Mega-Thread: Gun Control Thread

[Software]

I am aggressive when it comes to defending my Constitutional right to use a firearm for self defense. Not in a threatening way or explosive way as you suggested. You only seem to want to stop this thread from ever being used, instead actually debating about gun control. Now you inject the very weak suggestion all a person has to do is learn karate or something. The old, weak and handicap, are no match for a younger, stronger attacker. Or one who is also using a weapon. Knives, clubs, etc.

A: Your constitution is wrong, the ideology behind is is proven wrong and to defend the people who wrote your constitution it's probably interpreted wrong.
B: I'm not trying to stop this thread, like i said i don't care about your thread. I'm just making an observation, deal with it.
C: All you pro-weapons Americans use the same hyperbole to confins the uneducated wordless people who can't rise above themselves. So let me print it into your thick head: No-one is going to hit you with a club or stab you with a knife if you people can't shoot each other anymore. And you don't need a gun to protect yourself against clubs/knives/etc. You are maintaining a vicious circle of aggression by arming everyone, you are feeding your and others fear. Right-winged people are often more afraid, you don't have to be and arming yourself to the teeth is only making it worse...

Maybe you should start meditating. (and doing a little krav maga on the side, that name might appeal to you)

[Saucexorzski]

A: Your constitution is wrong, the ideology behind is is proven wrong and to defend the people who wrote your constitution it's probably interpreted wrong.
B: I'm not trying to stop this thread, like i said i don't care about your thread. I'm just making an observation, deal with it.
C: All you pro-weapons Americans use the same hyperbole to confins the uneducated wordless people who can't rise above themselves. So let me print it into your thick head: No-one is going to hit you with a club or stab you with a knife if you people can't shoot each other anymore. And you don't need a gun to protect yourself against clubs/knives/etc. You are maintaining a vicious circle of aggression by arming everyone, you are feeding your and others fear. Right-winged people are often more afraid, you don't have to be and arming yourself to the teeth is only making it worse...

Maybe you should start meditating. (and doing a little krav maga on the side, that name might appeal to you)

So you think i should be dead then because i shouldn't have be allowed a gun to defend myself. thanks for letting me know you wish and hope for my death. Really lets me know how much you care for individuals.

[Reaper0329]

A: Your constitution is wrong, the ideology behind is is proven wrong and to defend the people who wrote your constitution it's probably interpreted wrong.
B: I'm not trying to stop this thread, like i said i don't care about your thread. I'm just making an observation, deal with it.
C: All you pro-weapons Americans use the same hyperbole to confins the uneducated wordless people who can't rise above themselves. So let me print it into your thick head: No-one is going to hit you with a club or stab you with a knife if you people can't shoot each other anymore. And you don't need a gun to protect yourself against clubs/knives/etc. You are maintaining a vicious circle of aggression by arming everyone, you are feeding your and others fear. Right-winged people are often more afraid, you don't have to be and arming yourself to the teeth is only making it worse...

Maybe you should start meditating. (and doing a little krav maga on the side, that name might appeal to you)

A) "Wrong" is your opinion. I've also yet to see any "proof" it's wrong, so I mean...I'll wait.

B) You obviously care enough to whine about him posting it.

C) I find it interesting you're going to jump on what you insinuate is Ghostpanther's propensity for violence for the phrase "tough shit," then proceed to come back with generalized bullshit and an ad hominem.

[PhaelixWW]

The mere fact that how many children have got ahold of a gun and killed others in the past is evidence enough to say that I am correct in that regard. Are all gun owners dumb? Ofc not but very many are in fact.

Almost every week we hear of a little kid shooting his siblings or friends cuz the parents can't be responsible with their guns you can't deny this.

The problem that you're having here, just like many others, is that you're attempting to reason by emotion, not logic.

Let's break down some numbers for you, okay? So per the most recent year of data, 195 kids under the age of 25 were killed by accidental discharge of a firearm. Per the most recent census data, there are about 105 million kids under the age of 25 in the country. That means that, all other factors aside, each kid has about a .0000446 (1 in 22435) chance of being victim of an accidental shooting death before they're 25 (195 per year x 24 years / 105 million). They have a much higher chance of being murdered as an adult than they do of being shot and killed as a youth (though both are small chances).

