"At the hour of her third death, she will usher in our coming." Lets talk about this

[ilgynoth]

Votes for sylvanas, she will have died 3 times, first defending her homeland against arthas, then again by throwing herself from his citadel and being impaled on saronite, which is the hardened blood of an old god. So if we kill garo...i mean sylvanas then it'll be a 3rd death, also the story is focused on her so theres no mystery, its pretty obvious.

She died 3 times already. You didnt counted the dead where that Forsaken shots her in the Cata quest and shes getting rezzed by the 3 Valkyrs

[Alteiry]

So then why is the Void terrified of Sylvanas? They whisper to Alleria to kill her.

Your first mistake was to assume the Void is speaking the truth. Better to assume everything they say is a lie meant to sow confusion and discord.

[Varodoc]

I agree, nothing is set in stone and it doesnt have to be Alleria. But the thing is, we already pretty much know that Sylvanas will be 99% present in the next xpac. She could still die and rezzed by her Valkyrs, but shes not gonna die die this xpac.
But it also could be that his whisper will never come true and we will just ruin his plans - which is gonna happen anyway. We never lose.

Now lets move away from that whispers and lets look in general to Alleria. Do you really think that at some point shes not gonna end as a Void puppet? There is noway for her being for ever in this "state" that she is right now, Sooner or later that thing in her will take control or break. She is basically a tiking bomb. Alleria: tik tik tik

Alleria is a ticking bomb for the Void, yes. Just like every mortal and even some Gods are (many Wild Gods were corrupted by the Nightmare). Unlike them, at least Alleria knows how to resist the whispers of the Void.

And as far as ticking bombs are concerned, after the whole incident with Yrel, I would concern myself more with the Light and the overzealous Lightforged Draenei led by Turalyon and Blood Knights led by Lady Liadrin.

Of course Alleria can succumb to the Void. That is true for literally any existing being in the Warcraft universe. Even the Naaru, purest embodiement of the Light, succumb to the Void eventually.

You assume that Alleria will succumb to the Void and die, I find it much more likely and more thematically fitting that she will not die, but will have to make a lot of sacrifices as well as truly rely on the help of others to endure. She's not just going to come out one day raving like a lunatic and dying five minutes later.

Finally, and I want to make this clear, if Alleria ushers in the coming of the Void, she does not have to go mad. Let me ask you, did Illidan go mad when he ushered in the coming of Argus along with its spaceships and the Sargeras cloud? I think that something that is somewhat overlooked is that whoever ushers in the coming of the Void might do that precisely to give us a fighting chance, just like Illidan did at the end of 7.2.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

Unless you have a demon inside of you like Demon Hunters, Fel magic doesn't really whisper to you all the time. So Illidan not going all Fel on us isn't a comparable situation.

[Skulltaker]

But as I said already, how would Sylvanas her death have any effect on "open a gate" for the old gods/void lords?

Depends on how she dies? Arthas's death lead to the creation of a new Lich King.

Ok.


Why her. Why now. Why couldnt he do it at any time during all those millenia.

Why not? I know that's not very interesting, storywise, but prophecies don't need to make sense. Just have a condition for his release be that someone willingly and knowingly sacrifices himself at the exact right moment and place. There was a Quest in The Elder Scrolls: Morrowind that required you to drown yourself to proceed.

She died 3 times already. You didnt counted the dead where that Forsaken shots her in the Cata quest and shes getting rezzed by the 3 Valkyrs

Sylvanas the Elf died once. Sylvanas the Banshee died twice. They are not the same creature, necessarily.

[Powerogue]

Leaning on Alleria. I feel like it was going to be Sylvanas, then the fanbase Red Shirt Guy'd the devs with "oh wait, she's already died 3 times if you count the side story where she throws herself off icecrown." Then we see the example in-game in Stormwind where she uses that exact phrasing, clearly on purpose by the devs to seed that.

Can't think of anyone else that fits the bill besides her and Sylvanas. Dying 3 times is fairly rare in this game, even for Setbacks(TM).
https://wow.gamepedia.com/Merely_a_setback

[Skulltaker]

Your first mistake was to assume the Void is speaking the truth. Better to assume everything they say is a lie meant to sow confusion and discord.

