the taking right now since there hasnt really been a proper good MMORPG in so long. ESO and FF is decent but still have too much modern shit to be considered a proper classic MMORPG.

So many classic naysayers realizing how much better Classic actually is any when it actually comes out a ton of people will get hooked. retail will be bigger on expansion releases and probably still make more money due to cash shop but classic will(imo) have quite a lot more active players.

[Iambackagain666]

I really think you are wrong. Classic appeals to the entire MMORPG market which hasn't seen a really good game in 10 years. Modern wow appeals to ... hm? People who like the instant gratification game design of modern games like fortnite and shit but don't want to play competitive games? Oh yea and it also appeals to people who enjoy PVE at a high level but that is insanely niche.

- - - Updated - - -

I don't really see how it could go any other way. Modern wow doesn't really appeal to any real market but instead appeals a tiny bit to a ton of different people which in the end just leave most people unsatisfied. Classic is a proper MMORPG which is a market ripe for the taking right now since there hasnt really been a proper good MMORPG in so long. ESO and FF is decent but still have too much modern shit to be considered a proper classic MMORPG.

So many classic naysayers realizing how much better Classic actually is any when it actually comes out a ton of people will get hooked. retail will be bigger on expansion releases and probably still make more money due to cash shop but classic will(imo) have quite a lot more active players.

Plus Blizz only needs to keep open a few servers and not hundreds of dying ones like my own.

[potis]

I first learned Gouge as a level 6 Rogue in early 2005. Thanks for ability pruning I don't have it anymore. Same for Poisons, Bleeds, etc. I don't have any of these classic Rogue buttons as a Subtlety Rogue.

And by the way, there is far more to class design than the rotation you use while tunneling a boss inside a raid instance. Vanilla class design is vastly superior in every other facet of the game and you are utterly delusional if you think otherwise.

Wait, lets do opinions, as someone that achieved 99% of Vanilla when it was relevant, including helping 3 people get rank 14 IRL, being in the premade group of the server pushing the first Rank 14s on my own char, and been playing since Closed Beta EU in December 2004, does my opinion outweighs yours? (Yes i played a lot).

Do you know how many buttons you had in PvE in a proper raiding environment?

Lets see, 2 specs actually acceptable, one has the rotation of:

Sinister x 5-->SnD Upkeep-->If SnD not up, Eviscerate, oh dont forget to press Adrenaline Rush, and BF.

Second spec: Backstab seal fate crit variation spam-->Snd Upkeep-->Eviscerate, oh dont forget to press Cold Blood on CD.

But now you are gonna go all about PvP argument where the answer is simple.

Your class is irrelevant because its not a Warrior or a windfury totem bot or a dispel the warrior bot.

Oh wait, you had a chance if you were equally geared and became useless for the next averagely 10mins by spending all your cooldowns because Vanilla WoW PvP was shit like that.

Great dueler though, decline everything, spend <insert gold per server>/Fadeleaf per duel when Preparation was back.

[TEHPALLYTANK]

Highly unlikely, I expect most people who play Classic to lose interest within a year or so.

[Iambackagain666]

Highly unlikely, I expect most people who play Classic to lose interest within a year or so.

So its like BfA then?

[Dekkers]

Yes.
Until Naxx is cleared.
I expect Classic to be extremely popular for 2 years.

[glowpipe]

Wait, lets do opinions, as someone that achieved 99% of Vanilla when it was relevant, including helping 3 people get rank 14 IRL, being in the premade group of the server pushing the first Rank 14s on my own char, and been playing since Closed Beta EU in December 2004, does my opinion outweighs yours? (Yes i played a lot).

Do you know how many buttons you had in PvE in a proper raiding environment?

Lets see, 2 specs actually acceptable, one has the rotation of:

Sinister x 5-->SnD Upkeep-->If SnD not up, Eviscerate, oh dont forget to press Adrenaline Rush, and BF.

Second spec: Backstab seal fate crit variation spam-->Snd Upkeep-->Eviscerate, oh dont forget to press Cold Blood on CD.

But now you are gonna go all about PvP argument where the answer is simple.