For comparison, a child is more likely to fall to their death, almost twice as likely to burn to death, more than six times as likely to accidentally drown, more than six times as likely to accidentally die by strangulation/suffocation, more than twenty-six times as likely to die from poisoning/overdosing, and more than forty-four times as likely to be killed in a car crash as they are to accidentally be shot and killed before the age of 25.

Let's focus on the gun owners now. During a typical gun owner's lifetime (60 years, 18 to the life expectancy of 78), around 30k people will be accidentally killed with a firearm. There are about 234m adults, and conservative gun ownership estimates are around 1/3 of adults, so about 78m people are gun owners. That means that only about 1 in 2600 gun owners will be involved in an accidental shooting death. That's not enough to paint all, or even most, gun owners as patently negligent or moronic.

Again, for comparison, there are about 20k homicides each year, which means (again, conservatively) 18k murderers, which is over 1m murderers over a typical adult lifetime. Which means that roughly 1 in 260 people will commit homicide.

But the real story is that crime numbers are 25-50% lower than what they were about 25 years ago. We just have an ever-pervasive news cycle and social media now to make sure you hear about all the nitty-gritty stuff that people rarely were faced with back then. You just have to learn to step back and place it all in perspective.

(N.B. - Also, if you're not in a gang, your risk of any kind of violent death goes down quite drastically.)

[ellieg]

The problem that you're having here, just like many others, is that you're attempting to reason by emotion, not logic.

Let's break down some numbers for you, okay? So per the most recent year of data, 195 kids under the age of 25 were killed by accidental discharge of a firearm. Per the most recent census data, there are about 105 million kids under the age of 25 in the country. That means that, all other factors aside, each kid has about a .0000446 (1 in 22435) chance of being victim of an accidental shooting death before they're 25 (195 per year x 24 years / 105 million). They have a much higher chance of being murdered as an adult than they do of being shot and killed as a youth (though both are small chances).

For comparison, a child is more likely to fall to their death, almost twice as likely to burn to death, more than six times as likely to accidentally drown, more than six times as likely to accidentally die by strangulation/suffocation, more than twenty-six times as likely to die from poisoning/overdosing, and more than forty-four times as likely to be killed in a car crash as they are to accidentally be shot and killed before the age of 25.

Let's focus on the gun owners now. During a typical gun owner's lifetime (60 years, 18 to the life expectancy of 78), around 30k people will be accidentally killed with a firearm. There are about 234m adults, and conservative gun ownership estimates are around 1/3 of adults, so about 78m people are gun owners. That means that only about 1 in 2600 gun owners will be involved in an accidental shooting death. That's not enough to paint all, or even most, gun owners as patently negligent or moronic.

Again, for comparison, there are about 20k homicides each year, which means (again, conservatively) 18k murderers, which is over 1m murderers over a typical adult lifetime. Which means that roughly 1 in 260 people will commit homicide.

But the real story is that crime numbers are 25-50% lower than what they were about 25 years ago. We just have an ever-pervasive news cycle and social media now to make sure you hear about all the nitty-gritty stuff that people rarely were faced with back then. You just have to learn to step back and place it all in perspective.

(N.B. - Also, if you're not in a gang, your risk of any kind of violent death goes down quite drastically.)

Dont forget too, that 20,000 of those 30,000 gun deaths are suicide. So as long as you dont kill yourself, you're chance of dying from a gun is 1/3 as likely as the numbers suggest.

[PhaelixWW]

Dont forget too, that 20,000 of those 30,000 gun deaths are suicide. So as long as you dont kill yourself, you're chance of dying from a gun is 1/3 as likely as the numbers suggest.

None of the numbers I used had anything to do with suicides.

[ellieg]

None of the numbers I used had anything to do with suicides.

Oh I was agreeing with everything you said. I was just stating that ppl look up gun deaths per year and it's about 30,000. But when you look into it, only 1/3 of those are murders. So it's not nearly as dangerous as the numbers would have you believe.

