RNGforging doesn't work the way Blizzard intended

[Wilfire]

I can't find the exact quote but around the time Throne of Thunder was current content, Blizzard stated that the intended purpose of the RNGforging system (thunderforging back then) was to make raids more replayable. In other words Blizzard thought that people felt bad about farming raids knowing that they couldn't get any upgrades from bosses x, y and z etc. if they already had BiS from those bosses. But did RNGforging accomplish its intended purpose?

Nope. It didn't.

By tying sockets to the RNGforging system, Blizzard resigned themselves to making RNGforging procs common lest jewelcrafters go out of business. Therein lies the problem.

If RNGforging procs are common, by the time you go from heroic into mythic you already have RNGforged heroic pieces that are better than baseline mythic pieces. Here's what Blizzard intended for the gear progression system to be like:

baseline heroic gear < RNGforged heroic gear < baseline mythic gear < RNGforged mythic gear

Here's what it actually lookes like:

baseline heroic gear < RNGforged heroic gear >= baseline mythic gear < RNGforged mythic gear

In some cases RNGforged heroic gear is even BETTER than RNGforged mythic gear thanks to the randomness of the system.

In essence you are SKIPPING the step where you go into mythic and are excited to kill new bosses because their baseline drops are upgrades for you. You go in already praying for RNGforged procs. But since RNGforged procs are so common you start getting showered in RNGforged mythic loot right away. Replayability is not improved.

In other words, the whole RNGforged system is completely pointless from a design viewpoint and serves only to frustrate people with bad RNG.

Solution?
a. untie sockets from the RNGforged system and make RNGforged pieces a lot more rare so that RNGforged procs are big "OOMPH" moments rather than "meh".
b. cap RNGforged for various difficulties so that heroic gear is never better than mythic gear.
c. scrap the whole stupid and pointless system. No one asked for more replayable raids. Non-hardcore raiders are barely done progressing the final boss by the time the new raid rolls out. Hardcore raiders would like to take a break until the next tier instead of farming. RNGforging is a pointless solution to a nonexistent problem.

[chrisisvacant]

I always wonder when I read someone say "from a design viewpoint" what the person's credentials are to suggest something so definitive.

[Super Kami Dende]

Hey look a Wilfire thread where he complains and plays the backseat developer and thinks he knows what is best for the game. What a new and unique Thread.

Protip: Titanforging was one of the best things to happen to the replayability of lower content in WoW.

[Nerovar]

Pretty sure you don't need to be an "expert" or game developer to make a point.

[XDurionX]

TF is working exactly as intended and is good for the health of the game. That´s the very reason it´s still here. And threads whining about this are not exactly original.

[Wilfire]

I always wonder when I read someone say "from a design viewpoint" what the person's credentials are to suggest something so definitive.

I think playing WoW for close to 15 years makes me qualified to say what's good design and what's not. More qualified than the developers who gave us the complete and utter trainwreck that is BfA.

[XDurionX]

I think playing WoW for close to 15 years makes me qualified to say what's good design and what's not. More qualified than the developers who gave us the complete and utter trainwreck that is BfA.

No, it really doesn`t. It just emphasizes the fact you`d be bored with the game no matter what.

[Garymorilix]

I think playing WoW for close to 15 years makes me qualified to say what's good design and what's not. More qualified than the developers who gave us the complete and utter trainwreck that is BfA.

I've been drinking coca cola for the past 20 years, I think I am more qualified to handle their business than the retards that brought us the coca cola energy drink.

[Santti]

Hey look a Wilfire thread where he complains and plays the backseat developer and thinks he knows what is best for the game. What a new and unique Thread.

Protip: Titanforging was one of the best things to happen to the replayability of lower content in WoW.

I agree.

People are seemingly stuck with this mindset, where you need to farm for BiS in the form of trying to get specific items to roll very high titanforging. You only end up getting burned-out trying to do something like that.

[Nnyco]

I think playing WoW for close to 15 years makes me qualified to say what's good design and what's not. More qualified than the developers who gave us the complete and utter trainwreck that is BfA.

Yeah... no, thats not how it works, you can play a game for 15years+ and be still clueless, as you oh so clearly prove in this thread.

[shadowmatrix]

I think playing WoW for close to 15 years makes me qualified to say what's good design and what's not. More qualified than the developers who gave us the complete and utter trainwreck that is BfA.

Gratz on playing a finished product, let us know when you can make one from the ground up.

Just because I live in a house for 20 years doesn't mean I know how to design or build one.

[Wilfire]

Yeah... no, thats not how it works, you can play a game for 15years+ and be still clueless, as you oh so clearly prove in this thread.

Care to enlighten me what I'm clueless about?

[Popastique]

Care to enlighten me what I'm clueless about?

The amount of sheer luck you need to have all your gear RNGforged in a way you can skip mythic baseline drops, first of all. And secondly, a lot of people are excited to kill mythic bosses not because of loot - just saying.