Wasn't it established that the Void doesn't lie? Doesn't mean it tells the whole truth, of course, since that can be subject to personal standpoints. Like Darth Vader killing Lukes father.

- - - Updated - - -

Leaning on Alleria. I feel like it was going to be Sylvanas, then the fanbase Red Shirt Guy'd the devs with "oh wait, she's already died 3 times if you count the side story where she throws herself off icecrown." Then we see the example in-game in Stormwind where she uses that exact phrasing, clearly on purpose by the devs to seed that.

Can't think of anyone else that fits the bill besides her and Sylvanas. Dying 3 times is fairly rare in this game, even for Setbacks(TM).
https://wow.gamepedia.com/Merely_a_setback

Technically Sylvanas only died once, since Undead don't die, they get destroyed.

You can also argue that Banshe Sylvanas and Ranger-General Sylvanas are not the same person, one died once, the other twice. The writers can make it happen if they want to.

[Varodoc]

Unless you have a demon inside of you like Demon Hunters, Fel magic doesn't really whisper to you all the time. So Illidan not going all Fel on us isn't a comparable situation.

It is comparable in the sense that this already shady dude ushered in the coming of the Legion's homeworld (along with the Legion's many ships who could be seen heading towards Azeroth in the Argus' skybox).

And yes the Fel can very much corrupt you through insistent whispers, look at what happened to Gul'dan, he was corrupted because the demonic lords of the Legion whispered to his mind and fed him with promises of power.

[Powerogue]

Technically Sylvanas only died once, since Undead don't die, they get destroyed.

You can also argue that Banshe Sylvanas and Ranger-General Sylvanas are not the same person, one died once, the other twice. The writers can make it happen if they want to.

It wouldn't be the biggest stretch they've written.

For reference of anyone jogging their memory, Sylvanas's deaths were:

-Arthas (obviously)
-Godfrey in Silverpine Forest
-hurling herself off Icecrown in Edge of Night short story https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-gb/st...nas-windrunner

[ilgynoth]

Depends on how she dies? Arthas's death lead to the creation of a new Lich King.


Sylvanas the Elf died once. Sylvanas the Banshee died twice. They are not the same creature, necessarily.

Sylvanas is the same person/creature. Thats some big stretching here

Also Arthas never really died. He becomes an Death Knight because he lose his soul. He dont die until we kill him.

- Void Fallen
Oh I absolutely dont believe she will die if she lose her control to that creature in her.
I think if this is gonna happen, then she just becomes a corrupted version of herself (bacially a Villain for the time she is corrupted). And when that happens, it depends where the Story will lead, we may safe her from the corruption or maybe we have to kill her. Depends on the writiers.

[Mehrunes]

Technically Sylvanas only died once, since Undead don't die, they get destroyed.

And you got that where? Undead Sylvanas was brought back through resurrection, the exact same way she was brought back after her "only" death. She was "destroyed" by things that kill people. So on and so forth.

You can also argue that Banshe Sylvanas and Ranger-General Sylvanas are not the same person, one died once, the other twice. The writers can make it happen if they want to.

One could argue that, sure. But to argue that is to engage in a monumental copout.

[Skulltaker]

And you got that where? Undead Sylvanas was brought back through resurrection, the exact same way she was brought back after her "only" death. She was "destroyed" by things that kill people. So on and so forth.




One could argue that, sure. But to argue that is to engage in a monumental copout.

Well, it has been established that Undead aren't exaclty alive, and aren't exactly dead. The Light and some Wild Gods and their servants can bring people back from death 'proper', no? Correct me if I'm wrong. Ressurecting someone is one of the worst things you can do to them, since you condemn their souls to a 'life' of torture. They have no pulse, they can't reproduce, do Undead even need to eat, lorewise? Do they sleep? Out of necessity or out of habit?

Probably warrants a discussion on itself.

I agree it would be a copout. But looking at the rest of the writing of BfA so far it wouldn't surprise me.