[Software]

Oh I was agreeing with everything you said. I was just stating that ppl look up gun deaths per year and it's about 30,000. But when you look into it, only 1/3 of those are murders. So it's not nearly as dangerous as the numbers would have you believe.

"Only" 10000 murders...

[PhaelixWW]

"Only" 10000 murders...

In a country with a population of 330 million and 2.75 million deaths per year, yes.

Death toll from air pollution in India is 1.6 million a year. Numbers have perspective.

[Ghostpanther]

A: Your constitution is wrong, the ideology behind is is proven wrong and to defend the people who wrote your constitution it's probably interpreted wrong.
B: I'm not trying to stop this thread, like i said i don't care about your thread. I'm just making an observation, deal with it.
C: All you pro-weapons Americans use the same hyperbole to confins the uneducated wordless people who can't rise above themselves. So let me print it into your thick head: No-one is going to hit you with a club or stab you with a knife if you people can't shoot each other anymore. And you don't need a gun to protect yourself against clubs/knives/etc. You are maintaining a vicious circle of aggression by arming everyone, you are feeding your and others fear. Right-winged people are often more afraid, you don't have to be and arming yourself to the teeth is only making it worse...

Maybe you should start meditating. (and doing a little krav maga on the side, that name might appeal to you)

Well, at least I know now you are not a US citizen. So that makes it pretty clear where your input is coming from. No, you have not proven anything.
Except the kind of person you have shown on here. The interpretation of it is thankfully not up to foreigners. Our highest court has already ruled on it and it is their opinion which lets me exercise it.

Sure buddy. Your whole comments indicated it was only kept open by my input and it should be left alone to die away. A observation is just that. When you express your opinion, that goes beyond just a observation. Deal with that.

And I do not need any spiritual guidance from someone like you.

[zenkai]

A: Your constitution is wrong, the ideology behind is is proven wrong and to defend the people who wrote your constitution it's probably interpreted wrong.
B: I'm not trying to stop this thread, like i said i don't care about your thread. I'm just making an observation, deal with it.
C: All you pro-weapons Americans use the same hyperbole to confins the uneducated wordless people who can't rise above themselves. So let me print it into your thick head: No-one is going to hit you with a club or stab you with a knife if you people can't shoot each other anymore. And you don't need a gun to protect yourself against clubs/knives/etc. You are maintaining a vicious circle of aggression by arming everyone, you are feeding your and others fear. Right-winged people are often more afraid, you don't have to be and arming yourself to the teeth is only making it worse...

Maybe you should start meditating. (and doing a little krav maga on the side, that name might appeal to you)

A. It's proven wrong? Giving power to the people is wrong? What kind of history do they teach you over where you live? You're not even American and you're "triggered" about our gun laws.
B. You do care, or you would be posting walls of text with your ranting.
C. LOL Fucking go live in a high crime area and when someone breaks into your home make sure you mediate after you call 911, I am sure it will go well for you. There are lots of gun owners who have firearms because they live in rural areas and have to deal with animals, you have others that shoot for sport.

I'm more likely to die from a fucktard texting and driving than I am being shot, but you know blame guns because of your ignorant fear of them.

[Software]

Well, at least I know now you are not a US citizen. So that makes it pretty clear where your input is coming from.

And that makes any difference why?

And I do not need any spiritual guidance from someone like you.

Giving you spiritual advice is like carrying water to a dried river bed.

[Reaper0329]

And that makes any difference why?


Giving you spiritual advice is like carrying water to a dried river bed.

Because generally speaking, the last time we, as a country, gave a damn about the opinions of another country with respect to our governance was 1776.

[BargainBoy]

They should change the amendment from the right to bear arms to the right to practice krav maga apparently.

[Ghostpanther]

Because generally speaking, the last time we, as a country, gave a damn about the opinions of another country with respect to our governance was 1776.

I was going to answer his post, but you did about as well as anyone could.

- - - Updated - - -

They should change the amendment from the right to bear arms to the right to practice krav maga apparently.