Your class is irrelevant because its not a Warrior or a windfury totem bot or a dispel the warrior bot.

Oh wait, you had a chance if you were equally geared and became useless for the next averagely 10mins by spending all your cooldowns because Vanilla WoW PvP was shit like that.

Great dueler though, decline everything, spend <insert gold per server>/Fadeleaf per duel when Preparation was back.

And lets not forget that if you by accident managed to use rupture in your rotation. you would get scolded by your raid leader for taking up important debuff slots

[potis]

And lets not forget that if you by accident managed to use rupture in your rotation. you would get scolded by your raid leader for taking up important debuff slots

I left that out on purpose, glad someone else exists, but yes, insane gameplay value that Vanilla Rogue, at least it had Gouge, right?

[Monster Hunter]

Matheney2k, if all the players who left throughout the years are coming back, just a small percentage of them, they will have a bigger population than retail.
Which means retail is a market that fits the niche population (approx maybe 1.8m).

Classic might have 8 million? or not? well see, but you can't say its a niche market yet.

8mil? id get your head checked for brain tumors if you think an mmo in 2019 will have a steady pop that high, the problem with fando's is they get so blinded by zealotry for there own opinion that something is "great" they cant see that 99% of people either A. don't give a fuck about it or B. don't like the genera at all anymore, its like fucking weebs trying to tell me there cartoon about a dude with a killer notepad is amazing and the best thing. go play and like your little game from 2004, enjoy it but fandom's are like dick's don't go round telling people its bigger than it is and keep it to your self please.

[glowpipe]

8mil? id get your head checked for brain tumors if you think an mmo in 2019 will have a steady pop that high, the problem with fando's is they get so blinded by zealotry for there own opinion that something is "great" they cant see that 99% of people either A. don't give a fuck about it or B. don't like the genera at all anymore, its like fucking weebs trying to tell me there cartoon about a dude with a killer notepad is amazing and the best thing. go play and like your little game from 2004, enjoy it but fandom's are like dick's don't go round telling people its bigger than it is and keep it to your self please.

People think that everyone who played vanilla is going to come back cause its the game they loved, They fail to realize that many people who played vanilla is still playing today and its their feedback who given all these changes that makes wow into what it is today. And a lot of people have simply quit the game alltogether and won't come back. Started families and whatnot.

My guess is that the ones screaming the most about classic servers are the one with "stolen valor" people who never even played it back then, now they talk like its the best thing ever. It wasn't back then and its not now either. (im in the beta btw, its still rather shit)

[Wraethion]

It will, but not permanently. These things are like waves, they will rise and fall. People will try it, get burnt out on it, then spend their time elsewhere and not necessarily on Retail. I expect there will be a large amount that just view it as a curiosity.

[Monster Hunter]

People think that everyone who played vanilla is going to come back cause its the game they loved, They fail to realize that many people who played vanilla is still playing today and its their feedback who given all these changes that makes wow into what it is today. And a lot of people have simply quit the game alltogether and won't come back. Started families and whatnot.

My guess is that the ones screaming the most about classic servers are the one with "stolen valor" people who never even played it back then, now they talk like its the best thing ever. It wasn't back then and its not now either. (im in the beta btw, its still rather shit)

The thing they seem to omit is based on the data most people didn't quit wow, they quit MMOs all together, that's why wildstar fell flat on its ass,


Acording to ghostcrawler who's seen the data the 2 main reasons people quit games like wow and league are #1 lack of time and #2 freinds leaving, very rarlrly do people leave over Design changes and when they do its usualy months to years after the change, after a period of slow disengagement.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/blizzar...uit-games/amp/

This article kind of touches on why the op is likly so delusional when it talks about the process of quiting and becoming anti change, pro lem is for people who are engaged they need new and innovative content, the biggest gripe after all with both bfa and wod is that there wasn't enough new over legion and mop.

[Coffer]

Initially? Absolutely, as everyone and their mother will be rushing to try it.

After a month? Doubt it. Vanilla's time has come and gone. BFA may be a disaster, but at least it's fresh and ongoing. Classic doesn't even have to overtake retail anyway in order to be a success.

