Phase 1 - Dungeons and raids progression?

[Oakshana]

I had heard that UBRS was originally 15 man and was lowered to 10 man in one of the vanilla patches, is this myth?

Yes. This is true. I remember waiting FOREVER for a UBRS group to form. Many hours spent running the circumference of Iron Forge.

But what is even crazier? For a good long period, while it was considered a 15 man instance, it had a cap of 40 people. All of the 10+ instances did. So odd.

[Khaza-R]

I dont get how bad people where... i always did it with 5. You guys seem to be forgetting we wont have vanilla starter gear this time around either. We will have buffed gear (wich does A LOT) now so 5 wont be a problem unless you are absolutley terrible at the game. I dont even remember doing it with 10 people, ever. (even before buffed gear)

Same with Stratholme, never did it with more than 5 people. Did 45min runs quite often and still no more than 5 people.

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This is just not true as UBRS and LBRS is the same exact dungeon. You just take a right or a left turn at the beginning.

You’re either lying or have a terrible memory.

UBRS was almost always ran by 15 people pre-nerf. Reduced to a 10 man cap post nerf in 1.10. All other dungeons with the exception of Dire Maul and low level dungeons had a 10 man cap from 1.3 to 1.10. But you couldn’t complete quests with a 10 man. The exception were the UBRS quests since they were flagged as raid quests. There’s no way you were clearing UBRS with 5 non raid-geared characters. I know this because my US realm had the first 3-man UBRS clear and that was only done with characters in full T2 and a tank with Thunderfury

https://youtube.com/watch?v=k-b_J97w17s

[Zoldor]

I always remember UBRS with 10 during vanilla. We might have done it with 9 once and it took forever. You weren't doing Drak with 5 people back then.

[Annelie]

You’re either lying or have a terrible memory.

UBRS was almost always ran by 15 people pre-nerf. Reduced to a 10 man cap post nerf in 1.10. All other dungeons with the exception of Dire Maul and low level dungeons had a 10 man cap from 1.3 to 1.10. But you couldn’t complete quests with a 10 man. The exception were the UBRS quests since they were flagged as raid quests. There’s no way you were clearing UBRS with 5 non raid-geared characters. I know this because my US realm had the first 3-man UBRS clear and that was only done with characters in full T2 and a tank with Thunderfury

https://youtube.com/watch?v=k-b_J97w17s

No you are confusing it with what the devs have said and how it was. They have said it will be 5 man dungeons. Dont matter if it was 10 or 15 back then. And i always did it with 5 people. It was not hard, but then again i always made my own group and i mean always wich means i always brought classes with CC (me playing mage helped). I usualy ran with Mage, Rogue and Hunter. Why? Because they had the absolute best CC for dungeons. This time around blue gear will be on par with MC gear. And everyone and their mothers had raid gear back then as basicly everyone was in a raiding guild. So it was ineviteble that atleast 1-2 people in the group had some raid gear even if you did it at lvl 60 ding.

Everyone seem to belive we will have the bad starter vanilla gear this time around. And tbh i cant even grasp how people can not do it with 5 people back then. I just cant. Unless ofc all you had was 4 warriors and a druid or something like that.

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I always remember UBRS with 10 during vanilla. We might have done it with 9 once and it took forever. You weren't doing Drak with 5 people back then.

Yes you where. You had a hunter kite him away and the rest of the group killed his friends. That way you could fight him alone.

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@<a href="https://www.mmo-champion.com/member.php?u=580552" target="_blank">Annelie</a>

What do you mean buffed gear?

Buffed gear as in optimised catchup gear. Everything have more stats than it did in the start of vanilla and the stats ahve better optimisation. That is the reason you see people on the beta running around with 2-3k+ hp at lvl 40 right now. That amount was raid gear level mage HP back in vanilla, at lvl 60. They also do more damage at lvl 40 now than you did on lvl 60 then. etc.

[TigTone]

Buffed gear as in optimised catchup gear. Everything have more stats than it did in the start of vanilla and the stats ahve better optimisation. That is the reason you see people on the beta running around with 2-3k+ hp at lvl 40 right now. That amount was raid gear level mage HP back in vanilla, at lvl 60. They also do more damage at lvl 40 now than you did on lvl 60 then. etc.

Wasn’t aware of that change but that would change things up a lot. Hopefully in a good way.

[Vampyr78]

I'd classify it by looking at the lockout duration - weekly = raid, 5/hour is dungeon

Here's a better classification. If the entry portal is blueish then it's a dungeon and if it's greenish it's a raid.

