Is Palace of Azshara going to be dominated by multidotters again?

[Nitros14]

Warlocks, Shadow Priests and Balance Druids (also elemental shamans through sheer numbers overtuning) dominated Battle of Dazar'alor and Crucible of Storms.

I haven't looked much at Palace of Azshara encounter design yet, do you think it'll be more of the same?

[trm90]

The Queen's Court and Za'qul favour multi-dotters and are the 6th / 7th bosses in the raid. Azshara isn't really a multi-dot fight from what I've seen, it's more single target with intermittent burst cleave. So it won't be dominated by them, but if Court/Zaqul end being difficult then they'll probably re-emerge.

[Denizly]

With that haste / crit buff essence, I'd be on the lookout for mages /hunters / warrs tbh. But we never know given how often there are hotfixes to essences on ptr right now.

[Hinastorm]

If history is any indication, we'll gets tons of changes to essences over time.

[Ange]

If history is any indication, we'll gets tons of changes to essences over time.

...to make them better for every DoT spec/Range spec.

LEGION/BFA balancing trend:

1. no major changes before a new tier, waiting for data
2. no major changes after a new tier started, no changes to (broken) established raid-comps
3. no major changes at the end of a new tier, waiting for data from tier X+1

We end up with stacked raids for a full tier, with broken classes/specs and zero shuffle to the specs at TOP.

If you rerolled warlock/shadow because of this, you had no reasons to regret your forced class choice even 3 years later. Thats the current raid balance for you.

[Reyuna]

We all know that lolocks and shadow priests will dominate, they have for years, no other classes allowed

[Dracodraco]

If you rerolled warlock/shadow because of this, you had no reasons to regret your forced class choice even 3 years later. Thats the current raid balance for you.

We all know that lolocks and shadow priests will dominate, they have for years, no other classes allowed

Naming shadow among this considering how shit it was at the start of this expansion (as was ele) that absolutely nobody took them is sort of hilarious to me. People have a very selective memory.

[Nitros14]

Naming shadow among this considering how shit it was at the start of this expansion (as was ele) that absolutely nobody took them is sort of hilarious to me. People have a very selective memory.

When was the last time warlock was bad? Gotta be before Mists of Pandaria, warcraftlogs doesn't go back that far.

[Yunaqt]

We all know that lolocks and shadow priests will dominate, they have for years, no other classes allowed

Shadow Priests and dominating for years L O L

I'm not even mad they're good, even more happy they can actually do M+ now because Legion they weren't doing anything higher than their weekly chest if that.

[wombats23]

We all know that lolocks and shadow priests will dominate, they have for years, no other classes allowed

these type of posts always bring a smile to my face.

imagine maining spriest for all of wow. except during at best 25% of wow's life span (TBC, cata, EN, BoD) you were always known as "shittier affliction lock". so god forbid spriest (and moonkins and ele for that matter), have a tier where they dominate and all of a sudden all the pure dps class mains come out of the woodworks and bitch and moan. welcome to what pretty much every hybrid class has felt for 15 years!

and since i already know someone is gonna bring it up: "but hybrid classes can always heal or tank if they want to raid!" fuck off. this doesn't even justify a response. if that's how you feel, go play classic.

every spec deserves their time to shine, no one gives a shit that your spec in particular is having a shitty time. either cancel your sub or reroll since rerolling has never been more player friendly.

When was the last time warlock was bad? Gotta be before Mists of Pandaria, warcraftlogs doesn't go back that far.

the post you quoted doesn't even mention warlock?



even as a healer, salty mage/rogue/hunter posts are the best part of any wow related forum.

[La]

these type of posts always bring a smile to my face.

imagine maining spriest for all of wow. except during at best 25% of wow's life span (TBC, cata, EN, BoD) you were always known as "shittier affliction lock". so god forbid spriest (and moonkins and ele for that matter), have a tier where they dominate and all of a sudden all the pure dps class mains come out of the woodworks and bitch and moan. welcome to what pretty much every hybrid class has felt for 15 years!

and since i already know someone is gonna bring it up: "but hybrid classes can always heal or tank if they want to raid!" fuck off. this doesn't even justify a response. if that's how you feel, go play classic.

every spec deserves their time to shine, no one gives a shit that your spec in particular is having a shitty time. either cancel your sub or reroll since rerolling has never been more player friendly.



the post you quoted doesn't even mention warlock?



even as a healer, salty mage/rogue/hunter posts are the best part of any wow related forum.

Imagine using a spec being shit for x amount of time as justification for it currently being overpowered in both multi-target and ST, or others being subpar. "No one cares that your spec sucks, my spec sucked for fiddy years. Deal with it!" You're really smart, do you do balance for a living, or are you just that ignorant?

[Biomega]

When was the last time warlock was bad? Gotta be before Mists of Pandaria, warcraftlogs doesn't go back that far.

Yes, I believe Cataclysm didn't have Warlocks being OP. It was Shadow Priests IIRC, possibly Mages, too. Boomkins were absolutely fantastic on Ragnaros, but for reasons other than damage (they were still good damage ofc). Warlocks weren't bad, but I don't think they were as OP as they continue to be since MoP.