[Vakna]

I really think you are wrong. Classic appeals to the entire MMORPG market which hasn't seen a really good game in 10 years. Modern wow appeals to ... hm? People who like the instant gratification game design of modern games like fortnite and shit but don't want to play competitive games? Oh yea and it also appeals to people who enjoy PVE at a high level but that is insanely niche.

- - - Updated - - -

I don't really see how it could go any other way. Modern wow doesn't really appeal to any real market but instead appeals a tiny bit to a ton of different people which in the end just leave most people unsatisfied. Classic is a proper MMORPG which is a market ripe for the taking right now since there hasnt really been a proper good MMORPG in so long. ESO and FF is decent but still have too much modern shit to be considered a proper classic MMORPG.

So many classic naysayers realizing how much better Classic actually is any when it actually comes out a ton of people will get hooked. retail will be bigger on expansion releases and probably still make more money due to cash shop but classic will(imo) have quite a lot more active players.

I don't even really know why I'm arguing against this because it's impossible to convince a classic fan that they are wrong. You are looking at the game through too thick a pair of rose tinted glasses that you can never see it's flaws. Perhaps you don't even think they are flaws and enjoy that style of MMO, and that's fine, but it is not the opinion of the majority.

People don't have time to spend on a game where everything takes forever now, especially the people that enjoyed classic back in the day, we all have jobs and families and responsibilities now, well, most of us. My prediction is that most people (maybe 75%) will quit during the levelling process when they find out/remember how tedious and time consuming it is (again you might find that fun, not everyone does), the rest will quit after they have achieved everything in the game and realise that nothing will ever change. Not to mention that PvE wont even be interesting anymore since we already cleared everything 14 years ago and you are not learning.

I just think you are overestimating the amount of people interested in Classic because those who are not rarely speak up and makes it seem like most people like it because classic fans are very vocal about it. The last Twitter poll I saw that asked if people were looking forward to classic had a 71% no to 29% less ratio, could have been off sure, but seems like a pretty significant margin.

Don't even get me started on the other guy who posted after you who thinks that any MMO, let alone classic, will have 8 million subs in 2019. The genre just isn't that popular anymore.

[Vrinara]

Guys, it wont overtake retail.... Stop making posts like this. Seriously. There are like 3 or 4 posts that have reworded titles running about asking if Classic will kill/overtake/shutdown retail. It wont happen. These posts really need to stop.

[Relapses]

The feedback from pretty much everyone who has played so far is that classic is a lot more engaging than retail.

A sample size of "my friends list" has confirmed this.

[Freaking Frumpy Frak]

It depends.

If retail continues being a watered down "babby's first MMO" that caters to fickle casuals and social players, almost definitely. The only thing retail has going for it at the moment is the Warcraft logo, Classic will have that too.

If Activsion Blizzard decides to play to WoW's strengths by doubling down on the single player story and role play elements like SWTOR, maybe retail might retain a noteworthy fanbase.

[Frogly]

The wow community has an odd ability to polarize over anything, and invest personally in the issues. It's similar in other communities, but there's something about the WoW community that amplifies it.

It's of no matter to me if Classic is successful or not, if I'm being really honest, which is why I dropped having a stance at all. I'm more interested in if Ion can keep BfA viable until the end of the expansion, regardless if Classic is there or not (and which could drive players onto Classic servers.)

Look. Everyone. The Classic game got 8 million players for a reason. Those reasons still exist for people who didn't experience it. Let them try it, like we did. They are more than capable of deciding if it's a game they want to invest in. They deserve a chance, like we did.

And can we stop with the "You'll be SOWWY" comments? This isn't personal. It's really not. Classic being successful won't be an actual slap in your face. The same goes for the "Classic in YOUR FACE" types, too. Stop using a video game to be abusive, everyone.

Yes it's crazy to me honestly. But I personally hope Classic blows up, because I prefer the design choices they made then compared to BfA. And I want it to succeed on a massive scale so someone in the gaming industry starts paying heed to those design principles that made classic so fleshed out and engaging for me. But no one can know what will happen, that's just factual.