[Roxyfoxy]

I dont get how bad people where... i always did it with 5. You guys seem to be forgetting we wont have vanilla starter gear this time around either. We will have buffed gear (wich does A LOT) now so 5 wont be a problem unless you are absolutley terrible at the game. I dont even remember doing it with 10 people, ever. (even before buffed gear)

Same with Stratholme, never did it with more than 5 people. Did 45min runs quite often and still no more than 5 people.

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This is just not true as UBRS and LBRS is the same exact dungeon. You just take a right or a left turn at the beginning.

It's quite obvious you didnt play vanilla, or reached 60 very late in vanilla.

I never said LBRS and UBRS were two different dungeons, but LBRS were designed for fewer people than UBRS, you could run LBRS with 15 players if you wanted, however there wasnt much point to it so people did it with less people.

I dont believe at all that you never did UBRS with more than 5 people, cause that was a quite a big feat, that requires a lot of gear, cause you would need to nuke down Drakkisath before he conflagerated, unless you brought a extra tank capable class with you, and a hunter to kite, which would leave you with a total of 1 dps actually killing the adds, that would be terribly slow, inefficient, and very difficult if not impossible before they changed UBRS to 10man

So grats, you are calling out people for being terrible, when you have no idea at all what you are talking about, and are clearly lying.


Patch 1.10 was the dungeon revamp patch, which reduced max group size of Blackrock Spire to 10man from 15man, Stratholme and Scholomance to 5man from 10man, in addition to introducing the dungeon 0.5 set, and added the strat baron 45min run. So the baron speed run didnt exist when strat was still a 10man dungeon.
In addition to that, they buffed up a lot of gear, and added a ton of new gear whith insane stats, most of them a lot better than Molten Core gear.

Anything else you want to lie about? you soloed Kel'thuzad with a holy priest as well maybe?

[Xemioza]

I dont get how bad people where... i always did it with 5. You guys seem to be forgetting we wont have vanilla starter gear this time around either. We will have buffed gear (wich does A LOT) now so 5 wont be a problem unless you are absolutley terrible at the game. I dont even remember doing it with 10 people, ever.

Ok, Mr pr0, but people who actually remember vanilla, also remember it was 15 reduced to 10. Might be done with 5 in BWL+ gear.

Edit : Guy above me explained it better

[Annelie]

It's quite obvious you didnt play vanilla, or reached 60 very late in vanilla.

I never said LBRS and UBRS were two different dungeons, but LBRS were designed for fewer people than UBRS, you could run LBRS with 15 players if you wanted, however there wasnt much point to it so people did it with less people.

I dont believe at all that you never did UBRS with more than 5 people, cause that was a quite a big feat, that requires a lot of gear, cause you would need to nuke down Drakkisath before he conflagerated, unless you brought a extra tank capable class with you, and a hunter to kite, which would leave you with a total of 1 dps actually killing the adds, that would be terribly slow, inefficient, and very difficult if not impossible before they changed UBRS to 10man

So grats, you are calling out people for being terrible, when you have no idea at all what you are talking about, and are clearly lying.


Patch 1.10 was the dungeon revamp patch, which reduced max group size of Blackrock Spire to 10man from 15man, Stratholme and Scholomance to 5man from 10man, in addition to introducing the dungeon 0.5 set, and added the strat baron 45min run. So the baron speed run didnt exist when strat was still a 10man dungeon.
In addition to that, they buffed up a lot of gear, and added a ton of new gear whith insane stats, most of them a lot better than Molten Core gear.

Anything else you want to lie about? you soloed Kel'thuzad with a holy priest as well maybe?

I did play vanilla, i did start a few months after launch but not "late" however i never hit 60 before Vek'Nilash server was released and when it was me and my friends moved there and played on it for the rest of Vanilla (Alliance side). You said LBRS and UBRS had different raid caps. 10 and 15 respectivly. If you had 15 in LBRS or UBRS you could have 15 in the other.
Dont belive it then, i never did it with more than 5 that i can remember, because we did not need to. 1 tank 1 healer and 3 dps. Every time. I dont know how you did it but you can not have been doing it very well if you died to that. But hey i am sure i died to it a few times, i cant remember tbh. Was so long ago to remember if i died to it or not.

Nah, i was just not terrible at the game. Compared to you and your server aparantly.
And that gear is what we will be getting this time around so it wont be hard at all.

Nah, only thing i want to add is a L2P to you. I bet you will have trouble on Baron in MC "omg laaag cant move sorry i blew everyone up, my 14.4 modem just got a hickup"

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Ok, Mr pr0, but people who actually remember vanilla, also remember it was 15 reduced to 10. Might be done with 5 in BWL+ gear.

Edit : Guy above me explained it better

Yea the guy above you explained it better, but changes nothing as i never did it with more than 5, ever. Never needed to. And still we will get the buffed gear in classic so it will be possible even for you two. Maybe.