Lol! That would be fine I am sure with some. The right to defend ourselves is a fundamental right every human should have. Just so happens in the US, a specific tool the US citizens can use is mentioned which can help with that.

[Shadowferal]

After someone gets killed using krav maga to defend oneself, someone will cry to ban it.

[Roxinius]

And that makes any difference why?




Giving you spiritual advice is like carrying water to a dried river bed.

It makes a difference because your opinion doesnt matter on the subject

[Ghostpanther]

Now here is one for the record books of stupid things people have did with guns. https://www.foxnews.com/us/man-alleg...f-in-testicles

A bungling felon from Washington state made a series of blunders when he shot himself in the testicles and tried to hide the weapon — all while storing drugs in his anus, a report said Wednesday.

Cameron Jeffrey Wilson, 27, was carrying a pistol in his front pocket while in his Cashmere, Wash., apartment on April 5 when the firearm accidentally discharged and pierced his groin and thigh, according to the Wenatchee World News.

Wilson, who is a 13-time convicted felon, told his girlfriend to dispose of the weapon before heading to the hospital, the paper said.

When the ex-con finally went to the hospital, a balloon of marijuana slipped out of his anus while a doctor was operating on the gunshot wound, court records show.

[zenkai]

Now here is one for the record books of stupid things people have did with guns. https://www.foxnews.com/us/man-alleg...f-in-testicles

A bungling felon from Washington state made a series of blunders when he shot himself in the testicles and tried to hide the weapon — all while storing drugs in his anus, a report said Wednesday.

Cameron Jeffrey Wilson, 27, was carrying a pistol in his front pocket while in his Cashmere, Wash., apartment on April 5 when the firearm accidentally discharged and pierced his groin and thigh, according to the Wenatchee World News.

Wilson, who is a 13-time convicted felon, told his girlfriend to dispose of the weapon before heading to the hospital, the paper said.

When the ex-con finally went to the hospital, a balloon of marijuana slipped out of his anus while a doctor was operating on the gunshot wound, court records show.

wait, I thought convicted felons can't own guns? It's almost like criminals ignore gun laws...

[Altrec]

All of the bolded I agree with. No problem is as simple as 'cut out x and y is fixed'. It is all a complex web of factors and contributors, but the thing that is scary is that now in areas that have been traditionally free from such violence and tragedy are now finding themselves in a warzone at times because of this new 'lets go shoot up the city' craze that has been becoming more and more popular in recent years.

I daresay that I am the same as you when I say that while I appreciate the odds being low for a child to actually die in school (or my home to be invaded by thugs), that still does not temper my fear or want to try and and take as many preventive measures as I possibly can. What kind of father would I be if I didn't do that and then something did happen to my child?

And outside of my initial few months of living here I have never really felt scared at all here in Mexico, and those first months were mostly due to my preconceived notions of the country just like I'm sure you and most Americans have of it being crazy dangerous, drug cartels, and all that. The truth is I have never seen anything in all my time here that gave me cause for concern for my immediate safety. I live in a private residence and we have guards at the entrance 24/7 (all residences do and they are pretty common), and you always see police driving around so it is honestly not bad. I live in Mexicali atm and if you didn't know better you would think you were in a US city(ignoring all the spanish ofc lol).
Mexico honestly doesn't deserve the bad rap it gets as most of the violence reported here is akin to inner city violence in major US cities: gang on gang violence with civilian collateral damage mixed in. In Mexico if you are murdered chances are you understand why it is happening and it's not really random, be it you are involved with drugs or crime or what not, but in America it seems that you can just get whacked randomly anywhere.

As for the death rate from firearms I believe the US has more than Mexico in that regard, at least in 2018 iirc, but I'm not 100% sure on that one.

I know we have butted heads a lot in the past Ghost, mostly over this very issue, but at the end of the day we both want the same exact thing: Safety for those we love.

To be fair you have a lot of preconceived notions about the US as well it seems. Also, like you pointed out with Mexico the vast majority of gun violence in the US is gang on gang related.