"At the hour of her third death, she will usher in our coming." Lets talk about this

[EbaumsTipster]

I do like the theory that the Wrath death never actually happened. I've theorized for a while that her vision of Hell wasn't actually real or the entire truth, but it would be a pretty big revelation if she never actually fell to her death in the first place and the whole experience wasn't a sham.

Her biggest character transition happened solely because of old god bullshit.

[Super Dickmann]

I do like the theory that the Wrath death never actually happened. I've theorized for a while that her vision of Hell wasn't actually real or the entire truth, but it would be a pretty big revelation if she never actually fell to her death in the first place and the whole experience wasn't a sham.

Her biggest character transition happened solely because of old god bullshit.

We know it's not an afterlife limited to her since one of the dark rangers you kill mentions that this is the afterlife and remarks with horror that now she understand what Sylvanas was trying to save them from. That doesn't discount it being artificially induced, but then again, in Chronicle it's said everyone's default go to spot is hell, not just undead. It takes another cosmic power to prevent that.

[George Lucas]

This is the truth of it. Blizzard likely forgot it even happened.

Maybe in Chronicles Volume 43734 we will learn that she feigned death in Silverpine Forest. Just like Nathanos did in the EPL. It's like poetry, it rhymes.

Blizzard's writing staff has proven again and again that they can make anything "work". It's not a retcon if the writers don't know what a continuity is.

[ilgynoth]

It's almost definitely Sylvanas. She's died three times already, and what coincided with her third death during Cataclysm? A notable uptick in Old God/Void activity, which has only increased since. I think little enough of the writing team that they'd think they're being clever, like when Ozymandias told Nite-Owl and Rorshach his plan only after having already put it into motion, beyond the point of no return, by having Il'gynoth mention that prophecy after the fact, and the big 'twist' being that he was just rubbing it in our faces.

Alternately, her death in Silverpine wasn't considered a 'death' since the val'kyr immediately raised her, in which case something will happen in the end of BFA that qualifies as the death prophesied.

Why Sylvanas? Because the Void and Death are diametrically opposed. The Void can't forcefully corrupt the undead because... reasons. And Sylvanas is the only major force on Azeroth actively creating more undead. The Lich King did so only insofar as he needed Four Horsemen to act as field commanders, but is otherwise content to simply spend what resources the Scourge currently has--unless something does something stupid on his turf. The various splinter cults aren't big enough to make a notable impact. Sylvanas, however, has been actively raising undead in large numbers, ever since her return from Icecrown.

With her out of the way, so goes a significant X-factor in their plans to corrupt the world.

This is the truth of it. Blizzard likely forgot it even happened.

Thats not the truth, since it is exactly the same way how she is being raised after her suicide. So if you refuse her dead in Silverpine then yo have to do the same with her suicide. Which would make her death counter: 1 - Man you guys need to use some brain

[qwerty123456]

Technically Sylvanas only died once, since Undead don't die, they get destroyed.

You can also argue that Banshe Sylvanas and Ranger-General Sylvanas are not the same person, one died once, the other twice. The writers can make it happen if they want to.

I don't get why so many people that think that Alleria saying she feels like she died twice means its going to be her but then they think every other person's death needs to be literal.

If people think it could be the metaphorical 2 death's of Alleria why couldn't Sylvanas's be as well? Maybe the writers will just say it was her losing who she was when she became undead, then her losing herself again when she went from a faction leader/hero to fearing true death after killing herself, then what ever is next. The time Godfrey wouldn't even need to count as she didn't change from it.

Hell Blizzard could even do something like having N'Zoth res Azshara or some no name scrub a couple times during a fight and that would end up fufilling the prophecy.

[Netherspark]

Xal'atath.

Or Helya (she is the one who sealed the old gods' prisons, afterall).

[EbaumsTipster]

Xal'atath.

Did she ever actually die?

[Aucald]

Did she ever actually die?

Xal'atath? No, the entity inhabiting the blade finds a Blood Elven host (apparently turning it into a Void Elf somehow) and after a series of adventures enters a portal to some other realm as part of a "deal" made with N'Zoth for delivering the blade and the Champion into his presence.

[EbaumsTipster]

Xal'atath? No, the entity inhabiting the blade finds a Blood Elven host (apparently turning it into a Void Elf somehow) and after a series of adventures enters a portal to some other realm as part of a "deal" made with N'Zoth for delivering the blade and the Champion into his presence.

Yeah, but I'm guessing the person I quoted was counting Xalatath getting shoved into the blade/getting drained by Gorribal as two deaths. I don't think either actually was a death, Gorribal COULD be but her getting put into the dagger wouldn't be a death.