P.S. Do you mind giving an armory link to your character, or characters you played for last 15 years ?

[nRes]

Protip: Titanforging was one of the best things to happen to the replayability of lower content in WoW.

Uh... no. It's a terrible system, that induces more stress than anything else. Can't tell you how many times I've had friends rage over this.

I don't know what the purpose of the design is, but the result is that it makes you feel bad when someone gets crazy TFs left and right while you get jack. At best you're relieved when you finally do get something good. It's never a cool surprise, at least I've never seen a situation when someone got happy from this.

[Justintime328]

I think playing WoW for close to 15 years makes me qualified to say what's good design and what's not. More qualified than the developers who gave us the complete and utter trainwreck that is BfA.

You are delusional and need a break.

[Wilfire]

You are delusional and need a break.

According to your logic:

-Someone who lives in a house with a leaking roof can't say that it's badly designed because he is not an architect
-Someone who consumes poisonous food can't say that it's hazardous because he is not a chef
-Soldiers can't complain that their equipment sucks because they didn't design said equipment

I mean lol this kind of "logic" debunks itself

[Kaver]

I can't find the exact quote but around the time Throne of Thunder was current content, Blizzard stated that the intended purpose of the RNGforging system (thunderforging back then) was to make raids more replayable. In other words Blizzard thought that people felt bad about farming raids knowing that they couldn't get any upgrades from bosses x, y and z etc. if they already had BiS from those bosses. But did RNGforging accomplish its intended purpose?

Nope. It didn't.

By tying sockets to the RNGforging system, Blizzard resigned themselves to making RNGforging procs common lest jewelcrafters go out of business. Therein lies the problem.

If RNGforging procs are common, by the time you go from heroic into mythic you already have RNGforged heroic pieces that are better than baseline mythic pieces. Here's what Blizzard intended for the gear progression system to be like:

baseline heroic gear < RNGforged heroic gear < baseline mythic gear < RNGforged mythic gear

Here's what it actually lookes like:

baseline heroic gear < RNGforged heroic gear >= baseline mythic gear < RNGforged mythic gear

In some cases RNGforged heroic gear is even BETTER than RNGforged mythic gear thanks to the randomness of the system.

In essence you are SKIPPING the step where you go into mythic and are excited to kill new bosses because their baseline drops are upgrades for you. You go in already praying for RNGforged procs. But since RNGforged procs are so common you start getting showered in RNGforged mythic loot right away. Replayability is not improved.

In other words, the whole RNGforged system is completely pointless from a design viewpoint and serves only to frustrate people with bad RNG.

Solution?
a. untie sockets from the RNGforged system and make RNGforged pieces a lot more rare so that RNGforged procs are big "OOMPH" moments rather than "meh".
b. cap RNGforged for various difficulties so that heroic gear is never better than mythic gear.
c. scrap the whole stupid and pointless system. No one asked for more replayable raids. Non-hardcore raiders are barely done progressing the final boss by the time the new raid rolls out. Hardcore raiders would like to take a break until the next tier instead of farming. RNGforging is a pointless solution to a nonexistent problem.

Dude you need to slow down. There must be a limit to how many threads you can create in one month. Go outside and enjoy the nature.

[justandulas]

Hey look a Wilfire thread where he complains and plays the backseat developer and thinks he knows what is best for the game. What a new and unique Thread.

Protip: Titanforging was one of the best things to happen to the replayability of lower content in WoW.

It was also the worst thing to happen in terms of engaging players in harder/higher content.

When you can get equally geared as a mythic raider by the end of the patch by doing heroic pugs, m+, etc through TF... it’s a problem

No one wants to commit that much time and energy into high end raiding for so little rewards.

It’s why raid #’s are the lowest they’ve ever been in wows history in bfa. Don’t believe me? Check wowprogress and other similar sites and track boss kills per expac. Bfa is so far below even wod it’s hard to imagine

[Wilfire]

It was also the worst thing to happen in terms of engaging players in harder/higher content.

When you can get equally geared as a mythic raider by the end of the patch by doing heroic pugs, m+, etc through TF... it’s a problem

No one wants to commit that much time and energy into high end raiding for so little rewards.

It’s why raid #’s are the lowest they’ve ever been in wows history in bfa. Don’t believe me? Check wowprogress and other similar sites and track boss kills per expac. Bfa is so far below even wod it’s hard to imagine

Remove / devalue gear rewards from a certain type of content and participation will plummet. Mythic raiding and PvP are proof of that. Meanwhile M+ is the most played content in the game and also happens to be the most lucrative and rewarding. But people will continue to defending their faulty logic that content doesn't need to be rewarding to encourage participation to the bitter end lol.

[Rendark]

Titanforging is one of the worst things to be added to the game. It just means you can never be done with the game. Getting your best in slot items should not make you go "oh damn it" because it didn't forge anything.