Warlock has pretty much been a top dog since MoP (with only a momentary dip or two, like during first tier Legion; but also several tiers of absolute dominance). Boomkin has always been pretty decent but rarely stellar (no pun intended). Shadow Priest and Mage fluctuated between absurdly good and not very good multiple times since MoP.

Of course, that's a very simplified view.

The inherent problem is that strictly single-target fights tend to be too simplistic to make for consistently exciting raid design. But as soon as multiple targets are in play, the multi-DoT classes start to ravage the meters. And it's hard to balance between ST and DoT cleave effectively, without making one or the other absolutely ridiculous on fights that heavily feature that niche.

[SinR]

Imagine people playing what they want to play in the new raid.

Novel concept, isnt it?

[wombats23]

Imagine using a spec being shit for x amount of time as justification for it currently being overpowered in both multi-target and ST, or others being subpar. "No one cares that your spec sucks, my spec sucked for fiddy years. Deal with it!" You're really smart, do you do balance for a living, or are you just that ignorant?

found the mage/hunter/rogue main.

if a perfectly balanced game was actually possible, i'd buy in to this shit. but frankly, it's not. with 24 dps specs in the game, i'm perfectly happy with some specs being underpowered or overpowered.

you know what's redeeming about BFA? rerolling has never been easier. so if being top dog spec was actually a priority for you, you can just have your guild funnel gear and have your neck get boosted through islands by a 110/111 DH or 120 BoD geared tank. the game has legit never been more friendly to those that want to be a meta reroll slave.

but go on, feed me with your tears.

[Motso]

It should annoy me but it just makes me smile that these ' A B and C classes are CLEARLY OP and overrepresented, whilst D and E suffer so' still roll around every single raid tier. This isn't about you personally OP, just these threads as a trend.
They are always totally anecdotal, or based on top 1% metagaming stats or some combination of the two.
Some classes will do better on some fights, some will do worse. It has and will always be that way.
We as a forum community seem to agree that class design has been dumbed down/homogenized/whatever, and we demand more complexity and choice. But if every class isn't dead even on a stats page somewhere, boy howdy things are busted.

[Shaetha]

It should annoy me but it just makes me smile that these ' A B and C classes are CLEARLY OP and overrepresented, whilst D and E suffer so' still roll around every single raid tier. This isn't about you personally OP, just these threads as a trend.
They are always totally anecdotal, or based on top 1% metagaming stats or some combination of the two.
Some classes will do better on some fights, some will do worse. It has and will always be that way.
We as a forum community seem to agree that class design has been dumbed down/homogenized/whatever, and we demand more complexity and choice. But if every class isn't dead even on a stats page somewhere, boy howdy things are busted.

Most people truly have no idea what they want. As undiplomatic as it was, "you think you want it, but you don't," is basically a motto of every consumer product forever.

[Jastall]

Naming shadow among this considering how shit it was at the start of this expansion (as was ele) that absolutely nobody took them is sort of hilarious to me. People have a very selective memory.

Indeed, Shadow has been hugely hit and miss for a long time, but Locks admittedly have been very powerful in raids for... a long, long time. In Mists it was Demo with Unerring Vision that had to be nerfed or Aff dominating in SoO alongside Destro being good, in WoD Demo was OP for BRF and then Aff rose in HFC, in Legion Aff was great for literally the entire expansion after EN, with Demo being amazing in some fights if not played much because piloting the spec felt like shit. And now in BfA Aff has again been very powerful with Destro and Demo standing strong also, to say nothing of G'huun practically mandating the class and both BDA and Crucible hugely favoring ranged classes, especially multidotters.

I can't remember any other class getting such a consistently high performance in raids, personally. Others like Mages, Warriors, Hunters or Rogues might have had higher highs, but nobody has been as consistent as Warlocks.

[Nasuuna]

spriest had 1 fight they were good in in legion cause StM was broken on it.

like 2-3 good fights in WoD

Mists they were trash the entire xpac

Cata they were pretty good on some fights

WOTLK they started good then got hella outscaled

BC they did no dps, but were mana bots which was awesome

Vanilla, you had a holy priest tap rank 1 mindflay every 15seconds for the debuff


Let us have a fucking tier.

[Taeldorian]

I mean if you’re in a top tier guild you’ll see class stacking, otherwise any guild in the world 100+ range will be bringing their best players. Sometimes those best players can swap around and stack a bit but again, a lot of guilds will bring their best players. Even in crucible a lot of top 40+ guilds didn’t stack nearly as hard as the meta said they should. Most just brought 2 or so shadow priests and 3 or so locks. I feel like a lot of people that worry about class stacking won’t actually be affected by it heavily.

Realistically I don’t see it as an issue though, what do people want? Perfect balance? That won’t happen. The class stacking isn’t nearly as bad as it has been in the past, only for a few guilds that go extremely hard is it a problem but they have a ton of good players to pick from usually so it’s not hard for them to do. I just don’t see this as much of an issue really, unless not stacking classes prevents you from killing the boss because you absolutely need 5x or 4y I don’t think it’s a big deal.

[Nitros14]

the post you quoted doesn't even mention warlock?

The post I quoted quoted a post talking about warlocks.