[Cracka_Bob]

My vote is for Helya. She died (metaphorically speaking) when she was transformed into a Val'kyr by Odyn and hated him for it. We defeat her in Legion, so that would make the second death. And now there is an item from one of the Island Expeditions that you turn in in Stormheim and the guy tells you that she wasn't truly defeated and that she is now growing in power.

[Zoreyai]

Void and old gods have no sway over the undead. Sylvanas will be the saviour we need from n'Zoth

[VladimirM]

Dude's, so obvious, we talking about Mankrik's wife.
She died in Vanilla, she died in WoD, She will die again in Classic release...

[Grazrug]

Sylvanas already died 3 times. In one way or another. And don't give me those nitpicking "but that one doesen't count!!" get yourself real arguments.

[Aucald]

Yeah, but I'm guessing the person I quoted was counting Xalatath getting shoved into the blade/getting drained by Gorribal as two deaths. I don't think either actually was a death, Gorribal COULD be but her getting put into the dagger wouldn't be a death.

I am unsure if you could ever count Xal'atath as technically alive to suffer a death - we're not even sure what Xal'atath *is*, much less whether or not it can or cannot die.

[EbaumsTipster]

Dude's, so obvious, we talking about Mankrik's wife.
She died in Vanilla, she died in WoD, She will die again in Classic release...

My god......

[Directionalk9]

My money is on Xal’atath.

[THEORACLE64]

Candidate number 3: Azshara (most unlikely, since her death wouldnt have much of an effect except the release of Nzoth?)

So, basically the entire conclusion of 8.2. Releasing N'zoth is a giant consequence, so the fact we defeat Azshara and N'zoth's prison is broken kinda does usher "them" in doesn't it.

- - - Updated - - -

Void and old gods have no sway over the undead. Sylvanas will be the saviour we need from n'Zoth

This is the kind of scape goat BS story I've said they'll go with Sylvanas - commits genocide, kills thousands, but at the end "saves" us all so it makes it all better.

[Jastall]

The twist might actually that N'zoth isn't the boss of this expansion. Story wise it looks like him, but there are certain things that make me think he isn't, including the Warbringers = bosses theme, Crucible of Storm being too much like an N'zoth fight for them to do it twice, the Jaina fight looking like there will be a Horde version in the future (Sylvanas getting away), datamined post-Azshara text that implies that N'zoth doesn't actually come out after 8.2, as well as the whole MOP thing translating to a warchief boss at the end.

I think it is incredibly plausible that N'zoth is the villain carryover to 9.0 and may not even show up at 8.3 at all, or may just be a cameo.

I doubt that. We just had bits of an Old God expansion (G'huun, Crucible of Storms, second half of Eternal Palace) and Blizzard is now aware of X fatigue- Orc fatigue, fel green fatigue, faction war fatigue, etc. They need to switch themes up fairly frequently to avoid the ''these guys again?'' feeling.

Na, I'm certain that N'zoth is the endboss of BFA, and 50-50 on whenever Sylvanas dies now. It's possible that she bites it soon, but I think she will be ousted in 8.2.5 or early 8.3 but not die, so she can be a tie-in to the seemingly inevitable Shadowlands expansion, and she has enough notoriety to be an expansion's major villain. I really doubt she'll be a raidboss in N'zoth's raid in either case, even as someone who hates Sylvanas having her play second fiddle to anyone in a final raid would be a huge disservice to how big a character she is.

[EbaumsTipster]

I doubt that. We just had bits of an Old God expansion (G'huun, Crucible of Storms, second half of Eternal Palace) and Blizzard is now aware of X fatigue- Orc fatigue, fel green fatigue, faction war fatigue, etc. They need to switch themes up fairly frequently to avoid the ''these guys again?'' feeling.

You say you understand X fatigue, and then list reasons why N'zoth being the last boss and raid would be extreme Old God fatigue?

EDIT: Nevermind, sorry, I get it. Yeah getting rid of N'zoth for 8.3 and looping into Sylvanas for 9.0 would be smart.

[tocoman]

There is no proof of that. Regardless, in the context of the full expansion it was a red herring and a twist, and also hints that Illidan is not in fact the child of Light and Shadow as long as a kid that is literally the child of a light guy and shadow woman is walking around (Arator).

The precedent has been set that year-long buildup twists now exist in WoW's story.

I'm still sticking with my theory that Arthas is the child of light and shadow, and thats one of the main reasons we'll be going to the shadowlands next expansion, that and because we'll be dead too canonically.