[Combatbutler]

And yes the Fel can very much corrupt you through insistent whispers, look at what happened to Gul'dan, he was corrupted because the demonic lords of the Legion whispered to his mind and fed him with promises of power.

Still not really comparable, the demon lords aren't constantly whispering and not with such insistence that the fail quota for mortals is still pretty much 99,9999999% on the universal level. Heck the situation is even worse than demon hunters, because those guys have to wrestle with a single entity the void on the other hand is literally thousands of voices at all times. The void is worse than fel in terms of corruption in every imaginable way possible.

[shadowmatrix]

I think during Alleria's Audio story, there was something mentioned about the light and void having some ability to see aspects of the future. It's possible the void knew some degree of her potential and whatever they saw didn't go well with their plans.

For now that whisper means nothing, but if Sylvanas changes the game then it will.

The Lights sees one future and views it as the only future, the Void sees all futures and considers them all to be true. The problem is nothing says either has to tell the truth to anyone. The comment might be an attack on Sylvanis but it could also be an attack on Alleria, perhaps getting her to attack Sylvanis will break her will power and allow the void to fully take over her mind.

[Zandalariprelate]

Salty guy LMAO that alone deserves some silver badge from reddit. The thrid death could mean undead Sylvanas as some people here has already said and also align with the goal of the writers to make people sick of her, so nobody will complain much when she gets back to life fully for some weird reason and manage her better because they can't write undead characters anymore(just a theory of mine but doesn't sound crazy with current blizzard).

Azeroth and Alleria are likely to survive since they aren't getting much spotlight compared to the faction war and currently the nagas, still some of the prophecies could still play in the next expansion or even more later in the future, after the all the lies of Anduin aren't really followed.

[Palapop]

"At the hour of her third death...." Maybe in 8.3 we will fight to SAVE Sylvanas. Because, if she dies, N'Zoth will break free. That would be a "proper" way to redeem her + somehow she would step down from Warchief position (maybe some critical injury... or something similar to Illidan's fate...).

[PelinalWhitestrake]

One could argue that, sure. But to argue that is to engage in a monumental copout.

Not really a cop out, mainly if you take the Arthas situation in question, where the Death Knight echo was born from his dark side, while His soul was claimed by the sword.

You can pretty much claim that Sylvanas the general was cut from the Banshee queen AFTER she impaled herself with saronite, severing her soul in between both sides, with the Banshee being literally and Echo formed by the magic used by Arthas and Ner'Zhul to bring her to life, hence why she saw only darkness when the Valkyr brought her to life.

[Thage]

It's almost definitely Sylvanas. She's died three times already, and what coincided with her third death during Cataclysm? A notable uptick in Old God/Void activity, which has only increased since. I think little enough of the writing team that they'd think they're being clever, like when Ozymandias told Nite-Owl and Rorshach his plan only after having already put it into motion, beyond the point of no return, by having Il'gynoth mention that prophecy after the fact, and the big 'twist' being that he was just rubbing it in our faces.

Alternately, her death in Silverpine wasn't considered a 'death' since the val'kyr immediately raised her, in which case something will happen in the end of BFA that qualifies as the death prophesied.

Why Sylvanas? Because the Void and Death are diametrically opposed. The Void can't forcefully corrupt the undead because... reasons. And Sylvanas is the only major force on Azeroth actively creating more undead. The Lich King did so only insofar as he needed Four Horsemen to act as field commanders, but is otherwise content to simply spend what resources the Scourge currently has--unless something does something stupid on his turf. The various splinter cults aren't big enough to make a notable impact. Sylvanas, however, has been actively raising undead in large numbers, ever since her return from Icecrown.

With her out of the way, so goes a significant X-factor in their plans to corrupt the world.

[Super Dickmann]

Alternately, her death in Silverpine wasn't considered a 'death' since the val'kyr immediately raised her, in which case something will happen in the end of BFA that qualifies as the death prophesied.

This is the truth of it. Blizzard likely forgot it even happened.

[Thage]

This is the truth of it. Blizzard likely forgot it even happened.

It, like Silverpine, was a 'miscommunication.' /s