[Zoldor]

Yes you where. You had a hunter kite him away and the rest of the group killed his friends. That way you could fight him alone.

Derp. Forgot about that. Became the norm later on. Brain, not brain so good anymore. Granted you had to find a non-trash hunter, but still yes. In Vanilla many a trash level hunter.

[Xemioza]

Nah, i was just not terrible at the game. Compared to you and your server aparantly.

Ok, sorry.

[Roxyfoxy]

I did play vanilla, i did start a few months after launch but not "late" however i never hit 60 before Vek'Nilash server was released and when it was me and my friends moved there and played on it for the rest of Vanilla (Alliance side). You said LBRS and UBRS had different raid caps. 10 and 15 respectivly. If you had 15 in LBRS or UBRS you could have 15 in the other.
Dont belive it then, i never did it with more than 5 that i can remember, because we did not need to. 1 tank 1 healer and 3 dps. Every time. I dont know how you did it but you can not have been doing it very well if you died to that. But hey i am sure i died to it a few times, i cant remember tbh. Was so long ago to remember if i died to it or not.

Nah, i was just not terrible at the game. Compared to you and your server aparantly.
And that gear is what we will be getting this time around so it wont be hard at all.

Nah, only thing i want to add is a L2P to you. I bet you will have trouble on Baron in MC "omg laaag cant move sorry i blew everyone up, my 14.4 modem just got a hickup"

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Yea the guy above you explained it better, but changes nothing as i never did it with more than 5, ever. Never needed to. And still we will get the buffed gear in classic so it will be possible even for you two. Maybe.

No i never said anything about lbrs being capped to 10, i said people usually did it with fewer people than UBRS.

And you can lie all you want, you will soon get the chance to prove it, good luck with that.

[Annelie]

No i never said anything about lbrs being capped to 10, i said people usually did it with fewer people than UBRS.

And you can lie all you want, you will soon get the chance to prove it, good luck with that.

You are right, i read what you said like a complete derp.

Yes i will, and i wont have a problem with it, you will be surprised how much the gear changes will do to the game. People at 40 have more hp and do more dmg than ppl on 60 did back then.

[Life-Binder]

UBRS with 5 people being trivial back then is total bullshit

for 80-90% of Classics time it was a 10-man run for the majority of ppl and early on it was a 15 ppl run



thats for actual classic 2005-2006

of course this new 2019 classic wont be the exact same

[AeneasBK]

I could see a guild run of pre-raid BiS geared players managing UBRS with 7 people, but only 5 players?

That will be something to see.

[Aphrel]

I dont get how bad people where... i always did it with 5. You guys seem to be forgetting we wont have vanilla starter gear this time around either. We will have buffed gear (wich does A LOT) now so 5 wont be a problem unless you are absolutley terrible at the game. I dont even remember doing it with 10 people, ever. (even before buffed gear)

Same with Stratholme, never did it with more than 5 people. Did 45min runs quite often and still no more than 5 people.

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This is just not true as UBRS and LBRS is the same exact dungeon. You just take a right or a left turn at the beginning.

It is interesting to see just how diffrent the experiences of vanilla were for ppl who started at launch vs ppl that started later in vanilla.

My first tour into ubrs was with 40 ppl, and we still managed to wipe. None of the dungeons had any cap on players at that time.

[Grimreaper]

Same with Stratholme, never did it with more than 5 people. Did 45min runs quite often and still no more than 5 people.

Well thats obviously because they added the 45 min baron run in the same patch they reduced the 10man limit to 5man.

[Roxyfoxy]

You are right, i read what you said like a complete derp.

Yes i will, and i wont have a problem with it, you will be surprised how much the gear changes will do to the game. People at 40 have more hp and do more dmg than ppl on 60 did back then.

Except the gear changes will not do do much in that regards, ubrs became a 10man in 1.10, which is the time all the gear upgrades happened as well. So for for you (judging by the posts you made in this thread) who never experienced the pre 1.10 60 dungeons, it will actually be harder, cause the items which were added with 1.10 will not be available at the start of classic. They will be added with stage 5, only the items that already existed pre 1.10 will be there and have their post 1.10 stats

[lollerlaban]

Yes. This is true. I remember waiting FOREVER for a UBRS group to form. Many hours spent running the circumference of Iron Forge.

But what is even crazier? For a good long period, while it was considered a 15 man instance, it had a cap of 40 people. All of the 10+ instances did. So odd.

In the even earlier days you could 40 man even normal dungeons like Deadmines

[Roiids]

1.12 UBRS is a 10 man.. LBRS is 5... you guys are also forgetting when wow originally came out Strat was also a 10 man.